Intro. Started Clomid, Didn't Get Baseline Test

Pharma TRT
1

I started yesterday taking 25mg of Clomid. I’ve taken 2 doses so far. Should I stop now? How long should I wait?

I was going to have my blood drawn this afternoon for a diet I’m on. The testosterone panel was added. I was just told today it should be done in the morning. I also want to get my Doc to add some more tests for thyroid, adrenal, etc like have been mentioned in the sticky, but I’m waiting on the nurse to return my call.

I’m a 30 y/o male. I have been overweight my entire life and tipped the scales 4 weeks ago at 391. I’m 6’0 tall. I have lost almost 30 lbs since then on a low cal, doctor monitored diet and class. I was diagnosed as having Low T when I was 17. My doc at the time said my testes were smaller than normal. I had an MRI and my pituitary checked out. Went on T shots and started losing my hair. Quit cold turkey.

I didn’t have problems in puberty. Never had a spurt, but grew to 6 feet. Early body hair and shaving by 7th grade. Normal sized member. Deep voice, etc. I’ve never had ED or libido problems. My T levels the last couple of years have been low 180s-230s. I was on T shots a couple years ago and T gel earlier this year. But I want kids someday and I’m just not comfortable risking infertility.

My cholesterol is always very low. Total cholesterol even at 390 lbs was 140. After 6-8 weeks of this diet, it’ll be below 100 (I’ve lost 95 lbs on this diet before). Could my low cholesterol be causing my low T? I read it’s the building blocks for hormones.

I will get a thermometer and check my temps and look into iodine if needed.

I’m sure I’m forgetting stuff I wanted to mention, so I’ll post more later.

Thanks for any input you have!

EDIT: Just read the new guy sticky, and realized I left some things out.

In your case/thread opening post:
-age 30
-height 6’0
-waist 56-60"
-weight 362
-describe body and facial hair: Somewhat hairy arms, legs, chest, back and face
-describe where you carry fat and how changed: All over - belly, chest and thighs
-health conditions, symptoms [history]: gall stones, sleep apnea, acid reflux
-Rx and OTC drugs, any hair loss drugs or prostate drugs ever: urisidiol for stones and vitamins on diet.
-lab results with ranges: Coming…
-testes ache, ever, with a fever? Never
-how have morning wood and nocturnal erections changed: Almost always have wood. Don’t know about nocturnal erections…I’m asleep. haha Never had a wet dream that I know of.

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Oh yeah, I also have dry, flaky skin on my face (mostly forehead). Also have fatigue. That could be from being obese, though. And I am generally melancholy/depressed (not diagnosed). Also, had terrible acid reflux till I got a CPAP 3 years ago. Still get indigestion minus the reflux.

Just scatter-shooting some symptoms that could be thyroid related.

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The Clomid you took will invalidate the hormone tests. Clomid has a very long life in the body, so if you want a clean test to know where you really stand you should quit and wait at least a month before testing.

4

Well, I took the blood test today well before your reply. Does clomid really start working that fast?

I will just go with my last two levels I’ve had. The latest was April of this year. 184ng [175-781]

They are testing my total T, free T, E2, LH, FSH, TSH, T3, T4, rT3, cortisol, and a few more I can’t remember. It was a bit of an ordeal getting them to add these to my scheduled lipid panel. They were only going to do total T before I said to add more. The head nurse hadn’t even heard of E2 or Reverse T3. I will post results Thursday evening, hopefully. If I’m missing some, I’ll try to get them in a couple weeks.

My temp tonight is 98.5

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Here are the results I got back so far. Quick turnaround.

TT: 266 ng [168-758]
T3 Uptake: 39% [32-48]
Total T4: 6.4 ug [5.8-11.8]
Estradiol Assay: 24 pg [<47]
FSH: 8.4 mIU [1.3-19.3]
LH: 4.5 mIU [1.2-8.6]
Vit D 25-Hydroxy: 26 ng [30-60]

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My temp upon waking up this morning was 97.3. I’m going to start taking 50mg of Iodine for a couple weeks. How much should I take a day after I replenish my levels?

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Really need fT3, fT4 as the hormones bound to thyroid binding globulin are not active.

T3, T4, fT3, fT4 should all be near mid range.
If rT3 is elevated, fT3 can be elevated while you have hypothyroid symptoms.
fT3 is what gets the job done

You can also test IGF-1 to eval GH status.

