Lost Opportunity

disclosure: I have been a headhunter and recruiter for the last 7 years focused on sales people. Recruiters, AKA people who work directly for a company and only source candidates for that company but to not manage the actual job function/department are at a huge disadvantage because they don’t have any authority to make a hiring decision.

Often, they are just glorified secretaries or HR people who don’t know what they are doing and fuck things up. I try to avoid talking to these people both when I am looking for a job and when I am headhunting for those companies because they add little value and suck up time and resources from everyone. Unfortunately, they “come with the territory” sometimes so I do my best to be pleasant but efficient in either scenario.

Headhunters, AKA, independent recruiters, AKA people that identify and attract talent are professionals. They can be very effective, but they are a rarity. Also, anyone who has convinced someone to leave their current job to go to their client knows that it is a life changing decision and treats it as such. They both have the level of human kindness their parents gave them, if that is worth anything. A “recruiter” usually doesn’t give a fuck about you, only about their bonus or keeping their job. A headhunter doesn’t give a fuck about you either, they work for their clients, not you. It’s you job to give a fuck about you.

[quote]Phoenix44e wrote:
A couple months I mentioned that I was in the process of being hired for a new job. It didn’t pan out, but at the time I was glad because as the hiring process went on it became more and more evident that there were internal issues with the company that would soon rear their head.

About a week after deciding to turn down the offer I was contacted by a headhunter about an available position at a logistics company. The initial phone interview was a disaster, I ended up having to reschedule and it seemed that the “hiring manager” never really got over that.

However, I impressed the sales manager and the owner enough that I was able to continue interviewing. This process has been going on for about a month now. I’ve gone to 4 different interview/meeting (totaling about 18 hours of my time), I’ve sat in on one of their Monday morning sales meetings (3hrs), I’ve had lunch with the sales manager (few hours), and I’ve even been texting one of the managers back and forth throughout.

Last week I finally told them that it was time shit or get off the pot. They told me I had the job and wanted to have me come back in to go over the compensation package. When I did we figured out that we were about 8k in compensation apart. One reason being is that the recruiter lied and told me that the salary was higher than what it is.

After hashing out the compensation (they didn’t budge at all really, I think they gave me a candy bar) yesterday, they told me to take a night decide and we’ll speak tomorrow. I called them today to tell them I wanted to take the job and they told me that they were pulling the offer. They said it didn’t seem like a right fit and they didn’t think I proved to them that I could get the job done.

I just spent a month of my life (in the busy season of my current job) going back and forth with this company, they gave me an offer, and even wanted to coach me through my resignation process at my current company to ensure that it went smoothly enough. And then out of fucking no where the guy tells me it’s not gonna happen now, maybe contact them at the end of the summer.

Honestly, I’m fucking pissed and I don’t really know where to go from here. I can’t believe that I have to go out and look for a job all over again, go through all that same bullshit again. Has this ever happened to anyone? [/quote]

A couple points here. First, the initial phone interview “was a disaster.” Was it a disaster because of you, because of the interviewer, or because of logistics, scheduling, etc.? If you have a phone interview for a sale position and you don’t or can’t connect personally with the interviewer it’s a clear sign you are not right for them and they are not right for you.

Secondly, if they were apprehensive on a candidate (the OP in this case) but still moved forward, there was some weird dynamics happening there. Big red flag! Likely the OP was the latest topic in an internal turf war. Sadly, this happens a lot.

Third, if the OP’s employment was not subject to a turf war, it sounds like they were “keeping him warm” in case no one better came along (the slow-ball way, lunches, extra interviews, emails, texts, etc.) but someone better did come along. As a headhunter, I’ve been caught in the middle of these and have usually forced a decision because I personally hate stringing people along because I hate being strung along myself.

There is another possibility here. OP, They may have decided that they were going to hire you, but your tone or attitude talked them out it. Based on the tone of your post, if that was your attitude with them, impatient, somewhat arrogant and almost rude, then maybe they decided you weren’t worth the effort.

All of the above have happened to me in my own career. I am a talented headhunter but at times I have been arrogant and lost because of it. In fact, I am currently self-employed because I don’t get along with the typical corporate drone attitude. I learned about the turf war and the slow play years later at a conference almost back to back. The real answer is, shit happens, the only thing you can do is learn from the experiences, but life goes on.

There are a lot of shitty people in my business, just like there are a lot of shitty sales people, engineers, etc., but they usually don’t last. A lot of people hate headhunters, I’ve been called every name in the book and many more behind my back but the reality is even though I work for my client companies, everyone I move makes more money because they took my call…and I have a Jaguar, a Saab (winter car), and a 72 Cadillac D’Ville (weekend car), a purebred English Bulldog, a house, a hot, busty wife way out of my league, because I am good at recognizing talent and convincing people to make a life changing move.

