London Riots

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
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[quote]wsk wrote:
We’ll soon see if the politically correct are so ‘tolerant’ that they’ll tolerate their own destruction.

This is sinister:

@Dark Ninja:
Yes, the rioters aren’t exclusively black, but why are they overwhelmingly young black males?
And why are the riot hot-spots the areas of London with the highest concentration of black people? And why are
the areas outside London to which the rioting is spreading, Toxteth and Handsworth, those with the highest concentration of black people outside London?

[/quote]

It’s people black and ethnic communities are poorer than white communities. Hardly surprising considering they have only immigrated to England in the last century, and have not really had time to economically expand. The poorer sections of society have nothing to lose through rioting and much to gain. The you had the labour government with the welfare state making the poor think they were entitled to all kinds of things they didn’t deserve.

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Last night’s Bristol riot:

I know St Pauls pretty well. The park the reporter is speaking from is always full of prostitutes of an evening and drugs are sold from the front door of many surrounding houses.

10 minute video of the St Pauls riot:

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Petrol bombs now? WTF!

I wouldnt be surprised if laws on policing are seriously revised after this.

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Anyone who says this isn’t a race issue should come spend a night down here in Hackney, or indeed any other area where the riots are going on. It is almost exclusively black youths, although plenty of black youths are vocal in condemning the rioting. Plenty of the black community has been vocal in condemning the violence. It is a small subsection of the black community that is causing all the trouble. But it is predominantly black gangs that are looting and rioting. If you want to see for yourself then head to any of the areas where these riots are going on. It is no coincidence that they are kicking off in predominantly black areas.

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[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:
Anyone who says this isn’t a race issue should come spend a night down here in Hackney, or indeed any other area where the riots are going on. It is almost exclusively black youths, although plenty of black youths are vocal in condemning the rioting. Plenty of the black community has been vocal in condemning the violence. It is a small subsection of the black community that is causing all the trouble. But it is predominantly black gangs that are looting and rioting. If you want to see for yourself then head to any of the areas where these riots are going on. It is no coincidence that they are kicking off in predominantly black areas. [/quote]

QFT

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[quote]wsk wrote:
We’ll soon see if the politically correct are so ‘tolerant’ that they’ll tolerate their own destruction.

This is sinister:

@Dark Ninja:

Yes, the rioters aren’t exclusively black, but why are they overwhelmingly young black males?
And why are the riot hot-spots the areas of London with the highest concentration of black people? And why are
the areas outside London to which the rioting is spreading, Toxteth and Handsworth, those with the highest concentration of black people outside London?

None of those questions is racially offensive. I’m just looking for answers.

[/quote]

Why are you asking me? Lol. Do I speak for the London black youth now? Let’s just see when the poor white kids rebel too and I can also try to ask myself why and why…

Seriously. I am quite amused.

This is how I understand the situation. Trouble started in Tottenham. Lot of blacks live there, yes. And the troublemakers wanted to showcase their anger and riot. Then other young black males from south London who have nothing to do with what happened in North London decided to cause trouble because they apparently hate the police.

Personally I didn’t get it. The guy who was killed was a fucking gang member. A scum. It’s not like he’s been a law abiding citizen beaten to death by 10 white cops and set on fire. So why burn people’s businesses and attack police when what happened in the North has nothing to do with the South? Then, they bring that fucking excuse, ‘police killed one of our own’ shit. Fucking moronic! The guy who was killed was scum! goddamit. There are blacks out there who didn’t give a shit about him. I didn’t give a fuck about him. He’s dead. One motherfucker down, more innocent lives saved.

People were saying only young blacks from the poor areas are causing trouble. But even in Hackney, you could see white kids in those gangs. But what they didn’t expect was that it’ll spread out in other well off areas. You have white kids there too, joining in. In camden, Clapham etc…

Anyway, they are youth. They are bored, they have nothing better to do with their time and think they can get away with anything. Read that BBM thing Bambi posted. Police is outstretched and the kids think it is time to go and cause trouble. It’s just the social background they’ve grew up and live in. If the area is a high concentration of whatever race, if the kids have no respect for anyone, they’ll go and fuck shit up.

