[quote]on edge wrote:
Oh yeah, one more thing, what food can do for you what Creatine can do for you? That’s right, none.[/quote]
Beef and other meats.
I, for one, don’t notice the effects of creatine.
[quote]RSGZ wrote:
on edge wrote:
Oh yeah, one more thing, what food can do for you what Creatine can do for you? That’s right, none.
Beef and other meats.
I, for one, don’t notice the effects of creatine.[/quote]
While that is true, you would have to eat a very large amount of beef per day to get 5g creatine.
btw- you may not notice the effects of creatine, but studies have shown that it can decrease cholesterol levels 
Thanks bud. I’m especially curious how many here on this thread use HOT-ROX.
[quote]Rhino Jockey wrote:
Ken Rose wrote:
Guys, this is kinda on target. Can anyone point me to a thread of opinions of the most important/effective Biotest products? Maybe a top 5 list?
Thanks in advance.
Ken
There was this thread not too long ago…
http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/diet_performance_nutrition_supplements/top_5_supplements_1 [/quote]
[quote]RSGZ wrote:
on edge wrote:
Oh yeah, one more thing, what food can do for you what Creatine can do for you? That’s right, none.
Beef and other meats.
I, for one, don’t notice the effects of creatine.[/quote]
There’s a small percent who are “non responders”. For the rest of us, eating enough beef or herring or whatever to get the amount of creatine you can get from a 1/2 teaspoon would be impossible.
[quote]on edge wrote:
RSGZ wrote:
on edge wrote:
Oh yeah, one more thing, what food can do for you what Creatine can do for you? That’s right, none.
Beef and other meats.
I, for one, don’t notice the effects of creatine.
There’s a small percent who are “non responders”. For the rest of us, eating enough beef or herring or whatever to get the amount of creatine you can get from a 1/2 teaspoon would be impossible.[/quote]
You can get 2-4g or creatine by eating a pound of beef and a pound of any other creatine rich meat. It’s not exactly impossible, actually very achievable, but this is why we have supplements - simplicity and convenience.
[quote]Makavali wrote:
CLaw, was the supp HOT-ROX? I know I get nauseous too on that. I always need to eat or drink SOMETHING with it otherwise it’s goodbye whatever meal I had last.[/quote]
Hey, guy. I’m not CLaw, but I thought I’d throw my unsolicited advice into the ring. This happened to me when I first switched to the new HOT-ROX, and I also noticed it when I tried the original Spike Shooters. From that I deduced it was the yohimbine that I was responding to in that fashion.
Let me ask you this: did you follow the label directions, starting with one pill 2x per day instead of two? I found that gradually ramping up over the course of a few weeks from one pill in the morning to two pills twice per day is generally the most effective way to circumvent this. You also might want to consider doing what I do now, which is one HOT-ROX and one Carbolin 19 twice per day.
Also, don’t ever take the pills on an empty stomach and then immediately train. If you do that, you can kiss your peri-workout fluids goodbye.
(edit: the automatic spell-corrector’s got a bug)
For the record, I never left T-Nation. This is what happened:
On 4/9/09, I tried to post in the T-Cell under the “Sh*t Supplements” thread and brought up several no longer available Biotest products that I didn’t think were effective. I also mentioned other companies’ products as well (HMB, Vanadyl Suflate, Chromium Picolinate and Androstendione).
Soon after, I received a PM from a mod saying that my post would not be allowed through and he refuted several of the supplements I mentioned.
It was soon after that when I realized my posts were no longer going through (on various forums and threads) and my PM’s and profile were also locked and no longer working.
I kept trying to post and PM the mods and technical guys asking why my account was locked or why it appeared I had been “banned.” No one responded and this is what pissed me off. All I wanted was a response or an explanation of what was going on and why I was being blocked.
Several days later, I set up a second account (Renegade Nate) and began posting again. However, those posts were being moderated and some were not being let through. At the same time, I was PMing several people (mods and staff) asking for an explanation about my Nate Dogg account and why it was locked. It didn’t take long before my PM’s were locked once again - without an explanation.
At this point, I was beginning to get angry because I have been a member of the site since I found it in December 1998 and contributed greatly to the forums since they first began (and went through several revisions/upgrades). I have also spent THOUSANDS on Biotest supplements. In fact, my current level doesn’t even show the amount of money I spent on Biotest supplements before I started buying them directly from the web site. Previously, I purchased through a variety of other vendors in order to save money.
And I have recommended Biotest supplements to friends, family, other lifters, on the T-Nation forum and on my blog. So I couldn’t understand why this was happening when I never had an issue like this before.
On Thursday, April 23, I was on Facebook and saw a status update by Dave Tate saying he was going to be working with T-Nation/Biotest. When I saw the update, I responded with:
[quote]Hey, since you’re working with them, can you do me a favor and ask them why they’ve banned me (Nate Dogg) from posting or PMing. It appears that they have done this to other people as well.