Good jobs rain from the sky. Job is dodging rain

[quote]TheKraken wrote:
A couple points here. First, the initial phone interview “was a disaster.” Was it a disaster because of you, because of the interviewer, or because of logistics, scheduling, etc.? If you have a phone interview for a sale position and you don’t or can’t connect personally with the interviewer it’s a clear sign you are not right for them and they are not right for you.

Secondly, if they were apprehensive on a candidate (the OP in this case) but still moved forward, there was some weird dynamics happening there. Big red flag! Likely the OP was the latest topic in an internal turf war. Sadly, this happens a lot.

Third, if the OP’s employment was not subject to a turf war, it sounds like they were “keeping him warm” in case no one better came along (the slow-ball way, lunches, extra interviews, emails, texts, etc.) but someone better did come along. As a headhunter, I’ve been caught in the middle of these and have usually forced a decision because I personally hate stringing people along because I hate being strung along myself.

There is another possibility here. OP, They may have decided that they were going to hire you, but your tone or attitude talked them out it. Based on the tone of your post, if that was your attitude with them, impatient, somewhat arrogant and almost rude, then maybe they decided you weren’t worth the effort.

All of the above have happened to me in my own career. I am a talented headhunter but at times I have been arrogant and lost because of it. In fact, I am currently self-employed because I don’t get along with the typical corporate drone attitude. I learned about the turf war and the slow play years later at a conference almost back to back. The real answer is, shit happens, the only thing you can do is learn from the experiences, but life goes on.

There are a lot of shitty people in my business, just like there are a lot of shitty sales people, engineers, etc., but they usually don’t last. A lot of people hate headhunters, I’ve been called every name in the book and many more behind my back but the reality is even though I work for my client companies, everyone I move makes more money because they took my call…and I have a Jaguar, a Saab (winter car), and a 72 Cadillac D’Ville (weekend car), a purebred English Bulldog, a house, a hot, busty wife way out of my league, because I am good at recognizing talent and convincing people to make a life changing move. [/quote]

In for pics of Saab and hot, busty wife!!

Kraken: Would you be willing to answer some questions about your field?

This is a bit off-topic, but I just have to say that I love how experts crawl out of the woodwork here at T-Nation for just about any question that gets put forward.

“Get a Life” will definitely be my go-to information source if I ever find myself with an unconscious prostitute in my trunk and no plan for what to do next.

[quote]comus3 wrote:
Good jobs rain from the sky. Job is dodging rain
[/quote]

what do you mean?

[quote]angry chicken wrote:
If they flipped on you like that, then you are probably lucky you didn’t end up working for them. Imagine how poorly they’d treat you once they got their hooks in. You dodged a bullet AND gained experience for your next interview process.[/quote]

+1 Not getting this job is a win.

[quote]twojarslave wrote:
This is a bit off-topic, but I just have to say that I love how experts crawl out of the woodwork here at T-Nation for just about any question that gets put forward.

“Get a Life” will definitely be my go-to information source if I ever find myself with an unconscious prostitute in my trunk and no plan for what to do next.

[/quote]

Where’s Orion when you need him, lol…

[quote]TheKraken wrote:
disclosure: I have been a headhunter and recruiter for the last 7 years focused on sales people. Recruiters, AKA people who work directly for a company and only source candidates for that company but to not manage the actual job function/department are at a huge disadvantage because they don’t have any authority to make a hiring decision.

Often, they are just glorified secretaries or HR people who don’t know what they are doing and fuck things up. I try to avoid talking to these people both when I am looking for a job and when I am headhunting for those companies because they add little value and suck up time and resources from everyone. Unfortunately, they “come with the territory” sometimes so I do my best to be pleasant but efficient in either scenario.

Headhunters, AKA, independent recruiters, AKA people that identify and attract talent are professionals. They can be very effective, but they are a rarity. Also, anyone who has convinced someone to leave their current job to go to their client knows that it is a life changing decision and treats it as such. They both have the level of human kindness their parents gave them, if that is worth anything. A “recruiter” usually doesn’t give a fuck about you, only about their bonus or keeping their job. A headhunter doesn’t give a fuck about you either, they work for their clients, not you. It’s you job to give a fuck about you.

[quote]Phoenix44e wrote:
A couple months I mentioned that I was in the process of being hired for a new job. It didn’t pan out, but at the time I was glad because as the hiring process went on it became more and more evident that there were internal issues with the company that would soon rear their head.

About a week after deciding to turn down the offer I was contacted by a headhunter about an available position at a logistics company. The initial phone interview was a disaster, I ended up having to reschedule and it seemed that the “hiring manager” never really got over that.

