Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
ORLY?
How many engage in asset fortfeiture harvesting?
How many will get a “tip” from a groomed informant and break down your door?
How many police departments who have not seen a murder in the last decade have a battle rattle that makes them look like Stormtroopers?
Warrantless searches, warrantless wiretaps, data downloading from your smartphone, whether you did something or not, a GPS profile of your movements, a copy of every bank transaction for the authoritay!!eleven!!!, RICO, Patriot act, whatever…
Who do you think does that shit?
Who implements it?
Distrusting men with guns who follow even the most asinine orders is not stupid.
Thats the grown up default position. [/quote]
Sounds like you need some new tin foil for that hat…[/quote]
Also, we herded people into camps and killed them.
Yup, that is more or less what we did.
So, either we are extra evil and noone will ever be as evil as we have been EVA 111oneOMGDZ111!!!, or, maybe, a little bit of tinfoil might not be that bad an idea.
Cause there are, like, 30% of a population, everwhere, that think that a little bit of concentration camping is fucking awesome.
Plus, look back in PWI and search for the tinfoil stuff I posted 3-4 y<ears ago.
Judge me by the might of my crystal ball, will you?
WN76- thanks for keeping my head exploding while reading this thread. I have worked for a large department in a major city for several years. I have worked multiple assignments including narcotics and undercover work. I’ve definitely executive more than “a couple” of search warrants, many of them on high risk drug dealers.
The OP is a sad, regrettable situation. I doubt they are “trigger happy”. Of our 2000 sworn officers I work with, if I thought any draw pleasure from gunning down unarmed citizens… I wouldn’t want to work with them.
We do need to be held to a higher standard. And it disgusts me when a few bad apples soil our profession. Rarely do you see other professions, such as doctors or nurses, so maligned for the poor conduct of the few.
This is simply because many do not like cops. They do not like what we represent. They dislike authority. They don’t want their parents, teachers, bosses or the police to tell them what to do.
Everyone hates us until they need us.
But we accept it. I don’t complain. But don’t expect me to be warm and fuzzy.
To the arm chair QBs who cite posts from the Huffington Post: once you have worked the job for a few years and go to your first funeral of a fellow officer killed in a situation EXACTLY like the armed Granny… Then I guess to be polite, I would just advise you go he open minded and to defer to those with experience.
To be fair, I had some of your perspectives when I was in college too.
Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
ORLY?
How many engage in asset fortfeiture harvesting?
How many will get a “tip” from a groomed informant and break down your door?
How many police departments who have not seen a murder in the last decade have a battle rattle that makes them look like Stormtroopers?
Warrantless searches, warrantless wiretaps, data downloading from your smartphone, whether you did something or not, a GPS profile of your movements, a copy of every bank transaction for the authoritay!!eleven!!!, RICO, Patriot act, whatever…
Who do you think does that shit?
Who implements it?
Distrusting men with guns who follow even the most asinine orders is not stupid.
Thats the grown up default position. [/quote]
I think you watch too many movies. I have never met a person whose door was broken down by the evil “MAN.” Everything you just typed is to the EXTREME.
Are there flaws in our system, yes.
Are there crocked cops, yes.
Should we work to better our system, yes.
Is homeland security looking at my bank statement, no.
Is the average cop out to shoot people for the thrill of it, no.
Believe it or not the average employees of these agencies are just regular folks like you and I not some “Judge Dredd” look a likes.
As smart as you are you are so damn extreme sometimes it’s insane and absurd. [/quote]
Darling, would you please look into RICO and how it was started and what it is now?[/quote]
OK, I will concede that, while a valuable tool for effective law enforcement, the potential for abuse around asset forfeiture etc, is legitimate cause for concern/discussion. However, unless I’m mistaken, the “jackbooted stormtroopers” (i.e. regular patrol and tactical officers) whom everybody’s so keen on hating have pretty much nothing to do with deciding who ends up on the business end of a RICO proceeding other than they might end up helping to execute the warrants. Yet one generally doesn’t hear anybody scream “F@#K DA ASSISTANT US ATTORNEY!!” in song.
