[quote]kneedragger79 wrote:
I hope America follows her roots and NOT the popular vote!! I know my vote will never change because Rom Paul can lead this country better than any other prospect on the table. Including the independents ; )[/quote]
LOL…and it’s idiotic comments like this that will hand Obama a second term. Really…really…stop it.[/quote]
I’m curious, what is it about Dr. Paul that you do not like? Monetary policy? Foreign policy? I’ve read a few of his books and have to say that they were great. I love that he’s so willing to throw the bullshit flag on asshats from both sides of the political spectrum. It’s awesome to see an elected politician at the federal level, call for such strict adherence to the constitution. The United States would be in a much better place IMHO if we had a helluva lot more Ron Pauls in the congress.
That being said, While I love his message, I don’t hink he’s the right messenger. Something about him just seems to turn people off. [/quote]
HE IS NOT ELECTABLE!!!
[/quote]
True. But honestly I don’t think any of the current crop is. Palin, Paul, Gingrich are not going to make it. Somebody we have never heard of yet, lying in the wings is the only chance.
Obama learned from Clinton, he sold his idealism for power, moving centrist is the way. Quite frankly it’s going to take somebody plenty dynamic to unseat him. Unless that person is lying in the wings…
Now I know what you’re thinking, but I was born in Canada and am not eligible, sorry.
[quote]Mufasa wrote:
Give me some thoughts on Palin’s low number’s guys.
Is she popular “among the masses”, but just not among those who attend this convention?
2)With the juggarnaut that was the “Tea Party Express”; why do you think that she didn’t even speak at the convention?
What is her best “role” in the upcoming primaries/election in 2012?
Is she all “sound bites and rhetoric”, with no real substance?
I’m thowing it out to you guys, because she remains the proverbial “enigma wrapped in a paradox” to me.
One thing I’m sure of:the GOP cannot ignore her.
(Or can they?)
She leaves me scratching my head…
Mufasa
[/quote]
Palin would lose badly to Obama, badly. The press would take her down and keep her down the entire campaign. And in all honesty we can do better than her.
Without even bringing liberals and Obama into the discussion…she scored low numbers among attendees at a conservative convention.
And speaking of Obama…each passing days gains him greater and greater experience as it relates to U.S. policy (both domestically and internationally) and the myriad of challenges we face.
I bet he is chomping at the bit to debate any and everyone the GOP throws at him.
(eye roll) Yeah, okay a 76 year old Congressman with a whiny voice is going to take down Obama.
[/quote]
You are correct, which just reinforces that the Amerikan voter is an imbecile. Substance means nothing to the Amerikan voter. It should not make any difference whether Ron Paul looks like “gramps” or has a whiny voice. He stands for the principals the U.S was founded on. Unlike all the other politicians who just give these principles lip service.
This is why I don’t even bother voting in National elections. It’s a waste of time. The two clowns that win their party’s nomination are just puppets of business interests anyway.
[quote]Dustin wrote:
You are correct, which just reinforces that the Amerikan voter is an imbecile. Substance means nothing to the Amerikan voter.[/quote]
I’m not even sure it’s that. How much trouble should each individual voter go through to put in the time and research into figuring out which candidate is best? And this means getting a grounding first in politics, economics, history, etc. After all of this is said and done, they cast a vote which is 1 of millions and, therefore, counts for very little. Voters are rationally ignorant because the cost of really looking into it exceeds their individual contribution.
It makes sense for them to focus on smaller things like how the candidate looks if they aren’t going to put the time in.
Probably true, but I think I’ll cast a vote for Paul (if he runs), if for nothing more than fun and to see what happens. I know I won’t be voting for anyone else who is currently being rumored to run.
Elect the least harmful bastard that can actually win. All politicians are bastards. Even Paul.[/quote]
Ron Paul really isn’t a politician that fits the paradigm of today’s politicians.
He is more about adherence to constitutional principle than trading favors for the accumulation of power.[/quote]
We already had this discussion. Ron Paul plays the pork game to just like all other congressmen. He just deceives those who fervently wish to believe in that one honest man.
I think I’m trying to understand the “Love/Hate” relationship that conservatives seem to have with Palin. Electable or not…she still influences a large block of voting people.
