[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
If they’re so bright, bar them from our countries. They’ll figure out a way to topple the regime, when forced to.[/quote]
I think you are right.
In the long run they will have a better life in China anyway.
[/quote]
Makes no difference to me. Good luck to them…over there.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
If they’re so bright, bar them from our countries. They’ll figure out a way to topple the regime, when forced to.[/quote]
I think you are right.
In the long run they will have a better life in China anyway.
[/quote]
Maybe they’ll help to provide me with even cheaper goods at Wal-mart!
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Sifu wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Refusing to let these young kids go, when they strayed onto their ‘holy’ ground is the last straw. Even Bishop Desmond Tutu is requesting their release.
http://blog.freethehikers.org/2370/archbishop-desmond-tutu-calls-for-hikers-release-again/
We have the biggest and best military in the world. Why aren’t we using it TO FREE AMERICANS?
Tell ya what, Barry: You and your left wing Hollywood and financier buddies too cowardly to act? Train me and I’ll fly a fucking stealth plane over Tehran and do what you fucking namby-pamby limosine liberals don’t have the heart and balls to do!
If they don’t release those kids then, I’ll be back and even more pissed off. [/quote]
What?
I thought you were for tough policing of borders and I guess you do not have too much problems if crminals are held in less than comfortable conditions?
[/quote]
Actually Oroin we think the Iranians should stay on their side of the border and not be crossing over into Iraq to snatch American hostages. Those kids weren’t the first group they tried to snatch. There is the British marines they snatched in international waters in the gulf. They also tried to snatch a group of US marines who were inside Iraq patrolling along the border, when the Iranians tried to surround them they opened fire.
Kidnapping and taking hostages is how the Iranians roll. Letting them get away with it is how Democrats roll. This incident is just another example of how ineffective Obama is in dealing with the Iranians. We are almost two years into his presidency and he is yet to have the one on one presidential talks that he said he was going to have. The talks that had all the naive college kids excited and ready to vote for Obama because they have no clue how the world really works.
The sad reality is the Bush administration had more dialogue with the Iranians than the Obama administration has had. Because Bush and his people knew how to approach the Iranians. [/quote]
So crossing borders to kidnap other countries citizens is wrong?
Assuming that that really is what happened.
[/quote]
There is some uncertainty as to which side of the border those kids actually were taken prisoner on. Since there is an established pattern of behavior with the Iranians crossing into Iraq or international waters then telling people they have strayed into Iranian territory I would say it is a distinct possibility those kids were not inside Iran when they were taken prisoner.
The incident with the Marines happened inside Iraq that is why the Iranian troops who confronted them did not return fire and pursue them as they retreated deeper into Iraq. The Iranians thought the Marines were going to be pussies like the Royal Marines, believe their lies, give up without a fight and allow themselves to be taken into Iranian territory.
The moral of the story is if you are an American don’t go near the Iranian border unless you are well armed and be prepared for Iranian troops to ambush you.
[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
Washington needs to institute a “brain drain” policy and give visas and plenty of incentives to Iran’s brightest minds to get out of there. Why add fuel to rhetoric and DEMAND that Iran back off their nuke program? That will just fuel nationalism.
[/quote]
A lot of countries are doing this already. Japan has a ton of Iranian PhD’s working at Sony, Panasonic, Toyota…you name it. These guys are as smart as they come. A good friend of mine over here is an Iranian was involved with the creation of the blue laser which is used in BluRay players.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Refusing to let these young kids go, when they strayed onto their ‘holy’ ground is the last straw. Even Bishop Desmond Tutu is requesting their release.
http://blog.freethehikers.org/2370/archbishop-desmond-tutu-calls-for-hikers-release-again/
We have the biggest and best military in the world. Why aren’t we using it TO FREE AMERICANS?
Tell ya what, Barry: You and your left wing Hollywood and financier buddies too cowardly to act? Train me and I’ll fly a fucking stealth plane over Tehran and do what you fucking namby-pamby limosine liberals don’t have the heart and balls to do!