You make it sound as though any random patrol cop who happens to pass by your house and see something he likes can just call out “RICO!!!” get together 5 or 6 of his buddies, swagger over in their “overly tactical” clothing, boot your door, beat you down and take your shit. Then they will walk outside, push your kid down, steal his ice cream and the casually walk across the street and shoot an elderly woman down for a thrill.
This makes no sense. I can’t tell if you literally believe half the shit you post or if you just go way over the top to try to make a point. Either way what you are describing bears absolutely no resemblance to any real, direct experience of anyone I’ve ever had personal contact with, except those few people I know who are or have been criminals. They get hassled by police all the time for no reason. Yet to hear you describe it, this is just how it goes down on every street corner every day and anybody can be a victim at any time.
It amazing what some people perception of our omnipotent are! Wow. I guess pop culture shapes our opinions more so than facts or experiences.
Sure. I get to ride around and rob drug dealers all day. Then screw drunk DUI females at the end of my shift. And maybe randomly profile, stop and assault motorists out of boredom. Even though I have a camera, recorder and AVL on my vehicle. Not to mention brass and internal affairs that fully investigate allegations of misconduct…
Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
The whole you’ve never been in a life or death situation is BS. Most people face the kind of provocation in the school playground that would make a police officer discharge his firearm or tazer… Remember, it doesn’t have to be a life and death situation, as numerous news reports show, they just have to ‘think’ they are in danger/being threatened.
The hatred for police thing - well the flipside is that you probably haven’t been in a situation where what the police/the law is acting contrary to your interests.
[/quote]
Most people do not face provocation “on the playground” that would make a police officer discharge his firearm. That’s a stretch.
The police don’t act contrary to my interest because I don’t break the law. Ever interaction I’ve ever had has been brought because of something I did. It’s called accepting responsibility for your actions.
Look, cops make mistakes and some of them SHOULDN’T BE TOLERATED, but it’s unfair to characterize all officers as scum. First of all it’s not true and second of all it’s a pretty cowardly thing to do while hiding on the internet.
Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
The whole you’ve never been in a life or death situation is BS. Most people face the kind of provocation in the school playground that would make a police officer discharge his firearm or tazer… Remember, it doesn’t have to be a life and death situation, as numerous news reports show, they just have to ‘think’ they are in danger/being threatened.
The hatred for police thing - well the flipside is that you probably haven’t been in a situation where what the police/the law is acting contrary to your interests.
[/quote]
Most people do not face provocation “on the playground” that would make a police officer discharge his firearm. That’s a stretch.
The police don’t act contrary to my interest because I don’t break the law. Ever interaction I’ve ever had has been brought because of something I did. It’s called accepting responsibility for your actions.
Look, cops make mistakes and some of them SHOULDN’T BE TOLERATED, but it’s unfair to characterize all officers as scum. First of all it’s not true and second of all it’s a pretty cowardly thing to do while hiding on the internet.
[/quote]
Depends what playground you are on lol…
Lucky for you that the law is great for you, but maybe one day the law will change and bite you in the ass. If it all blows up in the middle east, who knows what emergency measures might be introduced in America to cope with the economic effects that will be unacceptable to you and plenty of other citizens… just look at McCarthyism which wasn’t all that long ago, the police during the black civil rights movement etc.
In the broader sense, trepidation towards the police stems from a historical awareness that they have acted as a group contrary to the interests of most people, and have been involved in corruption, nastiness etc.
In the more specific sense, it is pretty alarming that one could get shot by police officers like that Granny was - particularly for anyone who knows people who are mentally ill/have older relatives etc.
Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
The whole you’ve never been in a life or death situation is BS. Most people face the kind of provocation in the school playground that would make a police officer discharge his firearm or tazer… Remember, it doesn’t have to be a life and death situation, as numerous news reports show, they just have to ‘think’ they are in danger/being threatened.