Ron Paul…
My problem is that it’s one thing to point out problems…it’s quite another beast entirely to come up with practical ways to solve them.
The devil always is in the details.
Mufasa
( P.S. Where the heck is JohnR in this discussion?)
(eye roll) Yeah, okay a 76 year old Congressman with a whiny voice is going to take down Obama.
[/quote]
You are correct, which just reinforces that the Amerikan voter is an imbecile. Substance means nothing to the Amerikan voter. It should not make any difference whether Ron Paul looks like “gramps” or has a whiny voice. He stands for the principals the U.S was founded on. Unlike all the other politicians who just give these principles lip service.
This is why I don’t even bother voting in National elections. It’s a waste of time. The two clowns that win their party’s nomination are just puppets of business interests anyway.
[/quote]
Very nice wrap up of all the bullshit in America, I feel the same. Sad day when the best option has no shot of winning. I hate it, but no way Paul can win this thing, especially against Obama.
(eye roll) Yeah, okay a 76 year old Congressman with a whiny voice is going to take down Obama.
[/quote]
You are correct, which just reinforces that the Amerikan voter is an imbecile. Substance means nothing to the Amerikan voter. It should not make any difference whether Ron Paul looks like “gramps” or has a whiny voice. He stands for the principals the U.S was founded on. Unlike all the other politicians who just give these principles lip service.
This is why I don’t even bother voting in National elections. It’s a waste of time. The two clowns that win their party’s nomination are just puppets of business interests anyway.
[/quote]
Okay aside from the laugh that I had over your last sentence you’ve made some good points. But it has always been like that since the media age began. During the first televised debate John Kennedy beat Richard Nixon. But those who heard that debate on the radio thought that Nixon had beat Kennedy. This was the first tell tale sign that looking at a candidate was pretty much going to be the deciding factor for most of America. Like it or not the best looking, most polished charismatic candidate will win. And that is certainly NOT Ron Paul
Very nice wrap up of all the bullshit in America, I feel the same. Sad day when the best option has no shot of winning. I hate it, but no way Paul can win this thing, especially against Obama.[/quote]
I feel the same way. Just imagine Paul trying to debate against Obama. Obama is a great speaker. Sure, Paul wants to run this country the way it was supposed to, but All the idiots will just listen to Obama’s big words and big promises. Plus, virtually all minorities will vote for Obama and are scared of old white people.
Very nice wrap up of all the bullshit in America, I feel the same. Sad day when the best option has no shot of winning. I hate it, but no way Paul can win this thing, especially against Obama.[/quote]
I feel the same way. Just imagine Paul trying to debate against Obama. Obama is a great speaker. Sure, Paul wants to run this country the way it was supposed to, but All the idiots will just listen to Obama’s big words and big promises. Plus, virtually all minorities will vote for Obama and are scared of old white people.[/quote]
Yes on all points, I think this is what Zeb is getting at as well. Watching Paul speak, he comes off as a loon, which is crazy since he is the closest thing to what the country was founded upon. Shows how much this nation has changed over the years. Then throw in the “old white man” on top and it’s over. Sad But True.
From the little I have seen, I am really liking Paul Ryan (R-WI). Does anyone have the scoop on him? He seems likes the Repub. version of Obama (not in his politcs; but the being young, well spoken, new to scene, etc.) Is he a legit threat to get behind?
Elect the least harmful bastard that can actually win. All politicians are bastards. Even Paul.[/quote]
Ron Paul really isn’t a politician that fits the paradigm of today’s politicians.
He is more about adherence to constitutional principle than trading favors for the accumulation of power.[/quote]
We already had this discussion. Ron Paul plays the pork game to just like all other congressmen. He just deceives those who fervently wish to believe in that one honest man. [/quote]
He follows the constitution and does not vote for spending. It’s his job to put earmarks into the bills even though he votes against them. Heck, he is so honest he even tells people he’ll put their projects into the bill but that he will vote against it.
That’s not playing pork games. That’s making sure the executive branch does not get to spend the money when it is Congress’ job to decide how it gets spent – per the constitution. EVERY congressman should be doing what Paul does.
You still don’t get it. But that’s ok – what ever helps you reconcile your worldview.
