Don’t understand why after increasing my Arimidex 7 weeks ago from .5mg to 1mg EOD that my lab tests came in at 28.5 up from 27.1 last month. The range for the test method is up to 56 so the target of 22 is what I’m looking for.
I have not changed my Testosterone does. It is still 50mg ever 3.5 days or 100 mg per week. My HCG also has not changed from 250iu EOD.
My Total testosterone was 770 ng/dl and free testosterone was 258. I’m not so concerned about those numbers since I gave the blood sample later 12 to 24 hours later than I have in the past from my last injection.
I just really don’t understand how increasing my Arimidex dose by 100% did not lower my E2 level. I told my doctor that I thought I should go up to 1.5 mg EOD and she had no problem with that but I’m a little reluctant. On the other hand, this the same thing that I said 7 weeks ago after increasing it from .5 to 1.0 mg. It when from 24.7 pg/ml to 27.1. I said fuck it lets try doubling it and see what happens. Hell it went from 27.l to 28.5. What the fuck is wrong with me.
I feel great, I could have more energy but then I always feel that way, my libido is good but could be better, but then I always feel that way. I have felt that my orgasims where not as strong lately so that could be the higher E2. Been getting moring hardons but not consistently so that suggest I’m not at the sweet spot. May have been there but don’t think I’m there right now and the E2 numbers suggest not. Have not been eating, or drinking any more or less than previously. Work outs have been getting better. I’m just dumb founded
Didn’t you determine that your test range was different for free test. The range on the test results for free testosterone reads 50 - 210 pg/mL. I don’t understand all of this well enough to really make any strong statements so I really don’t know why my numbers are where they are but I have not heard of anyone on testosterone injections not getting their numbers up.
I did have some low numbers on the gell for some unknow reason. If your free test is that low on 300ml/week injected, you really need to see a specialist. I’m going to John Hopkins in Baltimore if I can find an endo there that will see me. I also plan on seeing doctor Kristler in Michigan
4/29/09
I started out prior to HRT at
Total = 321 (range 260 to 1000 pg/ml)
Free = 89.1 (50-210 pg/ml)
we did not run E2
7/25/09 several months of androgell 5gm daily
total testosterone was 296pg/ml (same range as above)
Free testosterone was 78.1
E2 was 41.1
I think I was really feeling the high E2.
and for some reason I was not absorbing the topical testosterone very well. Just as well since the stuff cost a rediculus amount. I also did a 24 hour urin test that showed some unexplainable Non detect level for E2. Getting my insurance to cover that was also a pain so I’ve been back at the local blood lab.
9/15/09 6 weeks into injectable testosterone at 50mg bi-weekly and .25mg Anastrozole EOD (iron dragon product)
and no HCG
E2=26.9 ng/mL
Total T=994 ng/mL
Free T= 334.2 mg/mL (ranges all the same as above)
Felt good and think things were feeling right but my nuts were shrinking. Doctor finally gave me the perscription for HCG. I increased my Anastrozole to .375 mg EOD and figured all should be well.
11/17/09 Same testosterone 100mg/week, (bi weekly injections) .375mg anastrozole EOD and 250ius of HCG EOD
Total T=809 ng/mL
Free T=273 ng/ml
E2 = 24.7
I was questioning how well I was feeling just prior to the test but the results suggest I should probably not have been noticing anything significant. At that time my doctor gave me the presciption for Arimidex and I increased my dose to .5mg EOD
1/12/2010
Total T=902
Free T=266.7
E2 = 27.1
Increased Arimidex to 1mg EOD and again I did not change anything else.
3/23/2010
Total T=770
Free T=258.5
E2 = 28.5
Been feeling good but like I said above, I always remember having felt better from time to time so I’d say there has been no dramatic change in mood, energy level, libido. The only thing I can really say for sure is that spontanious erections and morning wood have been better and have been worse so I think the E2 of 28 is accurate and not ideal for me.
So now we are going to try 1.5 mg of Arimidex EOD. So when is this stuff going off patend. This could get expensive.
“25mg Anastrozole EOD (iron dragon product)” So you switched to adex because insurance would cover it ? I would think the iron dragon clone would be cheaper so I am confused by that.
My free T is ridiculous and yes the labs have different ranges but it was the same ng/l or whatever, same concentration within the same volume so what they attach to that as a normal range is just commentary the way I understand it.