The hatred for police thing - well the flipside is that you probably haven’t been in a situation where what the police/the law is acting contrary to your interests.
[/quote]
Most people do not face provocation “on the playground” that would make a police officer discharge his firearm. That’s a stretch.
The police don’t act contrary to my interest because I don’t break the law. Ever interaction I’ve ever had has been brought because of something I did. It’s called accepting responsibility for your actions.
Look, cops make mistakes and some of them SHOULDN’T BE TOLERATED, but it’s unfair to characterize all officers as scum. First of all it’s not true and second of all it’s a pretty cowardly thing to do while hiding on the internet.
[/quote]
Depends what playground you are on lol…
Lucky for you that the law is great for you, but maybe one day the law will change and bite you in the ass. If it all blows up in the middle east, who knows what emergency measures might be introduced in America to cope with the economic effects that will be unacceptable to you and plenty of other citizens… just look at McCarthyism which wasn’t all that long ago, the police during the black civil rights movement etc.
In the broader sense, trepidation towards the police stems from a historical awareness that they have acted as a group contrary to the interests of most people, and have been involved in corruption, nastiness etc.
In the more specific sense, it is pretty alarming that one could get shot by police officers like that Granny was - particularly for anyone who knows people who are mentally ill/have older relatives etc.
[/quote]
So, you’re saying f the police today because in some hypothetical future they might do bad things to citizenry? OK, that makes sense…
Regarding events during the civil rights movement and the oppressive regime that led up to it, society as a whole was complicit with those atrocities. Condemning todays police for the actions of police is no more reasonable than condemning “whitey” as a whole.
Edit - Also if you have friends/relatives who are either mentally ill or old enough that they can no longer see or hear properly, please do everything you can to discourage them from owning firearms.
Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
The whole you’ve never been in a life or death situation is BS. Most people face the kind of provocation in the school playground that would make a police officer discharge his firearm or tazer… Remember, it doesn’t have to be a life and death situation, as numerous news reports show, they just have to ‘think’ they are in danger/being threatened.
The hatred for police thing - well the flipside is that you probably haven’t been in a situation where what the police/the law is acting contrary to your interests.
[/quote]
Most people do not face provocation “on the playground” that would make a police officer discharge his firearm. That’s a stretch.
The police don’t act contrary to my interest because I don’t break the law. Ever interaction I’ve ever had has been brought because of something I did. It’s called accepting responsibility for your actions.
Look, cops make mistakes and some of them SHOULDN’T BE TOLERATED, but it’s unfair to characterize all officers as scum. First of all it’s not true and second of all it’s a pretty cowardly thing to do while hiding on the internet.
[/quote]
Depends what playground you are on lol…
Lucky for you that the law is great for you, but maybe one day the law will change and bite you in the ass. If it all blows up in the middle east, who knows what emergency measures might be introduced in America to cope with the economic effects that will be unacceptable to you and plenty of other citizens… just look at McCarthyism which wasn’t all that long ago, the police during the black civil rights movement etc.
In the broader sense, trepidation towards the police stems from a historical awareness that they have acted as a group contrary to the interests of most people, and have been involved in corruption, nastiness etc.
In the more specific sense, it is pretty alarming that one could get shot by police officers like that Granny was - particularly for anyone who knows people who are mentally ill/have older relatives etc.
[/quote]
Trocchi: There is a distinct difference between a police force that enforces laws set by the people and a police force that enforces laws set by the elite/over lordship/whatever. Yes, a time could come that America falls into a state of military/dictatorship control and then the law would not favor me, but this is reality not some movie, it is unlikely to happen. If it does I will be the first to become a freedom fighter.
You like to use the word “most.” You’ve used it quite a bit and I don’t see it. Maybe we define “most” differently, but in my view “most” people are not brutalized or bullied by the police. It would seem that way because every other YouTube video is of a cop being a dick, but for every video/news story there are a 100 actual events not recorded where the police help.
