I’m on 100iu daily, although my doc told me to lay off it for a week for my E2 to fall, then re-add it, although I really don’t like how it makes me feel - maybe I will get use to it, who knows…
No drop it. T only.
Drop it. Stick to T only.
Remember who pays who here buddy. Your doc works for YOU.
Leave and take your money elsewhere. Shit I would just go to defy if I didn’t have any other docs local or cannot afford to go see doctor nichols at tier1hw
His minds closed and he thinks one size fits all men.
I’m in the UK mate and this guys is the best in the business over here. I’m gonna tell him I want to drop the HCG.
I’m now feeling like I did pre trt with chronic fatigue and brain fog but I am in a crossover period from Sustanon to test cyp, I reckon I’m missing the propionate from the Sustanon and just need to wait until the cyp builds up in my system. Weird times!
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Yah that sucks. You know what to do.
I’ve been following this thread since day 1 and I truly think the core of your problems have nothing to do with TRT. I can’t say what is in fact wrong with you, but I think you are obsessing over your TRT protocol and making too frequent adjustments thereto. You need to see a proper diagnostician (easier said than done)!
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I agree with you wholeheartedly, there is something not right.
I saw a specialist who determined I have 2 other problems going on besides the TRT.
He said I had a bad TMJ problem which was causing my body pain. He also established I have terrible emotional grief within from something that happened years ago that my brain hasn’t processed and it has got to be dealt with in order to get well. I have been recommended for something called EMDR which is meant to be amazing for PTSD, I
will be having this in a couple of months.
So, 3 things need putting right in my life
- hormones
- PTSD
- Jaw stability
He says once I have dealt with these 3 things then things will get better.
Just to update my TRT status, I have dropped the HCG and am now taking daily Test Cyp and proviron, after my 5 weeks labs revealed my T had halved since switching from Sustanon to test cyp.I am feeling pretty crappy until my T levels can become higher and stable, I guess in around 4-6 weeks, I will just have to ride it out
I will update this post again soon
Updating post:
Its been a tough few weeks, I got an abscess on my elbow which got infected, went into hospital and stayed there for a week, 2 operations later I am out but very delicate, I also have to refrain from exercising.
I was on 15mg Test Cyp daily, no HCG, no proviron (due to side effects). I take the Cyp Sub Q.
Since doing this my T has halved and my E2… wait for it… Is the lowest it’s ever been, infact it’s too low, Test now at 460 from 800 and E2 from 50 to 13 ( no AI at all ) I cannot believe sub Q daily injections can do this!
I have now had my Test Cyp increased to 17.5mg, I will give this 4-6 weeks to see if this raises things for me.
Sleep wise, I’m falling asleep in the chair downstairs prior to bed time, I believe my low T is the cause for this, i’m basically pre TRT again! Once in bed I wake all through the nigh so I haven’t cracked it yet!
I will update again soon!
@pilchard are you still around? I’ve dug up this old post through Google and I’m having pretty much exactly the same issues as you did then. Just wondering how you are now and if/how you got out of this hole?
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Not usually, if you feel bad right away on HCG then you body is trying to tell you something.
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Hi mate, yes I’m still here but not as often unfortunately.
I now get some sleep but it is broken but 100 times better than before.
Things that I have done:
Changed protocol from Sustanon twice a week to daily injection of Cypionate along with mircrodosing Aromasin, my levels are now good and my E2 is finally in a good place after 18 months.
I take 30mg of Mirtazapine which I am now in the process of reducing, this helps with sleep but I don’t want to be on this drug for much longer, it can be very painful to withdraw from so I have started a slow taper (currently on 26.25mg)
I have started CPAP therapy as sleep apnea was confirmed, this is still in it’s early stages of therapy but looking good although having to wear a face mask feels so alien and also disturbs my sleep.
Conclusion: What caused my insomnia…
I believe a few of things contributed to my insomnia…
-
Stopping SSRI treatment after years of use, this upset my brain chemical balance and I didn’t survive the crash very well, causing anxiety etc…
-
Introduction of a large amount of testosterone to my body when it had survived for years with barely any testosterone, the large whack of T was a shock to the system.
-
Large doses of T created high E2, now this is the major side effect to my insomnia and anxiety I feel, I have only recently got this under control and I started to feel more calm and sleep better.
It’s been a tough ride but I am making some good ground, but I wouldn’t wish insomnia on anybody, it’s awful.
Hope this helps.
Rich
Yes, I stopped this long ago, daily injections of cypionate only these days for me 
Forgot to mention… Reading your posts, it looks like you are suffering from adrenal fatigue and some serotonin depletion.
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Hey pilchard,
I usually just read stuff on those forums, and I never signed up to post anything until now, but when I read your Thread, I felt an obligation to share my wisdom with you!
