[quote]DBCooper wrote:
… what binds us as a country is our belief in the Constitution and our cherishing of personal freedom and liberty. [/quote]
Do you imagine that Canadians, Russian, Chinese, Indian, African, or Icelandic people don’t cherish personal freedom and liberty?
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
… what binds us as a country is our belief in the Constitution and our cherishing of personal freedom and liberty. [/quote]
Do you imagine that Canadians, Russian, Chinese, Indian, African, or Icelandic people don’t cherish personal freedom and liberty?
[/quote]
Why am I wrong to feel a sense of national identity and why is it wrong for me to feel a deeper sense of sorrow as a result when Americans die? I’ve asked you this in various ways, shapes and forms several times now, but you continue to skirt the issue. Please, tell me why my sense of national identity based on an ideological commonality is wrong and why you feel this bond is based on racial and “arbitrary lines”.
THESE issues are what I addressed when I called your argument the stupidest fucking thing I’ve heard on here in a while. Stop with your sophistry and avoidance of the basic assertion you made. You accuse people of feeling sorrow on a racial basis, but THAT is the racist sentiment. It is highly racist for you to assume, or even imply, that the outpouring of grief after 9/11 was greater than it was in response to international terrorist attacks is due to “white folks” dying.
So again, why am I wrong to let my sense of national identity effect my emotions? Why is any sense of national identity wrong? Why is American nationalism based on a common belief system that disregards racial or religious lines wrong?
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
Why am I wrong to feel a sense of national identity and why is it wrong for me to feel a deeper sense of sorrow as a result when Americans die? I’ve asked you this in various ways, shapes and forms several times now, but you continue to skirt the issue. Please, tell me why my sense of national identity based on an ideological commonality is wrong and why you feel this bond is based on racial and “arbitrary lines”. [/quote]
“First, nationalism is, to me, silly because national borders are imaginary lines. Secondly, in the vast majority of cases, citizenship is totally unearned; woo, I’m so proud that I happened to be born on THIS side of the imaginary line, not THAT side! Besides I can think of more harm than good nationalism can do (the only plus is that it gives people a warm fuzzy feeling of superiority).”
Clearly I’ve skirted the issue of why I dont think nationalism is swell.
Clearly.
And its not like you and Zeb haven’t presented Americans as better than the rest of the world… just the most generous and compassionate and somehow special in their affinity for freedom (because people in other countries don’t care about liberty as much as Americans).
Not even mentioning the Americans who don’t know the first thing about the constitution and rarely think of things like freedom and liberty, or the Americans who are socialist, communist, etc. I’ll go ahead and give you a free pass on the fact that not all Americans share the same values that you feel “binds us”.
Also, the point of national borders stands: they’re imaginary lines. People can build real structures and point real guns at people to stop them from crossing those lines, but where the lines, and that the lines exist, is just a construct.
Also, Coop, you’re not wrong - just as insensitive as I am.