[quote]Contrl wrote:
All this half-assed talk of philosophy is rather irritating, seeing as how I doubt any of you have a credible background in it and I’ve yet to see any coherent use of a legitimate philosophical approach to anything here.
Being an arrogant prick isn’t a philosophy.[/quote]
philosophical academia = Being an arrogant prick.
I thought that was the job I would get when I Graduated. Guess I was wrong.
Anyone seen I Heart Huckabee’s? It is a wonderful movie that compares and shows some of the contradictions that exist in nihilism and existentialism when treated as separate philosophies.
I always find it hard to swallow when people tell me Nietzsche or Dostoevsky were nihilists. I don�??t believe that so much insight and love for humanity could come from such a philosophy. Because of that interpretation I often refer to my own beliefs as Nihilistic Optimism.
[quote]BlakeAJackson wrote:
Anyone seen I Heart Huckabee’s? It is a wonderful movie that compares and shows some of the contradictions that exist in nihilism and existentialism when treated as separate philosophies.
I always find it hard to swallow when people tell me Nietzsche or Dostoevsky were nihilists. I don’t believe that so much insight and love for humanity could come from such a philosophy. Because of that interpretation I often refer to my own beliefs as Nihilistic Optimism.
[/quote]
I haven’t seen that movie but it sounds cool. Education through entertainment, lol.
Apparently Nietzche wasn’t a nihilist, but was critical of nihilism. He said,
“I praise, I do not reproach, [nihilism’s] arrival. I believe it is one of the greatest crises, a moment of the deepest self-reflection of humanity. Whether man recovers from it, whether he becomes master of this crisis, is a question of his strength!”
Therefore, he saw nihilism as a trial; a phase which humanity must overcome in order to have a true foundation on which to thrive.
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
Fight Club was awesome. The Movie and the Book.
Tyler Durden was a Nihilistic character.
Friedrich Nietzsche predicted that the hopeless nature of Nihilist philosophy would make its way into people’s minds.
Nietzsche considered that the ensuing philosophical struggle man would have with Nihilism would be the ultimate test of man.
Nietzsche’s Ubermensch is first man who will accept that there is no God but is also able to reject Nihilism and forge his own ethics.
The Narrator in Fight Club, in my own interpretation, is an Ubermensch. He overcomes religion. His religion wasn’t Christianity or Islam. His religion was consumerism. Letting out Tyler Durden was the narrator’s way of leaving behind his worship of the all mighty dollar and embracing Nihilism.
In the end of Fight Club, the Narrator overcomes the hopeless nature of Nihilism by shooting himself. In shooting himself, he forges his own path and makes the first independent decision in his entire life.
Tyler Durden said that self-improvement was masturbation. In the movie he appeared to be 150 pounds. He’s a loser. If he were a real Ubermensch, a real T-Man, he’d hit the weights.
Nihilism originated as an insult and is more commonly used as an insult than a real belief. [/quote]
Great post. I think that is why everyone chose to ignore it.
[quote]JohnnyBlaze wrote:
pparently Nietzche wasn’t a nihilist, but was critical of nihilism. He said,
“I praise, I do not reproach, [nihilism’s] arrival. I believe it is one of the greatest crises, a moment of the deepest self-reflection of humanity. Whether man recovers from it, whether he becomes master of this crisis, is a question of his strength!”
Therefore, he saw nihilism as a trial; a phase which humanity must overcome in order to have a true foundation on which to thrive.[/quote]
Where did you find this quote? It has been about 6 years since I read through the pocket Nietzche, but I don’t remember ever coming across that quote.
[quote]BlakeAJackson wrote:
JohnnyBlaze wrote:
pparently Nietzche wasn’t a nihilist, but was critical of nihilism. He said,
“I praise, I do not reproach, [nihilism’s] arrival. I believe it is one of the greatest crises, a moment of the deepest self-reflection of humanity. Whether man recovers from it, whether he becomes master of this crisis, is a question of his strength!”