If they don’t release those kids then, I’ll be back and even more pissed off. [/quote]
How the fuck are you going to use a stealth jet to rescue some hikers/prisoners? And is this REALLY the provocation you need to invade a country the size of Iran? You’re a joke, an absolute joke. And you’re a goddamned chicken hawk too. You want to invade everything and everyone. The use of our military is the final and best solution to all of our international problems. Let me guess: you learned this from your father who beat the shit out of you and your mother as a means of solving all the problems and differences that occur within the household.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
PimpBot,
That cracked me up.
Washington needs to institute a “brain drain” policy and give visas and plenty of incentives to Iran’s brightest minds to get out of there. Why add fuel to rhetoric and DEMAND that Iran back off their nuke program? That will just fuel nationalism.
Instead, make it easy for their scientists, students and engineers to leave the country. That would “gut” all Iranian technological advances in the long run, and the government couldn’t blame America for it because Iran’s own citizens had the choice to leave.
But no…all Iranians are “terrorists.” Let’s deny them visas, keep them in their home countries, get in pissing matches with the Iranian government who brainwashes its own people with propaganda and gives incentive for their scientists to dedicate their lives to the advancements that America, Israel and their allies fear.
Iranians would gladly leave Iran. There are plenty of them in Europe and Canada that would never go back to live in Iran. Make it easy for Iranians to leave Iran, especially when unemployment is over 30% now and inflation is nuts over there.[/quote]
What?
A policy that would prevent your worst fears while being cheap and actually benefitting you?
Sir, that is not the American way.
[/quote]
Well well well. Look who is now propagating ignorant stereotypes that have no basis in reality. If you follow opinion surveys of muslim college students in Britain you would know that islamic fundamentalism and extremism is not something that is solely a product of the uneducated or the poor. Some of the most radical muslims happen to be very well educated. ie Ahmadinejad at one time was a university professor.
The Iranian revolutionary guards have had decades to cultivate talent. They can scour their madrassa for the boys who memorized the Koran and from there put them into advanced maths and physics classes. The guards have all the resources of the state available to send their best and brightest to university and give them priority access to the best teachers.
Wake up and smell the coffee. It is the literate ones who can read that are able to absorb all the hatred and poison that is in the koran. The educated muslims are the most dangerous ones.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
If they’re so bright, bar them from our countries. They’ll figure out a way to topple the regime, when forced to.[/quote]
I think you’re right on this one. A brain drain policy makes sense on the surface, but the best chance of a true democracy ever flourishing in Iran exists in a situation in which the best and brightest minds there have the ability to participate in its inception.
The revolution that we all hope for over there may happen without the intellectuals, but it may also result in a less-than desirable govt put in place, in terms of establishing some sort of stability over there. By and large, it is the intellectual segment of society that craves a real democracy over there, one in which they can use their intellect, their scientific knowledge and so on to help foster positive change in Iran. Iranians are fiercely nationalist and while there are a lot who are leaving the country now, many of those expatriates will return after conditions there improve through some sort of revolution.
But the revolution will never happen if the people best capable of enacting it are encouraged to move elsewhere.
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[…]
But the revolution will never happen if the people best capable of enacting it are encouraged to move elsewhere.[/quote]
This is something that cannot be stressed enough.
Voting with your feet is so easy nowadays, almost too easy one could argue.
There are many countries on the map where intellectuals with a solid education and liberal, cosmopolitan attitude won’t even think about helping “their fatherland”.
They just want out.
[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[…]
But the revolution will never happen if the people best capable of enacting it are encouraged to move elsewhere.[/quote]
This is something that cannot be stressed enough.
Voting with your feet is so easy nowadays, almost too easy one could argue.
There are many countries on the map where intellectuals with a solid education and liberal, cosmopolitan attitude won’t even think about helping “their fatherland”.
They just want out.
[/quote]
Sure. I mean I understand why a brain drain may seem to make sense. Get all of the people in Iran with something to offer out of there and this will put a lot of pressure on the Iranian govt to do something to keep them there. It will also make Iranians realize that it is the govt that is driving the best and brightest Iranians out of the country.