As far as this situation goes, one of the officers could have reached down, grabbed a pair, and tried to disarm the women, but at the end of the day we pay the police to enforce the law not risk their lives. The risk goes with the territory, but they have family too. Unless I’m incorrect she did fire, correct? What if the cops tried to disarm her and she shot a kid, would you feel the same way?
I’m not trying to argue with you at all. That’s not my intent. I just can’t stand when people, anonymously online, bash people that are put in harm’s way. “Most” people lack the conviction to approach a person with a gun let alone disarm them especially when they could more easily “disarm” them with their own gun.
Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
The whole you’ve never been in a life or death situation is BS. Most people face the kind of provocation in the school playground that would make a police officer discharge his firearm or tazer… Remember, it doesn’t have to be a life and death situation, as numerous news reports show, they just have to ‘think’ they are in danger/being threatened.
The hatred for police thing - well the flipside is that you probably haven’t been in a situation where what the police/the law is acting contrary to your interests.
[/quote]
Most people do not face provocation “on the playground” that would make a police officer discharge his firearm. That’s a stretch.
The police don’t act contrary to my interest because I don’t break the law. Ever interaction I’ve ever had has been brought because of something I did. It’s called accepting responsibility for your actions.
Look, cops make mistakes and some of them SHOULDN’T BE TOLERATED, but it’s unfair to characterize all officers as scum. First of all it’s not true and second of all it’s a pretty cowardly thing to do while hiding on the internet.
[/quote]
Depends what playground you are on lol…
Lucky for you that the law is great for you, but maybe one day the law will change and bite you in the ass. If it all blows up in the middle east, who knows what emergency measures might be introduced in America to cope with the economic effects that will be unacceptable to you and plenty of other citizens… just look at McCarthyism which wasn’t all that long ago, the police during the black civil rights movement etc.
In the broader sense, trepidation towards the police stems from a historical awareness that they have acted as a group contrary to the interests of most people, and have been involved in corruption, nastiness etc.
In the more specific sense, it is pretty alarming that one could get shot by police officers like that Granny was - particularly for anyone who knows people who are mentally ill/have older relatives etc.
[/quote]
Trocchi: There is a distinct difference between a police force that enforces laws set by the people and a police force that enforces laws set by the elite/over lordship/whatever. Yes, a time could come that America falls into a state of military/dictatorship control and then the law would not favor me, but this is reality not some movie, it is unlikely to happen. If it does I will be the first to become a freedom fighter.
You like to use the word “most.” You’ve used it quite a bit and I don’t see it. Maybe we define “most” differently, but in my view “most” people are not brutalized or bullied by the police. It would seem that way because every other YouTube video is of a cop being a dick, but for every video/news story there are a 100 actual events not recorded where the police help.
As far as this situation goes, one of the officers could have reached down, grabbed a pair, and tried to disarm the women, but at the end of the day we pay the police to enforce the law not risk their lives. The risk goes with the territory, but they have family too. Unless I’m incorrect she did fire, correct? What if the cops tried to disarm her and she shot a kid, would you feel the same way?
I’m not trying to argue with you at all. That’s not my intent. I just can’t stand when people, anonymously online, bash people that are put in harm’s way. “Most” people lack the conviction to approach a person with a gun let alone disarm them especially when they could more easily “disarm” them with their own gun.
Edit: grammar[/quote]
Yah but to be perfectly correct there are years that police officer doesn’t fall into the top ten dangerous jobs in the US. You don’t hear people talking about lets not bash the poor farmers and fisherman who put themselves in harm’s way every day doing a MUCH more dangerous job in order to promote the public good of feeding us all. You don’t get to claim special privilege because you picked a particular career and it may be as dangerous as being a logger some year.