Therefore, he saw nihilism as a trial; a phase which humanity must overcome in order to have a true foundation on which to thrive.
Where did you find this quote? It has been about 6 years since I read through the pocket Nietzche, but I don’t remember ever coming across that quote.
[/quote]
Friedrich Nietzsche, Complete Works Vol. 13
I think consumerism vs. anti-consumerism is a secondary theme in Fight Club. Notice how it ties in with the larger theme of mortality. The idea is that we anesthetize ourselves with things. We get past that teenager phase where everyone feels immortal because of biological vigor and stupidity. We start approaching thirty or approaching forty and we need a substitute.
So the marketing experts use our subconscious fear of death against us. In our denial, we sort of believe that if we can only accumulate and own enough things, somehow we will live forever. Instead of staying fluid with life and reaching and connecting with lots of people in worthwhile pursuits of charity, play, and leisure, we struggle frantically to shore up a savings and to own all the right status symbols. Like Egyptian Pharaohs, we want to be entombed with all of our things.
[quote]BlakeAJackson wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
Fight Club was awesome. The Movie and the Book.
Tyler Durden was a Nihilistic character.
Friedrich Nietzsche predicted that the hopeless nature of Nihilist philosophy would make its way into people’s minds.
Nietzsche considered that the ensuing philosophical struggle man would have with Nihilism would be the ultimate test of man.
Nietzsche’s Ubermensch is first man who will accept that there is no God but is also able to reject Nihilism and forge his own ethics.
The Narrator in Fight Club, in my own interpretation, is an Ubermensch. He overcomes religion. His religion wasn’t Christianity or Islam. His religion was consumerism. Letting out Tyler Durden was the narrator’s way of leaving behind his worship of the all mighty dollar and embracing Nihilism.
In the end of Fight Club, the Narrator overcomes the hopeless nature of Nihilism by shooting himself. In shooting himself, he forges his own path and makes the first independent decision in his entire life.
Tyler Durden said that self-improvement was masturbation. In the movie he appeared to be 150 pounds. He’s a loser. If he were a real Ubermensch, a real T-Man, he’d hit the weights.
Nihilism originated as an insult and is more commonly used as an insult than a real belief.
Great post. I think that is why everyone chose to ignore it.[/quote]
I can dig it. I like it.
The book that I read had many letters that he had written. Is it from a letter?
[quote]jack_UK wrote:
I think consumerism vs. anti-consumerism is a secondary theme in Fight Club. Notice how it ties in with the larger theme of mortality. The idea is that we anesthetize ourselves with things. We get past that teenager phase where everyone feels immortal because of biological vigor and stupidity. We start approaching thirty or approaching forty and we need a substitute.
So the marketing experts use our subconscious fear of death against us. In our denial, we sort of believe that if we can only accumulate and own enough things, somehow we will live forever. Instead of staying fluid with life and reaching and connecting with lots of people in worthwhile pursuits of charity, play, and leisure, we struggle frantically to shore up a savings and to own all the right status symbols. Like Egyptian Pharaohs, we want to be entombed with all of our things.
[/quote]
I agree and it explains the ending where he shows that this forced substitute of consumerism is from a dream of a select few and blows up the means by which they force it upon the masses. Debt.
It also shows how individualism is a tool that can be used to create a felling of being isolated and hopeless, and the need for something physical to try and fill the void this brings to our existence.
[quote]meangenes wrote:
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/stupider
Non-standard.
[/quote]
So now we are taking Urban Dictionary, home of the definition of the word “E Dawged”, over the American Heritage Dictionary?
“Nihilism is the belief that all values are baseless and that nothing can be known or communicated. It is often associated with extreme pessimism and a radical skepticism that condemns existence. A true nihilist would believe in nothing, have no loyalties, and no purpose other than, perhaps, an impulse to destroy.”