But what will also happen if a brain drain occurs is that those who are left are the uneducated and poor who are easy prey for the imans and Ahmadinjenad. They’ll be easily convinced that the West is taking the intellects away and that it is the fault of the West that there are no good doctors anymore, no more good scientists, no more good professors, etc etc. These people will be easy to lure to the Dark Side and many of them will turn into carbomb fodder to be used in places like Iraq, Afghanistan, Israel, Egypt, Lebanon and Yemen.
They’ll always have enough scientists to help build nuclear reactors and that sort of thing. But in a brain drain, those will be the only scientists left. Sure, there are a lot of extremists who recruit at various education centers in Iran, but those extremists won’t have to contend with the educated, moderate instructors when they are gone. They can simply put their own hand-picked teachers in place instead.
The economy is fucked in Iran right now so it seems plausible that it will be the poor and the working classes that rise up in defiance. But these are the same sorts who can easily be convinced that the West, and specifically the U.S., is the main culprit behind all of the country’s economic woes. And in some ways we are; we’ve been levying heavy economic sanctions against them for years. But without moderate, nationalist intellectuals there to help organize against the govt, and to help dispel any false claims against the West that Ahmadijenad may make, they’re nothing more than sheep over there that the Ayatollah and his cronies can bend and shape to his will.
[quote]Schwarzfahrer wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[…]
But the revolution will never happen if the people best capable of enacting it are encouraged to move elsewhere.[/quote]
This is something that cannot be stressed enough.
Voting with your feet is so easy nowadays, almost too easy one could argue.
There are many countries on the map where intellectuals with a solid education and liberal, cosmopolitan attitude won’t even think about helping “their fatherland”.
They just want out.
[/quote]
Yup.
Isnt it glorious?
[quote]espenl wrote:
Invading Iran would be the single stupidest mistake in USAs history.[/quote]
Who said anything about invading? Learn to read!
[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
PimpBot,
That cracked me up.
Washington needs to institute a “brain drain” policy and give visas and plenty of incentives to Iran’s brightest minds to get out of there. Why add fuel to rhetoric and DEMAND that Iran back off their nuke program? That will just fuel nationalism.
Instead, make it easy for their scientists, students and engineers to leave the country. That would “gut” all Iranian technological advances in the long run, and the government couldn’t blame America for it because Iran’s own citizens had the choice to leave.
But no…all Iranians are “terrorists.” Let’s deny them visas, keep them in their home countries, get in pissing matches with the Iranian government who brainwashes its own people with propaganda and gives incentive for their scientists to dedicate their lives to the advancements that America, Israel and their allies fear.
Iranians would gladly leave Iran. There are plenty of them in Europe and Canada that would never go back to live in Iran. Make it easy for Iranians to leave Iran, especially when unemployment is over 30% now and inflation is nuts over there.[/quote]
Why would they want to come here? His pics show a paradise.
None of which has anything to do with holding kids in prison.
Were they dumb for going near that nest? Sure. Do they deserve solitary confinement for 14 months? No.
Burn the nest until they free those people.
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Refusing to let these young kids go, when they strayed onto their ‘holy’ ground is the last straw. Even Bishop Desmond Tutu is requesting their release.
http://blog.freethehikers.org/2370/archbishop-desmond-tutu-calls-for-hikers-release-again/
We have the biggest and best military in the world. Why aren’t we using it TO FREE AMERICANS?
Tell ya what, Barry: You and your left wing Hollywood and financier buddies too cowardly to act? Train me and I’ll fly a fucking stealth plane over Tehran and do what you fucking namby-pamby limosine liberals don’t have the heart and balls to do!
If they don’t release those kids then, I’ll be back and even more pissed off. [/quote]
How the fuck are you going to use a stealth jet to rescue some hikers/prisoners? And is this REALLY the provocation you need to invade a country the size of Iran? You’re a joke, an absolute joke. And you’re a goddamned chicken hawk too. You want to invade everything and everyone. The use of our military is the final and best solution to all of our international problems. Let me guess: you learned this from your father who beat the shit out of you and your mother as a means of solving all the problems and differences that occur within the household.[/quote]
(1) Ask nicely using reason (2) If no response to ‘nice’, bomb.
