HRT Guys - THANK YOU

Pharma TRT
181

[quote]e-loo wrote:
Not around T-Nation much anymore. Digging through this thread for some info today. I really should update it.

Back on 07-07-2007, I mention that I had found a new doctor, a urologist. Switching from my old fashioned endo to this guy was one of the best things I have ever done.

First - he treated me, not the lab report. Of course the numbers are a guideline, but what is more important is how I am feeling.

I told him in the first couple visits that I believed I was a “high-normal” back when my testicles worked. Rather than rejecting it outright, he said yes, that is entirely possible. We slowly increased the dosage until my symptoms went away. We ended up at 1mL/200mg Test enan a week.

I divide it up and inject on Mondays and Thursdays. My total test runs in the 800s these days. Free test is slightly above normal range.

By December '07, I was much more like my old self. Clearer headed, more focused, more aware, more interested in life. A few more months and friends began to say to me “We have you back!” Right now physically I am down about 20lbs scale weight from what I weighed in Dec 07, but that does not reflect the fat I’ve taken off and the muscle I’ve gained. Then people would describe me as fat, now they describe me as muscular. Seriously I believe that transformation came mostly because I got my mental focus and tenacity back, things that the low test had robbed me of.

NOW THE BAD NEWS; The reason I logged on today was to dig thru this thread to figure out how long it took for me to start feeling good after starting injections.

Why?

Because I totally screwed up in April & May.

I was hitting lots of nerves with the 1" needles, so I asked the pharmacist if I could go to something shorter. She said sure, you are lean, 5/8" will be fine. Dunno why I did not clear this with my doctor.

By the end of May I was suffering from full blown low test symptoms. Fatigue, mental fog, unable to do anything because it all seemed too overwhelming to get from thinking about it to actually going through all the steps you have to go through. Cranky. I really just wanted to lie in bed all day. And I did stay in bed as much as I could. Just staring out the window

A TRT guy on another board helped me figure out what was going on. Talked to my doc’s nurse and she said go back to the 1" needles.

Been a couple weeks now, I am starting to come back. I had forgotten how absolutely shitty low test makes you feel, and how much testosterone makes us the people who we are.

[/quote]

Are you using an AI or just 200mg/wk? I have been seeing more and more people at 200mg/wk.

182

I’m using AI. About 8 drops EOD of the liquid.

183

Injecting with a 1.5" needle in the vastus-lateralis is insane.

184

[quote]chemman wrote:

[quote]e-loo wrote:
Not around T-Nation much anymore. Digging through this thread for some info today. I really should update it.

Back on 07-07-2007, I mention that I had found a new doctor, a urologist. Switching from my old fashioned endo to this guy was one of the best things I have ever done.

First - he treated me, not the lab report. Of course the numbers are a guideline, but what is more important is how I am feeling.

I told him in the first couple visits that I believed I was a “high-normal” back when my testicles worked. Rather than rejecting it outright, he said yes, that is entirely possible. We slowly increased the dosage until my symptoms went away. We ended up at 1mL/200mg Test enan a week.

I divide it up and inject on Mondays and Thursdays. My total test runs in the 800s these days. Free test is slightly above normal range.

By December '07, I was much more like my old self. Clearer headed, more focused, more aware, more interested in life. A few more months and friends began to say to me “We have you back!” Right now physically I am down about 20lbs scale weight from what I weighed in Dec 07, but that does not reflect the fat I’ve taken off and the muscle I’ve gained. Then people would describe me as fat, now they describe me as muscular. Seriously I believe that transformation came mostly because I got my mental focus and tenacity back, things that the low test had robbed me of.

NOW THE BAD NEWS; The reason I logged on today was to dig thru this thread to figure out how long it took for me to start feeling good after starting injections.

Why?

Because I totally screwed up in April & May.

I was hitting lots of nerves with the 1" needles, so I asked the pharmacist if I could go to something shorter. She said sure, you are lean, 5/8" will be fine. Dunno why I did not clear this with my doctor.

By the end of May I was suffering from full blown low test symptoms. Fatigue, mental fog, unable to do anything because it all seemed too overwhelming to get from thinking about it to actually going through all the steps you have to go through. Cranky. I really just wanted to lie in bed all day. And I did stay in bed as much as I could. Just staring out the window

A TRT guy on another board helped me figure out what was going on. Talked to my doc’s nurse and she said go back to the 1" needles.

Been a couple weeks now, I am starting to come back. I had forgotten how absolutely shitty low test makes you feel, and how much testosterone makes us the people who we are.

[/quote]

Are you using an AI or just 200mg/wk? I have been seeing more and more people at 200mg/wk. [/quote]

More people that end up with low shbg and other issue on top of it such as insulin resistance as well as sleep apnea risk goes up as well. When you exceed biological levels you are going into dark waters and upsetting the cart. I was on 120 mgs and needed adex. Lowering to 100 mgs no need for adex because I saw the cross over at 800 for me. Since adding in ipamorelin I can lower my dosage even more down to 80 mgs a week and still feel better then at 120 mgs. This was the choice I made and also i take TD dhea to help back fill the metabolic pathways which avoids first pass of the liver reducing chances of it converting to estrodial. TD dhea also make my testosterone work alot better why I do not need as much as before.

185

[quote]KSman wrote:
Injecting with a 1.5" needle in the vastus-lateralis is insane.[/quote]Oh I was talking 1.5" for glutes.

186

re: injections. Been on T Cyp for over 2 years now, 2 injections per week. I altrernate between the quads and upper/outer quadrant of the butt. NEVER, not once, have I ever had ANY pain, either shooting it or afterwards. I don’t warm up the Test, I don’t massage it or take hot showers, etc. I shoot 23g 1" into the quads and 23g 1.25" into the butt. For 2 years I used 23g 1.5" for the butt but over at researchsupply they had 1.25" so I just got those instead. I push the needle in very slowly and inject the oil very slowly, eg, about 10 seconds for .5 cc.

The ONLY problem I’ve had injecting was twice I got blood while aspirating into the quads. Moved the needle over a half inch and no problem.

I must have found the magic spots. On my quads it’s the middle section of the outer quad and I shoot from the front to the back, not from the side of your body.

187

Saveski - thanks for the tips!

188

You use insulin syringes? Are the long enough? I injject in thigh and was told 5/8 needle and get 25 size needle. I tried 1/2" 27 gage and they are a lot easier to inject but have had conflicting info on whether they inject deep enough.

189

I use BD Ultra-fine U-100 Insulin syringes
3/10 cc
12.7 mm (1/2 in.)
29 gauge needle
I am very lean so 1/2 inch is fine
I use 6 injection sites => delts, ventro-glutes, quads
I have blood levels tested regularly and am in care of an endocrinologist and blood levels remain stable

190

Depth: Under the skin [SC] or in the muscle [IM], it is still 100% absorbed. Docs do not know how to think, they will tell you that SC will not work and suggest pellets [under the skin]. SC is slower absorption and thus smoother levels.

191

12.7mm - 1/2"
#29
0.5 ml flows well, 1.0 with larger diameter piston flow less well.
0.3ml should develop better pressure, but I find 0.3ml a bit too small for my hands.

192

And let’s not forget gels. Injections under the skin is not going to absorb, but rubbing it on your skin works great. Doctors can be crazy