[quote]dk44 wrote:
From the little I have seen, I am really liking Paul Ryan (R-WI). Does anyone have the scoop on him? He seems likes the Repub. version of Obama (not in his politcs; but the being young, well spoken, new to scene, etc.) Is he a legit threat to get behind? [/quote]
On good days he’s got the lingo down but he won’t budge on militarism – like most the neocons he sides with. He’s still for expanding the US empire overseas which is contrary to a conservative foreign policy. He talks about lowering the budget but he still does not get where most of the budget gets spent.
Besides that he doesn’t have a record to back up his rhetoric.
ZEB I am not trying to be some dumb ass kid. FYI I am 31 years old, I realize that is still pretty young. I just still have hope for the future. shrug I realize Paul might be old like McCain, yet how is he un-electable, besides age? I do doubt there will ever be a perfect candidate who is young and dashing (I realize many fell for our current President and his ideas), yet has the experience of the US Government. Impossible to have that kind of leader. No one person in the Government wants to trim back the whale of the Government and yet I know that needs to happen.
IMHO simply endorse the candidate of your choosing. Whether your choice is on the table for election, choose the one of lesser two evils and hope for the future. Chose the candidate that has your views which are very polarized. I know how I vote during every primary and election and I vote at the local level. How many people around the world would give their right hand for a right we all have as American citizens?! I do hope you are right and someone who can win somehow finds his way to the front. Yet right now we have Paul and I KNOW the man is worlds above and beyond Bam Bam.
Just my .02
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]kneedragger79 wrote:
Stand by your comment ZEB, why threw an insult towards something I hope this country should have in her still? Then you storm off towards the bottom of the page. LOL Can Paul be that GOOD you don’t have that much hope for him, or even this country and what she needs?
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]kneedragger79 wrote:
I hope America follows her roots and NOT the popular vote!! I know my vote will never change because Rom Paul can lead this country better than any other prospect on the table. Including the independents ; )[/quote]
LOL…and it’s idiotic comments like this that will hand Obama a second term. Really…really…stop it.[/quote]
[/quote]
Paul is unelectable. I’ve said it many times and don’t know how else to say it. I know his message is appealing, but find a candidate who can actually win who has that same message. Paul will NEVER become President. Nor will he ever get the republican nomination. This endless pushing of Paul is tiresome and quite frankly immature. I’d like to see all the 20 something’s who are in love with Ron Paul back a candidate who can actually win.
[quote]kneedragger79 wrote:
ZEB I am not trying to be some dumb ass kid. FYI I am 31 years old, I realize that is still pretty young. I just still have hope for the future. shrug I realize Paul might be old like McCain, yet how is he un-electable, besides age? [/quote]
How many things have to make him un-electable before his is not able to be elected? I’d say just one. And you have said age, okay let’s use that one. He’s too old. Simple. Let’s now move on to a candidate who can win. Isn’t that the smart thing to do? You said he’s too old and you’re right. Let’s end it right there. We won’t talk about his whiney voice, or the fact that he’s only a Congressman (they don’t get elected President have you noticed), or the fact that he comes off as an old crank, oh wait is that the age thing again? Oh well…let’s just forget about him.
It won’t happen. And I’m not looking for the ideal young and dashing candidate. I’ll take a little older and dashing (like Ronald Reagan). Either way Paul aint it.
No you do not have Paul right now. No one has Paul, you can think that you have Paul the way some did before the 08’ election, but I said then that he won’t win and he didn’t even come close. Will not come close this time so you DO NOT have Paul. What you have is hope in your heart for a better America - Good for you that’s nice. But Paul will NEVER be elected not now not ever. So maybe just maybe you should pin your hopes on someone who is close to Paul in thinking who can actually get elected - what a crazy thought huh?
And by the way I was not calling you a kid when I said that I wish the 20 something’s would get behind another candidate. It’s just that I know Paul has a huge 20 something following. Nothing to do with you.
It has hit me once again that there is no percentage in telling the world that Paul can’t win. I did it 4 years ago was right and not one of the Paul supporters said to me “well you really called that.”
If someone wants to think Paul can win, well go ahead since he WILL NOT get the republican nomination there is no danger of him being on a major ticket so really wish all you want guys.
I’m out of this thread as it is nauseating trying explain reality to political novices who think Paul is going to beat Obama.