The amount of people that are killed by police officers yearly dwarfs the amount of officers killed in duty. As well stats are very difficult to collect even though mandated by the DOJ because of deliberate obfuscation.
Yup, I don’t understand the hatred for the police. They have a hard job and then a small % do stupid shit so now they’re all criminal, evil, etc…It’s easy to criticize and say that they shouldn’t have shot from the safety of your office/house on the internet. Half the people in here have probably never been in a life/death situation. You reaction is a lot different than it is when watching/reading a story from the safety of your chair.
It’s stupid imo. [/quote]
The whole you’ve never been in a life or death situation is BS. Most people face the kind of provocation in the school playground that would make a police officer discharge his firearm or tazer… Remember, it doesn’t have to be a life and death situation, as numerous news reports show, they just have to ‘think’ they are in danger/being threatened.
The hatred for police thing - well the flipside is that you probably haven’t been in a situation where what the police/the law is acting contrary to your interests.
[/quote]
Most people do not face provocation “on the playground” that would make a police officer discharge his firearm. That’s a stretch.
The police don’t act contrary to my interest because I don’t break the law. Ever interaction I’ve ever had has been brought because of something I did. It’s called accepting responsibility for your actions.
Look, cops make mistakes and some of them SHOULDN’T BE TOLERATED, but it’s unfair to characterize all officers as scum. First of all it’s not true and second of all it’s a pretty cowardly thing to do while hiding on the internet.
[/quote]
Depends what playground you are on lol…
Lucky for you that the law is great for you, but maybe one day the law will change and bite you in the ass. If it all blows up in the middle east, who knows what emergency measures might be introduced in America to cope with the economic effects that will be unacceptable to you and plenty of other citizens… just look at McCarthyism which wasn’t all that long ago, the police during the black civil rights movement etc.
In the broader sense, trepidation towards the police stems from a historical awareness that they have acted as a group contrary to the interests of most people, and have been involved in corruption, nastiness etc.
In the more specific sense, it is pretty alarming that one could get shot by police officers like that Granny was - particularly for anyone who knows people who are mentally ill/have older relatives etc.
[/quote]
Trocchi: There is a distinct difference between a police force that enforces laws set by the people and a police force that enforces laws set by the elite/over lordship/whatever. Yes, a time could come that America falls into a state of military/dictatorship control and then the law would not favor me, but this is reality not some movie, it is unlikely to happen. If it does I will be the first to become a freedom fighter.
You like to use the word “most.” You’ve used it quite a bit and I don’t see it. Maybe we define “most” differently, but in my view “most” people are not brutalized or bullied by the police. It would seem that way because every other YouTube video is of a cop being a dick, but for every video/news story there are a 100 actual events not recorded where the police help.
As far as this situation goes, one of the officers could have reached down, grabbed a pair, and tried to disarm the women, but at the end of the day we pay the police to enforce the law not risk their lives. The risk goes with the territory, but they have family too. Unless I’m incorrect she did fire, correct? What if the cops tried to disarm her and she shot a kid, would you feel the same way?
I’m not trying to argue with you at all. That’s not my intent. I just can’t stand when people, anonymously online, bash people that are put in harm’s way. “Most” people lack the conviction to approach a person with a gun let alone disarm them especially when they could more easily “disarm” them with their own gun.
Edit: grammar[/quote]
Yah but to be perfectly correct there are years that police officer doesn’t fall into the top ten dangerous jobs in the US. You don’t hear people talking about lets not bash the poor farmers and fisherman who put themselves in harm’s way every day doing a MUCH more dangerous job in order to promote the public good of feeding us all. You don’t get to claim special privilege because you picked a particular career and it may be as dangerous as being a logger some year.
The amount of people that are killed by police officers yearly dwarfs the amount of officers killed in duty. As well stats are very difficult to collect even though mandated by the DOJ because of deliberate obfuscation.