Rinse and repeat.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
PimpBot,
That cracked me up.
Washington needs to institute a “brain drain” policy and give visas and plenty of incentives to Iran’s brightest minds to get out of there. Why add fuel to rhetoric and DEMAND that Iran back off their nuke program? That will just fuel nationalism.
Instead, make it easy for their scientists, students and engineers to leave the country. That would “gut” all Iranian technological advances in the long run, and the government couldn’t blame America for it because Iran’s own citizens had the choice to leave.
But no…all Iranians are “terrorists.” Let’s deny them visas, keep them in their home countries, get in pissing matches with the Iranian government who brainwashes its own people with propaganda and gives incentive for their scientists to dedicate their lives to the advancements that America, Israel and their allies fear.
Iranians would gladly leave Iran. There are plenty of them in Europe and Canada that would never go back to live in Iran. Make it easy for Iranians to leave Iran, especially when unemployment is over 30% now and inflation is nuts over there.[/quote]
Why would they want to come here? His pics show a paradise.
None of which has anything to do with holding kids in prison.
Were they dumb for going near that nest? Sure. Do they deserve solitary confinement for 14 months? No.
Burn the nest until they free those people.
[/quote]
Your utter contempt for the law astounds me.
They did the crime, now they do the time.
The Iranians are just tough on crime, thats all.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Refusing to let these young kids go, when they strayed onto their ‘holy’ ground is the last straw. Even Bishop Desmond Tutu is requesting their release.
http://blog.freethehikers.org/2370/archbishop-desmond-tutu-calls-for-hikers-release-again/
We have the biggest and best military in the world. Why aren’t we using it TO FREE AMERICANS?
Tell ya what, Barry: You and your left wing Hollywood and financier buddies too cowardly to act? Train me and I’ll fly a fucking stealth plane over Tehran and do what you fucking namby-pamby limosine liberals don’t have the heart and balls to do!
If they don’t release those kids then, I’ll be back and even more pissed off. [/quote]
How the fuck are you going to use a stealth jet to rescue some hikers/prisoners? And is this REALLY the provocation you need to invade a country the size of Iran? You’re a joke, an absolute joke. And you’re a goddamned chicken hawk too. You want to invade everything and everyone. The use of our military is the final and best solution to all of our international problems. Let me guess: you learned this from your father who beat the shit out of you and your mother as a means of solving all the problems and differences that occur within the household.[/quote]
(1) Ask nicely using reason (2) If no response to ‘nice’, bomb.
Rinse and repeat.
[/quote]
Why dont you just join al Quaeda?
They have a similar outlook and they are very religious people.
You would fit right in!
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Refusing to let these young kids go, when they strayed onto their ‘holy’ ground is the last straw. Even Bishop Desmond Tutu is requesting their release.
http://blog.freethehikers.org/2370/archbishop-desmond-tutu-calls-for-hikers-release-again/
We have the biggest and best military in the world. Why aren’t we using it TO FREE AMERICANS?
Tell ya what, Barry: You and your left wing Hollywood and financier buddies too cowardly to act? Train me and I’ll fly a fucking stealth plane over Tehran and do what you fucking namby-pamby limosine liberals don’t have the heart and balls to do!
If they don’t release those kids then, I’ll be back and even more pissed off. [/quote]
How the fuck are you going to use a stealth jet to rescue some hikers/prisoners? And is this REALLY the provocation you need to invade a country the size of Iran? You’re a joke, an absolute joke. And you’re a goddamned chicken hawk too. You want to invade everything and everyone. The use of our military is the final and best solution to all of our international problems. Let me guess: you learned this from your father who beat the shit out of you and your mother as a means of solving all the problems and differences that occur within the household.[/quote]
(1) Ask nicely using reason (2) If no response to ‘nice’, bomb.
Rinse and repeat.
[/quote]
Why dont you just join al Quaeda?
They have a similar outlook and they are very religious people.
YOu would fit right in!
+
[/quote]
When does Al-Qaeda ask nicely?