However, I impressed the sales manager and the owner enough that I was able to continue interviewing. This process has been going on for about a month now. I’ve gone to 4 different interview/meeting (totaling about 18 hours of my time), I’ve sat in on one of their Monday morning sales meetings (3hrs), I’ve had lunch with the sales manager (few hours), and I’ve even been texting one of the managers back and forth throughout.

Last week I finally told them that it was time shit or get off the pot. They told me I had the job and wanted to have me come back in to go over the compensation package. When I did we figured out that we were about 8k in compensation apart. One reason being is that the recruiter lied and told me that the salary was higher than what it is.

After hashing out the compensation (they didn’t budge at all really, I think they gave me a candy bar) yesterday, they told me to take a night decide and we’ll speak tomorrow. I called them today to tell them I wanted to take the job and they told me that they were pulling the offer. They said it didn’t seem like a right fit and they didn’t think I proved to them that I could get the job done.

I just spent a month of my life (in the busy season of my current job) going back and forth with this company, they gave me an offer, and even wanted to coach me through my resignation process at my current company to ensure that it went smoothly enough. And then out of fucking no where the guy tells me it’s not gonna happen now, maybe contact them at the end of the summer.

Honestly, I’m fucking pissed and I don’t really know where to go from here. I can’t believe that I have to go out and look for a job all over again, go through all that same bullshit again. Has this ever happened to anyone? [/quote]

A couple points here. First, the initial phone interview “was a disaster.” Was it a disaster because of you, because of the interviewer, or because of logistics, scheduling, etc.? If you have a phone interview for a sale position and you don’t or can’t connect personally with the interviewer it’s a clear sign you are not right for them and they are not right for you.

Secondly, if they were apprehensive on a candidate (the OP in this case) but still moved forward, there was some weird dynamics happening there. Big red flag! Likely the OP was the latest topic in an internal turf war. Sadly, this happens a lot.

Third, if the OP’s employment was not subject to a turf war, it sounds like they were “keeping him warm” in case no one better came along (the slow-ball way, lunches, extra interviews, emails, texts, etc.) but someone better did come along. As a headhunter, I’ve been caught in the middle of these and have usually forced a decision because I personally hate stringing people along because I hate being strung along myself.

There is another possibility here. OP, They may have decided that they were going to hire you, but your tone or attitude talked them out it. Based on the tone of your post, if that was your attitude with them, impatient, somewhat arrogant and almost rude, then maybe they decided you weren’t worth the effort.

All of the above have happened to me in my own career. I am a talented headhunter but at times I have been arrogant and lost because of it. In fact, I am currently self-employed because I don’t get along with the typical corporate drone attitude. I learned about the turf war and the slow play years later at a conference almost back to back. The real answer is, shit happens, the only thing you can do is learn from the experiences, but life goes on.

There are a lot of shitty people in my business, just like there are a lot of shitty sales people, engineers, etc., but they usually don’t last. A lot of people hate headhunters, I’ve been called every name in the book and many more behind my back but the reality is even though I work for my client companies, everyone I move makes more money because they took my call…and I have a Jaguar, a Saab (winter car), and a 72 Cadillac D’Ville (weekend car), a purebred English Bulldog, a house, a hot, busty wife way out of my league, because I am good at recognizing talent and convincing people to make a life changing move. [/quote]

The only explanation that I received about the headhunter was that she is currently no longer working for the company. Don’t know if that was related to me or not. I assume if she lied to me she’s lied to people before, maybe it caught up with her.

The first phone interview imo was a disaster because the interviewer was cold, rude, insulting, and abruptly hung up the phone on me. The only reason why I continued pursuing the job was because he was only the hiring manager and would have no contact with me afterwards.

I obviously didn’t have the same attitude with the company I wanted to work for as I do on the internet. Didn’t think that really needed explaining at all.

IMO it feels like they were keeping me warm and someone else came along. I understand this happen a lot, but it just sucks to actually experience it.

Kraken not sure if you want to continue in pm but I am still looking for a new job. You said your job was in hiring sales people…any specific field?

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

[quote]twojarslave wrote:
This is a bit off-topic, but I just have to say that I love how experts crawl out of the woodwork here at T-Nation for just about any question that gets put forward.

“Get a Life” will definitely be my go-to information source if I ever find myself with an unconscious prostitute in my trunk and no plan for what to do next.

[/quote]

Where’s Orion when you need him, lol…[/quote]

Funny, I found myself starting, “Well…”…

Quite frankly, if she is only unconscious, no harm done, no?

In case that anyone wonders, you return her to the sender.

Get her back to her pimp or escort agency (more likely)…

If you had anything to do with her current condition (idiot!!) drive her to a parking garage, lean her against a pillar, inform her handlers where she can be found.

I drove for an escort agency, we only wanted her back in one piece.

But, as a somewhat Nice Guy ™ who drove for such an agency, that, I want.

And I am going to get that.