It’s too bad considering that we have been life-long customers since the beginning and are Level 4-5 on their customer list and have spent THOUSANDS on their products.[/quote]
Dave Tate responded:
And to that I responded as I have said already above. This also brought in some posts from others that had something similar happen and to those who said their posts have been heavily moderated.
I had no idea that Kuz had similar issues or that Rainjack had left (although, he left for other reasons which I don’t know about).
The following day, others from T-Nation who had read the status updates on Dave Tate’s FB page chimed in and soon after, this thread was started.
When this thread was started, I tried to post twice. The first time under my Nate Dogg account (it didn’t go through) and the second time under my Renegade Nate account.
Mod Jump’N Jack responded soon after that message was sent in and said he would forward it to the higher ups - my message was placed on hold at the time (but I see that it eventually went through).
Then, on Friday afternoon I received a call on my cell phone coming from Colorado (as a result of that post on this thread). The first thing I thought was, “Is Biotest calling me?”
I answered the call and said, “This is Nate.”
The caller responded, “Hi Nate, this is Jared from Tim Patterson’s office. He would like to speak with you.”
I was quite surprised to be getting a call from Tim Patterson! Jared patched me through with Tim, and we spoke for an hour about a variety of things.
He explained the business, the web site and the supplements and how the company is built on blue-collar guys like him, TC, me and most of T-Nation’s customers and forum members. He spoke about the supplements and how much money and time goes into them and how they are made for elite athletes and then brought to market to be sold on T-Nation.
Eventually (Tim does go off on tangents a bit and talks a lot), he addressed what was going on with my account.
He said that T-Nation has a “restricted list” that contains approximately 20 names of people that are watched or restricted on what they say on the forums because they cause problems through a variety of ways. Some bad mouth the supplements, some hate on various groups of people (gays, blacks, etc.) and some attack the contributors personally and, in some instances, by showing up at their door step in person.
As TC noted earlier in this thread, he and Tim both agree that the three things they won’t tolerate are those three points.
As we talked further, he apologized that I was put on this list. And we talked about the post I was trying to send through about those Biotest supplements.
Now, although I completely understand and respect Tim’s reasoning, ideas and the fact that he is running a business, I didn’t completely agree that my post (about supplements Biotest no longer sells or has sold for a while) was really a problem.
However, Tim said that even though one post may not be an issue, it’s the subsequent posts that follow mine or go on other tangents or downright attack Biotest that he has a problem with.
We spoke about how in the past, I could talk about a flavor of a particular Biotest supplement that I liked or didn’t like, and it wasn’t a problem. Or about negative side effects I’ve had using certain products and it wasn’t a problem. Tim doesn’t agree that even those things should be discussed as everyone will have different tastes and side effects and that by bad-mouthing the product, it can hurt sales or the business.
Again, I understand and respect Tim’s perspective. I just don’t fully agree on some of those points. I think it’s important that if someone asks about a particular flavor that you can tell them! Or that if you experienced certain side effects, that you are able to tell them.
But that wasn’t so much of a big deal and I understand that they have to protect the business.
I explained to Tim that the biggest problem I had was the fact that no one would respond to my PM’s or let my posts go through. It was not handled in a timely fashion, and all I wanted was a simple PM from a mod (which I have received in the past if they did have a problem with one of my posts or needed to get some feedback from someone higher up to make sure it was cool to send through).
So Tim did apologize for that and took me off the restricted list and gave me full unmoderated posting once again. He even gave me his direct phone number and email address so I could come to him directly if I have issues with the forum or questions/feedback on the supplements.
He asked if things were cool with me (most likely checking to make sure I’m not one of those crazy people who plans to physically harm a contributor or owner of T-Nation or show up on their door step), to which I said, “Tim, things are cool with me. All I wanted was an explanation, and you called me and gave me that and handled things.”
He also talked supplements with me and said that he wanted to send me some stuff to try out including a new supplement not yet available. He also asked what I use and said he’d send me some more (Metabolic Drive and Surge). He gave me a protocol to follow and wants me to follow up with him on it as well.
After an hour, I thanked him for calling me and taking time to address the issues I had and for giving me direct access to him in case I have issues in the future.
Another thing that I appreciated from Tim (besides him actually calling me to straighten things out), was the fact that he wants me (and others) to contribute to the forums. That’s what the forums are for, and he knows the value in having regular guys contribute to this community that has been established.
Now, for those of you who have had issues with moderation, it is either related to the three things Tim and TC won’t let go through (hate toward others, hate toward contributors or hating on the supplements) or as a result of this mod that they let go.