That Birmingham video, in the link, shows it.

We had this kind of riots in France a few years back. But not on this scale. The kids were mostly Algerians descendants and some Black Africans. French kids joined in too. They were all from poor background, parents were useless at controlling them and the kids were angry with the police and want to fuck everything up for no reason.

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Hope:

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I agree with you DarkNinja, for the most part. But as a ‘poor white kid’ from Hackney, I would say that there is a particular problem with a subculture amongst the black community in the areas the riots are kicking off. There is a particular issue with black gangs that glamorise “ghetto culture” and like to feel they are persecuted by the police.

They don’t seem to appreciate that if you glamorise a particular lifestyle with such negative assosciations, you are bound to get aggro. Most of the white kids in these gangs talk more like a jamaican than most jamaicans, despite never having been anywhere more exotic than bethnal green.

It certainly wasn’t my intention to demonise all black people, and I hope that isn’t how my post cam across, but there is no ignoring that these riots are being carried out predominantly by black youths who idolise gang culture, topped up by some equally moronic, equally unrepresentative douchebags who are white.

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[quote]LondonBoxer123 wrote:
I agree with you DarkNinja, for the most part. But as a ‘poor white kid’ from Hackney, I would say that there is a particular problem with a subculture amongst the black community in the areas the riots are kicking off. There is a particular issue with black gangs that glamorise “ghetto culture” and like to feel they are persecuted by the police. They don’t seem to appreciate that if you glamorise a particular lifestyle with such negative assosciations, you are bound to get aggro. Most of the white kids in these gangs talk more like a jamaican than most jamaicans, despite never having been anywhere more exotic than bethnal green. It certainly wasn’t my intention to demonise all black people, and I hope that isn’t how my post cam across, but there is no ignoring that these riots are being carried out predominantly by black youths who idolise gang culture, topped up by some equally moronic, equally unrepresentative douchebags who are white. [/quote]

And I agree with what you are saying. I don’t find your post offensive.

And this is why I talked about the social background. There are some young blacks in the area where I live but I’ve never seen them hanging in the playground at 2am selling and smoking drugs. And none of them were out last night hurling petrol bombs at people’s homes or businesses.

Obviously when you live in poor areas, if your parents are not tough with you, you’ll end up with the bad crowd. And of course you’ll give the cops reason to stop and search you ( that’s what they called being persecuted…? SMH)

But I had a friend’s brother and his mates stopped on their way back from football practice. The police apparently see a group of young blacks and automatically assume they are bad grape. Meh, I can understand the resentment at times but I truly believe that if you have nothing to hide, stop with the attitude, let the cops do their job (especially here in the UK, where the police are fucking PC) and then just walk away.

Jeez, I ramble too much…

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On an unrelated note DarkNinjaa I didn’t realise you were a Brit!

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I’m not Brit, no. I live in London at the moment :slight_smile:

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@Dark Ninja: Good comments. It’s fundamentally about a breakdown in discipline.
@Londonboxer: You’re right about how these kids glamorise lawlessness and adopt a lingo that is alien to them. Look at how many times they call the police "feds’ in the messages that are being posted online.

I live at the edge of a bad estate and the area is already being put on lockdown for tonight.

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  1. We live in a society where we “want”. Most people however don’t engage in violence to get what they want. I am sure the 99.9% of us are guilty of downloading stuff of the internet but that is as “risky” a thing as people are willing to do. The real question is why are people prepared to go to these lengths to do/get what they want?

  2. Self entitlement. People feel they “deserve” everything they “want”. This comes in several forms. “I’m poor. I deserve it!”, “I work hard but get nowhere. I deserve it!”, " I’m (insert label of choice here). I deserve it!" - The problem with this logic is that most people don’t deserve even half what they think they do.

  3. Lack of true parental guidance. None of us would’ve gone out and done stuff like this because our parents taught us better, our parents scared us, and we worried about disappointing them.