[/quote]
So, it would be better if more police were killed on duty than bad guys were shot by police? Seriously? I would prefer it if the cops came out on top when the shooting starts. Or are you beginning with the assumption that most of those shootings were a result of either incompetence or malice on the part of police?
No my beginning assumption is that the danger of being a police officer is falsely elevated by many factors and that when shown be statistics that its really not that dangerous of a job in outcomes compared to many others LEO will move to some other tangent about why it should still have some type of elevated status.
I would say that there are more people killed by malice and police incompetence than police officers killed on a yearly basis, but there are more people killed that deserved it than both these categories. Obviously shrinking the first two categories numbers is the best goal. My first statement isn’t currently provable though as police departments who are responsible for providing data about officer related killings deliberately obfuscate.
Too IronDwarf: Wow what a story.Im from Canada,and citizen’s don’t normally own hand-gun’s.The exception being law inforcement type’s etc.Police actually have to get special permission to bring their service revolver/9.m.m. home.
The old woman unfortionately contruibuted to her terrible situation by leaving the safety of her home.The 1st-shot scared off the intruder and police where on route,but she persued the suspect and when the polce arrived,they made a terrible mistake. thank’s for your story johnny
[quote]groo wrote:
Yah but to be perfectly correct there are years that police officer doesn’t fall into the top ten dangerous jobs in the US. You don’t hear people talking about lets not bash the poor farmers and fisherman who put themselves in harm’s way every day doing a MUCH more dangerous job in order to promote the public good of feeding us all. You don’t get to claim special privilege because you picked a particular career and it may be as dangerous as being a logger some year.
The amount of people that are killed by police officers yearly dwarfs the amount of officers killed in duty. As well stats are very difficult to collect even though mandated by the DOJ because of deliberate obfuscation.
[/quote]
I never said it’s the most dangerous job. You basically made my point though. You never hear people bash loggers, but cops are constantly bashed. Honestly I think a lot of the bashing comes from people that are pissed off they got a speeding ticket for going 85 in 60 zone. It’s typical Iâ??m entitled to do whatever I want crap. I don’t agree with that. If you follow the law the majority of the time the police will leave you alone. It’s that simple. These videos/examples are the exceptions not the rule.
[quote]groo wrote:
No my beginning assumption is that the danger of being a police officer is falsely elevated by many factors and that when shown be statistics that its really not that dangerous of a job in outcomes compared to many others LEO will move to some other tangent about why it should still have some type of elevated status.
I would say that there are more people killed by malice and police incompetence than police officers killed on a yearly basis, but there are more people killed that deserved it than both these categories. Obviously shrinking the first two categories numbers is the best goal. My first statement isn’t currently provable though as police departments who are responsible for providing data about officer related killings deliberately obfuscate.
[/quote]
I don’t know if anyone claimed that LEO in North America is an extremely dangerous job, statistically. I cut down big ass trees in urban settings for a living. Statistically speaking this is one of the higher risk activities going. Prior to that I trained as a commercial diver for off-shore applications, also hazardous work. In both jobs (more so the tree thing if only by virtue of longer service) I found myself in numerous life threatening situations and, thankfully, through good planning, good judgment, blind luck and divine intervention I always made it through pretty much OK.
This is not at all the same as voluntarily engaging another human being intent on doing you harm. Especially when that person is only a threat to you because you just drove across town at 100mph to protect somebody else who is a complete stranger to you from this person. Dealing with human aggression is totally different from dealing with the risk of injury or death as the result of an industrial accident. Some similarities in mindset and skillset may exist (situational awareness, improvisational problem solving etc.) but when you get down to brass tacks, it’s two totally different animals.
Not putting LEO on a pedestal at all, just saying it’s a rare mix of skills and temperament that makes for a good cop. When you add in all the “non-tactical” stuff (i.e. conflict resolution, community resource referrals, effective verbal and written communication skills etc) it’s now even harder to find and/or develop all those skills in one person. It’s a tough job and very few have what it takes to do it well and yet many feel free to criticize and even flat out hate those who are out there doing it.