Also, TC and Tim know what is and isn’t acceptable, but not all of the mods are on the same page. So that is probably another reason why some things go through and others don’t or are edited. Obviously, this is something they need to be more consistent with and hopefully, not as strict when it comes to basic questions or posts about the supplements.
I expect moderation on things to keep the business running and keep the forum going smoothly, but I certainly did not expect it on products Biotest no longer sells - which usually shows that the products were improved or something else was shown to be more effective or better in some way.
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD!
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD![/quote]
Hahaha…solid.
Welcome back Nate, glad to see this thread helped get everybody on the same page. Now we can go back to making fun of you and Kuz.
Thanks for clearing this all up Nate. That’s great that Tim was able to call and talk to you on the phone. Just something else that this company will do for their loyal customers that others won’t do.
Enjoy that new supplement from Biotest; ya bastard! lol
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD![/quote]
LOL!
Hmm…I’ll think about that as my first ebook to help get my own business going!
my 2 cents(and i am a fat bastard, so take with a grain of salt)
protein powder is just quick calories, most of the big companies have reasonable quality ingredients, pick one that makes you retch the least and go with it.
i had a series of labs done over 2 year period, and saw NO difference in my triglyceride levels when i was taking a ton of fish oil(including Flameout) than when i decided to stop taking for nearly 6 months. i also saw no noticeable difference in my workouts, and body composition, nor the aches in my joints were no better or worse.
now here is the kicker, Alpha Male, i took this (correctly as the label stated) for about 6 weeks, and i went from no morning wood to having it EVERY MORNING) and i got pretty jacked, so much that coworkers were noticing a visible diff. now before i take a full gulp of the koolaid, i will say i cleaned my diet up a bit during this period too, and started a very different routine than i had been doing for many many years( pl/ol stuff to a more traditional bb split high volume thing).
[quote]UtahLama wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD!
Hahaha…solid.
Welcome back Nate, glad to see this thread helped get everybody on the same page. Now we can go back to making fun of you and Kuz.[/quote]
Bring it!
Just watch out, as SWR is back as well. We short guys stick together.
[quote]Nate Dogg wrote:
a whole lot of interesting stuff[/quote]
Wow. Good to have you back, Nate, and good on Tim for doing what he did…that’s awesome.
[quote]Nate Dogg wrote:
UtahLama wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD!
Hahaha…solid.
Welcome back Nate, glad to see this thread helped get everybody on the same page. Now we can go back to making fun of you and Kuz.
Bring it!
Just watch out, as SWR is back as well. We short guys stick together.[/quote]
150lbs of pure muscle. You beast!
Thanks! It’s good to be back after trying to post for almost two weeks and getting blocked the whole time!
It’s too bad all those other posts didn’t go through. I had some good feedback on 5/3/1 and a few other threads.
[quote]RSGZ wrote:
Nate Dogg wrote:
UtahLama wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD!
Hahaha…solid.
Welcome back Nate, glad to see this thread helped get everybody on the same page. Now we can go back to making fun of you and Kuz.
Bring it!
Just watch out, as SWR is back as well. We short guys stick together.
150lbs of pure muscle. You beast![/quote]
Just wait until you see me get my ‘swole’ on!
And with some of these supplements Tim is sending me (Metabolic Drive, Surge Workout Fuel, Surge Recovery, L-Leucine) and this new supplement not yet released (and no, it’s not Anaconda), I’m going to be JACKED!
[quote]RSGZ wrote:
Nate Dogg wrote:
UtahLama wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD!
Hahaha…solid.
Welcome back Nate, glad to see this thread helped get everybody on the same page. Now we can go back to making fun of you and Kuz.
Bring it!
Just watch out, as SWR is back as well. We short guys stick together.
150lbs of pure muscle. You beast![/quote]
Hey, that’s a lot of weight for Smurfs. All they eat is cupcakes and Smurfette…and let me tell you, the latter is “less filling”.
[quote]Nate Dogg wrote:
UtahLama wrote:
Professor X wrote:
Damn, Nate. You need a publisher, a great title and an awesome cover picture and your novel is GOLD!
Hahaha…solid.
Welcome back Nate, glad to see this thread helped get everybody on the same page. Now we can go back to making fun of you and Kuz.
Bring it!
Just watch out, as SWR is back as well. We short guys stick together.[/quote]
I live in SWR’s neck of the woods so I can personally find him and make fun of his near midget stature. Also if he is fat, I can make fun of him for resembling a bowling ball. Hopefully this will be enough motivation for him to get back to the gym and re-dedicate himself to being a powerlifter.
Welcome Back Buddy.
V
P.S. The last Mod (I think her picture was in TC’s recent Atomic Dog, second one down the right hand side I believe) who moderated me told me she was going to spank me for being a bad boy. TC just when I thought you couldn’t sink any lower, you go ahead and do something like this…
… And TOTALLY REDEEM YOURSELF!