  4. No fear of repercussions. Most of the kids know that they will get nothing more than a token slap on the wrist. If there was a real and serious punishment for them perhaps they would think twice about doing it. Offenders, young ones especially, should be rehabilitated and returned to society as productive members. If they refuse to change and intentionally continue to be non productive and destructive member s of society they should be denied the right to live in that society.

  5. Lack of options in life. If people feel they have nothing to hope for/aim for/achieve then they take what they can get, when they can get it. This, coupled with point 4 make for a terrible combination.

  6. No concept of what it really means to struggle in life. I guarantee that of you shipped any of the rioters out to Gaza, the DRC, or North Korea and let them experience real hardship, they would come back quite changed.

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I remember living in Camberwell for a time and what shocked me was the youth violence/ stabbings.

Here in my city, youll have shootings, but its generally drug/crime related as opposed to wanton random violence.

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I have only recently been catching up on these developments, so forgive my ignorance.

But this was all caused over the shooting death of one gang member? I understand how the the smallest of sparks can set these powder kegs alight depending on where those sparks happen, but I had not realized that London and its surrounding areas was a powder keg.

One would think with cameras on every streetcorner like Big Brother has, they’d be able to better control this.

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[quote]spiderman739 wrote:

  1. We live in a society where we “want”. Most people however don’t engage in violence to get what they want. I am sure the 99.9% of us are guilty of downloading stuff of the internet but that is as “risky” a thing as people are willing to do. The real question is why are people prepared to go to these lengths to do/get what they want?

  2. Self entitlement. People feel they “deserve” everything they “want”. This comes in several forms. “I’m poor. I deserve it!”, “I work hard but get nowhere. I deserve it!”, " I’m (insert label of choice here). I deserve it!" - The problem with this logic is that most people don’t deserve even half what they think they do.

  3. Lack of true parental guidance. None of us would’ve gone out and done stuff like this because our parents taught us better, our parents scared us, and we worried about disappointing them.

  4. No fear of repercussions. Most of the kids know that they will get nothing more than a token slap on the wrist. If there was a real and serious punishment for them perhaps they would think twice about doing it. Offenders, young ones especially, should be rehabilitated and returned to society as productive members. If they refuse to change and intentionally continue to be non productive and destructive member s of society they should be denied the right to live in that society.

  5. Lack of options in life. If people feel they have nothing to hope for/aim for/achieve then they take what they can get, when they can get it. This, coupled with point 4 make for a terrible combination.

  6. No concept of what it really means to struggle in life. I guarantee that of you shipped any of the rioters out to Gaza, the DRC, or North Korea and let them experience real hardship, they would come back quite changed.[/quote]

Good points. Especially no.6 these kids think they’ve got it so hard but dont realize how lucky most of them are.

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[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
I have only recently been catching up on these developments, so forgive my ignorance.

But this was all caused over the shooting death of one gang member? [/quote]

Of course not.

Moral decay

Inculcated government dependancy running into the reality of “we’re running out of money.”

Angry, dysfunctional, self-entitled folks who’d burn their world down for both the sport of it, and looting rights.

They should go home, do the drugs they purchased, under their roofs, watch their cable or satellite TV, maybe play some x-box, or text some friends, and contemplate the famine Somalia is seeing.

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[quote]Sloth wrote:

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
I have only recently been catching up on these developments, so forgive my ignorance.

But this was all caused over the shooting death of one gang member? [/quote]

Of course not.

Moral decay

Inculcated government dependancy running into the reality of “we’re running out of money.”

Angry, dysfunctional, self-entitled folks who’d burn their world down for both the sport of it, and looting rights.
[/quote]

I was hoping more for someone from England who knows the situation and isn’t blatantly biased.

You know…so not you.

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[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
I have only recently been catching up on these developments, so forgive my ignorance.

But this was all caused over the shooting death of one gang member? I understand how the the smallest of sparks can set these powder kegs alight depending on where those sparks happen, but I had not realized that London and its surrounding areas was a powder keg.

One would think with cameras on every streetcorner like Big Brother has, they’d be able to better control this. [/quote]

They’re rioting because they want peace in the Middle East.