[quote]groo wrote:
No my beginning assumption is that the danger of being a police officer is falsely elevated by many factors and that when shown be statistics that its really not that dangerous of a job in outcomes compared to many others LEO will move to some other tangent about why it should still have some type of elevated status.
I would say that there are more people killed by malice and police incompetence than police officers killed on a yearly basis, but there are more people killed that deserved it than both these categories. Obviously shrinking the first two categories numbers is the best goal. My first statement isn’t currently provable though as police departments who are responsible for providing data about officer related killings deliberately obfuscate.
[/quote]
I don’t know if anyone claimed that LEO in North American is an extremely dangerous job, statistically. I cut down big ass trees in urban settings for a living. Statistically speaking this is one of the higher risk activities going. Prior to that I trained as a commercial diver for off-shore applications, also hazardous work. In both jobs (more so the tree thing if only by virtue of longer service) I found myself in numerous life threatening situations and, thankfully, through good planning, good judgment, blind luck and divine intervention I always made it through pretty much OK.
This is not at all the same as voluntarily engaging another human being intent on doing you harm. Especially when that person is only a threat to you because you just drove across town at 100mph to protect somebody else who is a complete stranger to you from this person. Dealing with man aggression is totally different from dealing with the risk of injury or death as the result of an industrial accident. Some similarities in mindset and skillset may exist (situational awareness, improvisational problem solving etc.) but when you get down to brass tacks, it’s two totally different animals.
Not putting LEO on a pedestal at all, just saying it’s a rare mix of skills and temperament that makes for a good cop. When you add in all the “non-tactical” stuff (i.e. conflict resolution, community resource referrals, effective verbal and written communication skills etc) it’s now even harder to find and/or develop all those skills in one person. It’s a tough job and very few have what it takes to do it well and yet many feels free to criticize and even flat out hate those who are out there doing it.
[quote]groo wrote:
No my beginning assumption is that the danger of being a police officer is falsely elevated by many factors and that when shown be statistics that its really not that dangerous of a job in outcomes compared to many others LEO will move to some other tangent about why it should still have some type of elevated status.
I would say that there are more people killed by malice and police incompetence than police officers killed on a yearly basis, but there are more people killed that deserved it than both these categories. Obviously shrinking the first two categories numbers is the best goal. My first statement isn’t currently provable though as police departments who are responsible for providing data about officer related killings deliberately obfuscate.
[/quote]
I don’t know if anyone claimed that LEO in North American is an extremely dangerous job, statistically. I cut down big ass trees in urban settings for a living. Statistically speaking this is one of the higher risk activities going. Prior to that I trained as a commercial diver for off-shore applications, also hazardous work. In both jobs (more so the tree thing if only by virtue of longer service) I found myself in numerous life threatening situations and, thankfully, through good planning, good judgment, blind luck and divine intervention I always made it through pretty much OK.
This is not at all the same as voluntarily engaging another human being intent on doing you harm. Especially when that person is only a threat to you because you just drove across town at 100mph to protect somebody else who is a complete stranger to you from this person. Dealing with man aggression is totally different from dealing with the risk of injury or death as the result of an industrial accident. Some similarities in mindset and skillset may exist (situational awareness, improvisational problem solving etc.) but when you get down to brass tacks, it’s two totally different animals.
Not putting LEO on a pedestal at all, just saying it’s a rare mix of skills and temperament that makes for a good cop. When you add in all the “non-tactical” stuff (i.e. conflict resolution, community resource referrals, effective verbal and written communication skills etc) it’s now even harder to find and/or develop all those skills in one person. It’s a tough job and very few have what it takes to do it well and yet many feels free to criticize and even flat out hate those who are out there doing it.
Edited.
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Very well articulated. Good post.[/quote]
Thanks ID. Kind of you to say so.
Too bad you quoted me before I got a chance to re-edit some of the errors I missed the first time I edited