[quote]no23 wrote:
… appreciate the help … every now and again, we the superior alpha-race, has to remind all these other clowns who the bigg Daddy is and what nation really built this world.
[/quote]
Yeah, and then God gave the Irish whiskey to keep them from taking over the world.
I think the problem here is how we view nationalities.
In America, it is very easy to become an american(well it was). You raise your hand, you swear allegience to a flag and you take a test showing you know more about the country than native born americans.
for the rest of the world…you will never be british, irish, italian, whatever, unless you are born there.
I could live in England for the next 80 years, and i will still be a yank. Supermic could move to America and tomorrow he would be as much an American as i am.
As for being irish? How about this. No one is irish in the way that no one is Roman or Spartan.
My Ancestors left ireland and became American. Those who stayed became little more than british lackeys. It was, however, Americans who made all this ‘irish pride’ popular around the world. St Patrick’s day? That was purely a religious holiday until the 1990s when Ireland used its popularity in America for its own economic/cultural ambitions.
Hey, i guess America isnt squashing all cultures, we’ve helped preserve some
Im Irish.
Its a nice island to be born in!!
[quote]Diomede wrote:
As for being irish? How about this. No one is irish in the way that no one is Roman or Spartan. [/quote]
With the possible exception of the people currently living in Rome and Sparta.
Irish, Scottish, English…and a touch of Cherokee Indian…just enough to make me like whiskey and Guinness!
[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Diomede wrote:
As for being irish? How about this. No one is irish in the way that no one is Roman or Spartan.
With the possible exception of the people currently living in Rome and Sparta.[/quote]
ha,
i think you got my point.
Haney is found in both Irish and Scottish history. So I am both because of Haney, and even more so because of My grandmother’s maiden name. Mcmahness.
I’m half Irish (My fathers side comes from Limerck, Ireland) and half French Canadian (mothers side was just south of Montreal).
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
My mother’s Irish. The family are Lynches from County Galway…but very far removed, as they came over during the Famine.[/quote]
YO BROTHER!
Thats pretty sweet Fightin; my grandmother was a Lynch from Ballaghaderreen which is in Roscommon which borders on Galway. If we traced it back far enough Im sure we’d find a shared ancestry!
Anyhow, my gran left Ireland to find work in England as many of her generation were compelled to do. She had 9 kids to my English grandad and now has about 100 grandchildren and great-grandchildren. Whilst we are all English we are also influenced by and proud of our Irish heritage, particularly when it comes to enjoying the craic at the big family get-togethers!
Personally I class myself as a Yorkshiremen first and foremost (but thats a whole new can o worms!) but Im also PROUD TO BE ENGLISH in many ways.
And yes, I know our history and don’t deny it but we’re not all bad! Heck, my English Grandad who married the Irish lass took 3 bullets fighting the Nazis… Im immensely proud of both parts of my ancestry.
Interesting topic anyway, I quite like the “Brotherhood of Iron” sentiments that a few guys have mentioned, concentrate on what unites rather than divides us!
[quote]haney wrote:
Haney is found in both Irish and Scottish history. So I am both because of Haney, and even more so because of My grandmother’s maiden name. Mcmahness.
http://www.irishsurnames.com/coatsofarms/gm.htm[/quote]
My surname is not in that list, believe it or not my grandfather from my fathers side is the first person to have my familys surname.
Well I’m over 75% or in other words:
1 part GUINNESS DROUGHT
1 part MURPHY’S IRISH STOUT
1 part O’HARA’S CELTIC STOUT
My surname is Tully but family ties to Donahue, and Healy.
My mom is 100% Irish 2nd generation born in the US, my dad is about 25%. We still keep in contact with family in Ireland.
[quote]supermick wrote:
Hanley wrote:
I’m Irish. I was born in Dublin, I live in Dublin, Both my parents are from Dublin.