I had exactly the same symptoms as you, I stayed around 2 years without any sleep at all, I went trhough hell, wanted to commit suicide… I have been where you are so I know how hard it is.
I can give you some advices that will change your life, because your case is VERY SIMILAR to what I went through, so, my 2 advices:
Read those books:
The Mood Cure by Julia Ross (read this one first)
Adrenal Fatigue the 21st century disease by James L Wilson
I found out my problem was adrenal fatigue on stage four… I almost died by exhaustion…
It took me around 3-4 years to completely heal, and the healing process is not linear which drives you crazy, but you must be Strong… Those books will TEACH you everything you need to deal with the problem you are going through right now.
I have total empathy with what you are going through, stay stong, read those books, and I’m here to help you out!
God bless you!
Rodrigo.
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Hey Rodrigo, thank you so much for sharing your experiences and wisdom with me.
Funnily enough I have started working with a naturopath who is helping me heal my adrenals by way of supplementation and diet, her view also was that I was suffering from adrenal fatigue.
I have The Mood Cure book and read this, it was very enlightening and definitely set me off in the direction of finding someone who could help me, which I have.
I am a very stressed and anxious person by nature but stopping SSRIs after many years and starting an aggressive TRT protocol tipped me over the edge.
I am doing a little better these days but still a long way to go. The stress and anxiety over the last couple of years have left me with severe body pain all over, which makes me very sad.
Once again, thank you for commenting on my post.
Rich.
One gold tip, which helped me a LOT…
There’s a supplement called “Seriphos” (Phosphorilated serine + Ethanolamine blend), it was CRUCIAL to help me out with sleep, that supplement made a huge difference on my treatment, it sends a message to our hipothalamus to shutdown cortisol production helping to induce sleep by switching off our brain.
I used to take a few supplements before sleep, and note, it takes a while before it really knocks you out, so you must be patient and believe in the healing process:
The supplements I used to consume were:
5HTP - 100 mg
Seriphos - 1 capsule 4 hours before sleep, 2 capsules 15 mins before sleep (you can buy on vitacost.com)
Calms Forte - 3 capsules (you can buy on vitacost.com)
Holy Basil - 1 capsule before bed (I used to buy the “organic índia” one)
Magnesium Glicine - 450mg before bed
This combo above used to make me sleep really well, and as I said, the major issue and hardest one I had to deal during adrenal fatigue battle was the crippling insomnia, I felt like I lost my identidy and I was just existing and surviving day by day… Hard times but, thank god, I conquered it… Today I’m a lot stronger person…
A curious fact:
My testosterone levels during my battle with adrenal fatigue were really low, around 280 ~390 (the labs in brazil has a STUPID range of 200 ng/dl to 800ng/dl), then I started TRT to keep high and stable testosterone levels… When I finally recovered from adrenal fatigue, I quit TRT using a blend made by myself to control estradiol levels (it worked like a PCT, but without clomiphene or nolva, was made of crisine /DIM / Saw Palmetto / I3C / calcium d glucarate ) for 60 days, and around 100 days mark, my testosterone levels were around 600-700 without any supplement and completely healed.
Today I’m 32 years old, completely healed from adrenal fatigue but I developed some sensitivity to emotional stress, gluten and sugar! My lab tests usually shows high endogenous testosterone levels but sometimes it shows low testosterone levels which leave me feeling low T symptons which are really unpleasant, that flutuation is not good. Because of that and thinking about optimize my testosterone making it stable and around 1000ng/dl mark, I’m considering to start TRT with cypionate and keep on track with it. Before doing such move I’m studying a LOT Jay Campbell’s books, John Crisle’s and Daniel Kelly’s.
I’m happy knowing you are doing much better. You can email me whenever you want.
rodrigoconservador87@gmail.com
Brgds
Rodrigo.
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Thanks once again Rodrigo. The Adrenal Fatigue book arrived today so I will start this tonight.
I am reluctant to take anything alongside the Mirtazapine that I am already taking in case of interactions.
Interestingly, the couple of times I tried 5HTP over the Xmas period (just 50mg) it really picked me up after about 1 hour of consuming it. I felt happy and motivated and everything seemed really bright. Unfortunately I was to it was not safe to take alongside the Mirtazapine so I had to quit them.
I hate being hooked on the Mirtazapine, I forgot to take my dose one night last week and I lay awake all night so I know without it I cannot sleep at all,
The withdrawals from this drug are meant to be rough but I’m not in a position to do this yet, I need more stability.
My anxiety is killing me at the moment, I can no longer do the things that I use to enjoy, I am constantly in a state of fight or flight 
Not exactly. I also started to feel bad initially on HCG but after 2-3 weeks only the positives remained