Test DHEA-S. DHEA is the raw material used in the testes for DHEA–>T. DHEA is made in the adrenals.

Also test Cortisol with ‘AM cortisol’ lab work, do that at 8AM

Do you have fasting glucose results? - diabetes

Clomid: It appears to have worked. But if your testes were small, they would need increased LH and FSH for a period of time for the testes to recover size, firmness form and function. So the low T level does not provide any conclusive information. If you stay on a SERM for a while and T levels do not increase or testes do not get bigger etc, we can conclude that you have a degree of primary hypogonadism.

And your history of using iodized salt and/or vitamins that list iodine is …

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Thanks for the reply. That’s a lot to digest.

I have a cortisol and DHEA-S test Friday morning. I’m pretty sure I asked for both total and free T3 & T4, bu who knows what they checked off. Will have to wait and see what else comes back.

My 4 hour fasting glucose level was 96, but there is family history of obesity and diabetes in my family.

I use primarily iodized salt. I eat out a lot. Do restaurants/fast food use iodized salt? If not, then I’m probably low. My multivitamin has only a little bit of Iodine, 150 mcg. I take 2 a day, but only while on the diet. I don’t usually take vitamins when not on the diet.

I don’t really know what “small” is for testes. I read one guy having marble sized testes. Mine aren’t that small, but they aren’t large either. I’d say the largest one is about 1.75" x 1.25". The other is 1.25"x.75". Haven’t looked real close at many balls in my life. Haha

What kind of growth should I watch for? If they don’t grow, what med do you suggest for raising LH and TSH?

Thanks for your time.

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I think the DHEA used for making T is made locally in the testicles, so T production does not depend on systemic adrenal DHEA.

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The testes are a major producer of pregnenolone which is used in the adrenals to produce DHEA and other things. See:

Pregnenolone is also made in almost every cell in your body - mitochondria

http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&docid=UAW2WWUk5lBkKM&tbnid=XMPQAqWSSBtgSM:&ved=0CAUQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fdenversdietdoctor.com%2Ffabulous-fatigued-tired%2F&ei=cJrFUvmUBeS02AWQwoHQBA&bvm=bv.58187178,d.b2I&psig=AFQjCNEUvhvZE9oCT1h_A2vNdgzs-H8fvQ&ust=1388768228127037

Restaurants generally do not use iodized salt. Most prepared foods do not.

Your testes are normal size. Do they feel firm or mushy?

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I’d say firm, but I’m not real sure what constitutes “mushy.”

I was mistaken on my 4hr fast glucose levels. They were 88, not 96.

I will watch my E2 levels closely. Being as overweight as I am, I may have to go on an aromatase to keep them in check. I’m at 24 currently.

12

E2=24 seems like a good number, but with TT=266 you are very estrogen dominant.

I suggest that you take 750mg iodine for replenishment, then take 6mg every 2-3 weeks thereafter.
You can start with 12mg and then work up to see if you tolerate, it does not really matter how fast you get the IR done. refer to the thyroid basics sticky, there may be more to read with your current perspective.

13

Thanks. I seem to have tolerated 50mg of iodine ok. I’ll keep that up. I also ordered some D3 5000IU pills since I’m low there.

Got my Cortisol results from this morning back.

15.3 ug [6.7-22.6]

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rT3 results

18.6 ng [9-27]

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DHEA-S 2.82 ng [1.33-7.78]

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Ok, the math is throwing me off. My results are in ng/mL. LEF gives the ideal range in ug/dL.

I found an online conversion that states 1 ug/dL = 10 ng/mL.

Am I correct in saying my level is 282 ug? If so, I am below the ideal range of 350-490 according to LEF.

Guess I will add DHEA to my regimen. I read that 50mg is a typical dose, and test again in 4 weeks.

Is this something I will be on for life?

17

the 25mg micronized works really well for me. Put me over the top of the range, so it’s not a staple any more. I sit around the top of the range without it. If you need it, it’s probably something you be on as long as you want the desired effect. You could also try magnesium oil. Seems to have helped raise DHEA-s for me.

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Thank you for your feedback. I’ve already purchased the LEF pills, but I will definitely look into the oil in the future.

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BTW, love your avatar. While everyone was buying and flying USA flags after 9/11, I bought the Gadsden flag.

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[quote]TXRanger1837 wrote:
BTW, love your avatar. While everyone was buying and flying USA flags after 9/11, I bought the Gadsden flag.[/quote]

I have the Gadsden and Culpepper flags in my weight room.