Question, is Masteron less suppressive than Testosterone?
I’m thinking to lower the Testosterone slightly and replace with some Masteron, this may give me a double bonus of lowering oestrogen and decreasing suppression also, leaving me in a better position to regain fertility.
Thoughts?
SB
Yes, but not to the extent you are looking for
Estradiol is more suppressive to HPTA axis relative to androgens alone, progestins even more so.
The second you consume an androgenic load (sex hormones) that is otherwise higher relative to what you would produce naturally, the negative feedback occurs. You have AAS induced hypogonadism, your new natural set point I assume isn’t going to be great.
What is your sperm count? Is it ZERO? What is your current fertility protocal? I was told before I was put on TRT that there was a good chance I’d be unable to father a child… But my physician at the time wasn’t comfortable getting me a sperm count for god knows what reason. Apparently I was too young to deal with the prospect of knowing I’d be unable to father a child… So instead the assumption of “probably” hanging over my head as opposed to a definitive diagnosis is better?
To note, both of my parents had serious troubles with fertility. I’d never say it so them, but given all the complications incurred through them trying to get pregnant and the health status of both ensuing children + pregnancy complications, massively premature births and more… I think they would have been better off adopting.
I don’t suppose this is an avenue you’d be willing to look into?
Some AAS are more suppressive than others. But when you look into legitimate replacement dosages (or higher), near full suppression or the HPTA will become apparent. You can try masteron, but it’s not great for lipids, tends to have androgenic sides and it doesn’t hold a candle to testosterone in terms of sheer potency
You could try something like 62.5mg testosterone 62.5 mg masteron… Not that I’m recommending it as I’m not a physician and drostanolone isn’t manufactured for human use anymore. However it is still FDA approved, theoretically you could get a script in the US and fill it at a compounding pharmacy as in VERY, very rare instances the drug may still hold therapeutic significance for ER+ inoperable breast cancer within postmenopausal women.
I still have an old textbook that references drostanolone propionate as a treatment for this aforementioned condition. Protocal is 100mg 3x/wk for a looonnng time.
You say you get a libido increase from HCG, right? What is your dose for that? I’d think lowering test and increasing HCG is what is look to (as long as the HCG dose is low, perhaps under 1000 iu per week). If you do some blood work, you could start using a small dose of an ai
if estrogenic sides get to high from the HCG. I think a small amount of ai is probably healthier long term than mast. You could potentially get an okay boost to testosterone from the HCG too.
Thanks for the replies guys.
@unreal24278 for me, adoption would be a last resort after I’ve tried everything, including coming off TRT and IVF. I would hope I don’t need to go that far however. My sperm count was zero the last two times I have checked. I haven’t checked since being on my gonadotropins.
My current protocol is the following:
50mg test cyp EOD (175mg/wk)
2500iu hCG EOD
75mg hMG EOD
I was thinking to drop the test to maybe 125mg or even 100mg and replace the rest with masteron. In your opinion would this suppress me less than the full 175mg of Test?
@mnben87 see above my hcg dose. It is a high dose but it’s also what’s been proven in literature to be effective. Some studies have gone up to 3000iu EOD.
SB
No, at both dosages you’ll be achieving near total shut down.
If you don’t want significant suppression you need like… 10mg Anavar/day and only that… Or 50-100mg proviron/day and only that. Neither is a good idea
With the amount of HCG/hmg you are using, that alone should qualify as adequate for testosterone replacement provided your testis are functioning normally. From what I recall you don’t have primary hypogonadism.
@BrickHead managed to re-gain fertility after being on TRT for decades. Ask him how he did it. Granted he doesn’t have the extensive history you do, you’ve used very high dosages of hyper androgenic, progestogenic drugs.
According to the literature available it would appear the vast majority of men with a history of recreational AAS use re gain fertility, though this process can rarely take quite a bit of time (2 years+).
This thread ought to be highlighted for young people looking into gear/blast and cruise. Even if you don’t acquire cardiac complications, serious long term repercussions/complications can be and are associated with long term AAS use, and most overlook them when they’re in the middle of it.
Look, you’re trying to get your (wife???) Pregnant… Why are you looking into stacking androgens when you’re on enough HCG/HMG to provide physiological replacement. For most… 175mg isn’t trt in the pure context of replacement. 200mg test/wk is the dose used in studies using testosterone for a male contraceptive… and it was a fairly effective one.
You’re not that far off. And replacing test with mast (a less potent drug) isn’t going to help the fact that you’re still going to be using nearly 200mg/wk. Would it not be best to do everything you possibly can to optimise chances of conceiving?
I’m aware the thought ‘coming off’ can be daunting after having been on for so long. I suppose my question is… What’s more important? Baby or steroids? Chances are you’ll be able to maintain plenty of mass if you train consistently
You can always go back on T when the job is done, perhaps even a bit of trt+ (like 175mg/wk) if you’ve got a physician looking after you. Though I wouldn’t keep cycling, not with a kid on the line. However that’s just me, I’m not going to push my ideals on you.
There is data showcasing T+HCG can retain fertility, but this is usually in the context of using HCG when you start trt. Not after years/decades of blast and cruise
Add enclomiphene into your program if you can. Standard trt protocol in the States for an individual who has rn eye on fertility is test, HCG, and enclomiphene.
Hi, does the enclomiphene still stimulate LH/FSH while shut down on test though? Be nice if if did.
Depends completely on dosages
It does (at the right dose) but only minimally so. But that’s often all you need.
Would 25mg a day be enough? Its strong stuff from what I can gather
That’s a pretty common dose yes. You could even start out at 25mg eod and get blood work after a month and see if your FSH has moved at all.
It’s unlikely you’ll have in range FSH on test/mast + enclomiphene
Unless you have primary hypogonadism and starting FSH is like… 50 then you might have in range FSH regardless of what you’re on
I don’t think anyone is aiming for “in range” when they’re on trt. But above what is effectively zero is about the best you can hope for and that’s the end goal. Of course one can always just stop trt if fertility is the top goal and they have been unable to conceive while on hcg and enclomiphene.
Would just 25mg Clomid suffice? I can’t get that isomer. @iron_yuppie
SB