The 50 mg twice weekly of T are you going IM or sub-Q ?
Looks like what would happen if the lab was switched from LabCorp to Quest or the lab method was changed in that fashion. There are two major different methods available and the reported values are 4 time higher for one.
Some guys gave limited responses as a result of low dopamine levels. Finding good QOL can be like pealing an onion.
We also see guys who are on large dose hCG not able to control E2 levels with anastrozole.
Some on transdermals may have high T–>E conversion rates in there skin and the high local T levels in the skin can make competitive AIs ineffective.
We also see guys who are on large dose hCG not able to control E2 levels with anastrozole - again, a limitation of a competitive AI.
I spoke with the lab to day and they have been running the 17 beta test method each time. The works was done by a local lab not Quest or LabCorp. So the method and location of the test was the same. The time of day that I gave the sample was the same.
Regarding the Arimidex rather than the resurch compound, I figured that my doctor would rather have had me on the Arimidex and since she was willing to give the precription and the insurance was willing to cover most of it, I should try it. But you are right that it would be cheaper to purchase the resurch compound.
Is it reasonable to assume that ones response to an AI like Arimidex can change or fluctuate. Could I have been spending part of past 7 weeks at lower E2 levels and then had a spike for some reason. Do E2 levels change over the period of a day or days or does it take weeks to move that number up or down. I assumed it was weeks but maybe I’m wrong.
I am still curious if E2 levels would go up if I postponed my Testosterone injection by 12 hours. If anything I would have thought it would have meant less testosterone in the system at blood test time and likely less E2. This assumes that E2 doses fluctuate several percentage points through out the T shot cycles.
For example, Iâ??m on a 3.5 day injections schedule. While we know the testosterone levels rise and fall over the time period. The question is, do the E2 levels rise and fall over the same time period or do they steady. If anyone has seen any studies on the subject, I would love to read up on the subject.
T–>E2 aromatization rates [different from levels] are driven by the instantaneous FT or Bio-T levels. Serum E2 levels are also changing and are a balance of accumulated produced E2 and accumulated removal by the liver. So it is a bit complicated and peaks of serum E2 will lag T peaks. In any case, you are better off with any peaks of anastrozole to be aligned with peaks of T. Again, if injections are more frequent, T levels are very steady.
I have read about taking your AI and HCG on the two days following your Testosterone shot rather than EOD. For example, t shot Saturday morning, AI and HCG Sunday and Monday. T shot on Tuesday night, AI and HCG Wednesday and Thursday.
I am assuming this protocol is recommended for the purpose of dealing with the peaks from the bi weekly testosterone injections. Iâ??m not sure how the HCG plays in but it does seem to make sense with respect to the AI.
hCG twice a week is practice that evolved prior to the 2005 research re 250iu EOD. Adex EOD levels are smooth enough that timing is really not an issue.
It makes sense to make routines simple and do T EOD as well. Then there are T spikes to be concerned about.
T+hCG is really about maintaining the health of the testes, not making significant amounts of T or any timing issues.
KSMan, so are you suggesting T shot EOD rather than twice a week. I have actually been doing the twice a week schedule based on what I have read here and possibly based on what I have learned from you. If you think EOD is preferable then I will probably try it.
If on this EOD schedule, would you inject T and HCG one day and take your AI the next day. It would make sense. What are you thoughts.
Is there any documented evidence that Arimidex can loose potency during it’s shelf life. I have read some posts on another board suggesting that it can get old. I have a hard time believing this but maybe I’m wrong. It might explain how my numbers went up to 28 after increasing my dose to 1mg EOD
GeoBob: No magic, try things and what feels best or is easiest to live with is the winner. I would not do interlaced EOD. Just do everything at once on EOD. Simplicity has value.
With EOD, there are overlapping T ester deposits releasing T and the levels are quite steady. With steady T levels, timing AI becomes a non issue.
Thanks for the advice I will do that. I did some checking about the shelf life of arimidex and it something like 60 months so I still cannot account for how 1mg EOD did not drop my E2 levels. I am taking 1.5 EOD and it has been a week and do not think I am feeling anything related to Low E2. I will keep posting. The only feeling I have that is new, is the bottom of my feet seem to be sore. I have not been running or doing anything physical that would account for it.