If you’re not BORN in Ireland or have lived here since you were a child, then you’re not fucking Irish.
to No23, you forgot Joyce (who, for all you yanks who don’t know, is one of the greatest and most celebrated writer of our times.) on your list of Irish writers. Great list tho!!
A voice of reason.
Incidendtly, i havent taken this thread as an excuse to stick the boot in to Americans - Its a similar situation over here where people have an irish nan or even a welsh terrier and claim to be celtic rather than English. They too are Not fucking Irish no matter how many shamrock tattoo’s or pints of Guinness they drink.[/quote]
This whole thread is ironic. 150 years ago, Americans were telling Irishman that…
“We don’t care what you do, you’re not fucking American. Now get out.”
How times change…
I still disagree with the whole premise. If you descended from people that came from the damn island, or any other European country for that matter, than that’s the blood that goes through you.
It might not be the same as being born on your piece of dirt as opposed to our piece of dirt, but the heritage is there.
Hence the terms “Irish American” or “Italian American”.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
If you descended from people that came from the damn island, or any other European country for that matter, than that’s the blood that goes through you.
It might not be the same as being born on your piece of dirt as opposed to our piece of dirt, but the heritage is there.
[/quote]
Nicely poetic expression of the legal concepts jus sanguinis (right of blood) and jus soli (right of territory).
Here is a test:
An Irishman and his pregnant wife arrive in New York on holiday. The wife gives birth.
Meanwhile, a Yorkshireman and his pregnant wife arrive in Dublin on holiday, and his wife gives birth.
Of the two babies born, which, would you say, is the more Irish? The one born on American soil to Irish parents, or the one born on Irish soil to English parents?
And yes, there is a right answer.
Although the question of what constitutes being Irish may never be resolved, perhaps a better question is “what does it mean to be British?”
Here is one answer:
“Being British is about driving in a German car to an Irish pub for a Belgian beer, then travelling home, grabbing an Indian curry or a Turkish kebab on the way, to sit on Swedish furniture and watch American shows on a Japanese TV. And the most British thing of all? Suspicion of anything foreign.”
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
I still disagree with the whole premise. If you descended from people that came from the damn island, or any other European country for that matter, than that’s the blood that goes through you.
[/quote]
Each week I have a session with an advanced form of dialysis machine which purges all of the english blood that I may have got from my parents out of my body!
[quote]Diomede wrote:
Hey, i guess America isnt squashing all cultures, we’ve helped preserve some ;)[/quote]True enough. We may yet be relying on Americans with an interest in the Irish language to prevent it from disappearing.
My mother’s side of the family moved to the US because of the Irish Potato Famine:
I’m Irish, English, German, French, Scottish, Cherokee and Choctaw. My family got around.
Irish ethnicity can be traced by DNA testing of the Y chromosomes, so there is at least some truth to Irish-Americans claim that they are Irish.
I think we are debating two different definitions for the word Irish:
1-Irish: being born in Ireland and
2-Irish: Irish ethnicity and culture.
The second definition applies to Irish-Americans.
[quote]superscience wrote:
haney wrote:
Haney is found in both Irish and Scottish history. So I am both because of Haney, and even more so because of My grandmother’s maiden name. Mcmahness.
My surname is not in that list, believe it or not my grandfather from my fathers side is the first person to have my familys surname. [/quote]
Must be nice. Haney is a very popular Irish/Scottish name that first appears all the way back to the 12th century.
There are so many in the U. S. that I get a sort og census letter everyonce in a while with an updated list, and number of us living here. There also used to be this great mail order catalog called “Haney’s Pub”. I think it went out of business, but I used to really enjoy getting those catalog’s.
my Uncle traced our roots all the way back to when we left Ireland. He left and signed up to fight the british in the revolutionary war, so my family has been here for a while.
heritage is a great thing. It is always nice to know where you came from.
As a side note On my mom’s side of the family I am related to thomas paine. So I had two relatives that in some way or another made an impact in the early days of this country.