Admit it, you’re fine with those kids being tormented in solitary, because they’re Americans.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Refusing to let these young kids go, when they strayed onto their ‘holy’ ground is the last straw. Even Bishop Desmond Tutu is requesting their release.
http://blog.freethehikers.org/2370/archbishop-desmond-tutu-calls-for-hikers-release-again/
We have the biggest and best military in the world. Why aren’t we using it TO FREE AMERICANS?
Tell ya what, Barry: You and your left wing Hollywood and financier buddies too cowardly to act? Train me and I’ll fly a fucking stealth plane over Tehran and do what you fucking namby-pamby limosine liberals don’t have the heart and balls to do!
If they don’t release those kids then, I’ll be back and even more pissed off. [/quote]
How the fuck are you going to use a stealth jet to rescue some hikers/prisoners? And is this REALLY the provocation you need to invade a country the size of Iran? You’re a joke, an absolute joke. And you’re a goddamned chicken hawk too. You want to invade everything and everyone. The use of our military is the final and best solution to all of our international problems. Let me guess: you learned this from your father who beat the shit out of you and your mother as a means of solving all the problems and differences that occur within the household.[/quote]
(1) Ask nicely using reason (2) If no response to ‘nice’, bomb.
Rinse and repeat.
[/quote]
Why dont you just join al Quaeda?
They have a similar outlook and they are very religious people.
YOu would fit right in!
+
[/quote]
When does Al-Qaeda ask nicely?
Admit it, you’re fine with those kids being tormented in solitary, because they’re Americans.
[/quote]
If you were in charge, you would have asked nicely right after this whole thing went down. Ahmadijenad would have said no, you would have bombed Tehran and those hikers’ throats would have been slit. As it stands now, the hikers are still alive. With your plan, they would have been dead long ago. You’re a fucking idiot. I can’t believe you’re a teacher.
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]Headhunter wrote:
Refusing to let these young kids go, when they strayed onto their ‘holy’ ground is the last straw. Even Bishop Desmond Tutu is requesting their release.
http://blog.freethehikers.org/2370/archbishop-desmond-tutu-calls-for-hikers-release-again/
We have the biggest and best military in the world. Why aren’t we using it TO FREE AMERICANS?
Tell ya what, Barry: You and your left wing Hollywood and financier buddies too cowardly to act? Train me and I’ll fly a fucking stealth plane over Tehran and do what you fucking namby-pamby limosine liberals don’t have the heart and balls to do!
If they don’t release those kids then, I’ll be back and even more pissed off. [/quote]
How the fuck are you going to use a stealth jet to rescue some hikers/prisoners? And is this REALLY the provocation you need to invade a country the size of Iran? You’re a joke, an absolute joke. And you’re a goddamned chicken hawk too. You want to invade everything and everyone. The use of our military is the final and best solution to all of our international problems. Let me guess: you learned this from your father who beat the shit out of you and your mother as a means of solving all the problems and differences that occur within the household.[/quote]
(1) Ask nicely using reason (2) If no response to ‘nice’, bomb.
Rinse and repeat.
[/quote]
Why dont you just join al Quaeda?
They have a similar outlook and they are very religious people.
YOu would fit right in!
+
[/quote]
When does Al-Qaeda ask nicely?
Admit it, you’re fine with those kids being tormented in solitary, because they’re Americans.
[/quote]
No, its exactly the other way around, you only have a problem with it because they are Americans and the only one who has the God given right to kill, maim or imprison innocent Americans is the American government.
quote Ask nicely using reason (2) If no response to ‘nice’, bomb.
Rinse and repeat.
[/quote]
yep
cause it worked so very well in :
-1950-1953 Korea
-1958 Indonesia
-1960 Guatemala
-1961 Cuba
-1961-1972 Vietnam
-1964 Congo
-1965 Perou
-1973 Chili
-1979 Afghanistan
-1980-1990 Salvador
-1986 Lybia
-1990-91 Irak
-1993-1994 Somalia
-2001-2010 Afghanistan
-2003-2010 Irak
all of these countries became good, peaceful and modern democracies after US interventions…
maybe you should try and win at least 1 war before starting another one.