I don’t think you’re REALLY a nihilist, meangenes. For example, if self improvement is maturbation, why do you strive to improve your lifts? If you were a nihilist you’d still be a 150lb weakling.
I think there is something about the movie Fight Club that you subscribe to, but it’s not Nihilism itself - it’s something about rejecting dollar worship and the ideals foisted upon us by society, not being one of the “sheeple”, and forging our own paths.
[quote]BlakeAJackson wrote:
jack_UK wrote:
I think consumerism vs. anti-consumerism is a secondary theme in Fight Club. Notice how it ties in with the larger theme of mortality. The idea is that we anesthetize ourselves with things. We get past that teenager phase where everyone feels immortal because of biological vigor and stupidity. We start approaching thirty or approaching forty and we need a substitute.
So the marketing experts use our subconscious fear of death against us. In our denial, we sort of believe that if we can only accumulate and own enough things, somehow we will live forever. Instead of staying fluid with life and reaching and connecting with lots of people in worthwhile pursuits of charity, play, and leisure, we struggle frantically to shore up a savings and to own all the right status symbols. Like Egyptian Pharaohs, we want to be entombed with all of our things.
[/quote]
True true on all counts.
[quote]
I agree and it explains the ending where he shows that this forced substitute of consumerism is from a dream of a select few and blows up the means by which they force it upon the masses. Debt.
It also shows how individualism is a tool that can be used to create a felling of being isolated and hopeless, and the need for something physical to try and fill the void this brings to our existence.[/quote]
As above. True true true on all counts.
Finally someone reads my post.
I just feel obligated to keep people from becoming Nihilists. Why? Because they’re douchebags. I remember at my high school there was this one massive douchebag/self-proclaimed nihilist who claimed to be an intellectual, a champion golfer, a champion swimmer, a champion wrestler capable of lifting a 300 pound opponent overhead, and a ladies man. He dabbled in compulsive lying as well.
The only time I saw him in the gym was him doing lunges with 10-pound weights. If you’re reading this, Carl, you’re a huge douche-fag. I am better than you at everything forever. I want to piss in your heart.
I think most people that call themselves nihilists really aren’t. Nihilism is totally different from existentialism; it isn’t an extreme form of it.
Also, meangenes, you use slang terms like “nope” in your posts…if you knew stupider was slang, why would you correct him?
Unless, of course, you needed a red herring.
[quote]Chewie wrote:
I find it funny that when people refer to that movie as a staple of masculinity or whatever, they neglect the fact that it was written by a gay man. NTTAWWT[/quote]
Gay men can’t be masculine?
[quote]fireplug52 wrote:
Chewie wrote:
I find it funny that when people refer to that movie as a staple of masculinity or whatever, they neglect the fact that it was written by a gay man. NTTAWWT
Gay men can’t be masculine? [/quote]
Having sex with women is manly.
Having sex with men is not manly.
I don’t care what you say. That’s the way it is.
[quote]meangenes wrote:
You’re an individual. I respect that. I think?
[/quote]
I don’t think this thread is really all that entertaining or funny except for this quote. I literally lol’d at this which led to my roommate asking what’s so funny. I can’t even really explain it though.
[quote]meangene’s profile
First book was actually The Art of War, which was an eye opener. It allowed for a strategic and logical understanding to some of the questions that I asked about how to handle situations before they even arise.
I think someone is now selling a book called “Blink!” or something. Probably the same principle, except it’s about 2600 years older.
[/quote]
Have you actually read “Blink!”?
[quote]FightingScott wrote:
fireplug52 wrote:
Chewie wrote:
I find it funny that when people refer to that movie as a staple of masculinity or whatever, they neglect the fact that it was written by a gay man. NTTAWWT
Gay men can’t be masculine?
Having sex with women is manly.
Having sex with men is not manly.
I don’t care what you say. That’s the way it is. [/quote]
That’s nice.