Healthcare Bill Passes Senate

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
141

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

Pelosi is full of shit, if they had the votes, it would have been voted on and passed already. She is trying to downplay the reluctance within Congress, even among her own party. The Bluedog Dems along with the Reps hopefully will come through and shoot this down. [/quote]

And the more Pelosi talks, the worse it will get - her approval ratings are abysmal.

Blue Dogs/moderate Democrats are not only standing against in in principle, they have self-preservation to worry about. With the loss of independents and conservatives (regardless of party affiliation), what Blue Dog or moderate Democrat would want to have to defend a vote for this bill in their district in 2010?

Obama, who campaigned as a centrist, has governed as a hardcore partisan and has crossed the political Rubicon by marrying himself to the left wing of the party, and in moderate-cosnervative districts, we may see Democrats distance themselves from Obama and, in some cases, run against him.

143

What you guys are calling “no substance” is actually “no specifics” as specifics are being argued and negotiated in various committees.

Mufasa

144

While I think that Reid and Pelosi are attention whores…I think that even THEY realize that their penchant for photo-ops and microphone time was causing more harm that good.

Mufasa

145

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Mufasa wrote:
You know what?

We’d all like to think we are the most intelligent, objective and analytical people around…and that with most things, we are right and everyone else is wrong.

(You don’t have to be on this Forum long to realize that is the case).

The truth is we tend to see most things though out own proverbial “prism”.

Mufasa

You’re darn tootin. I thought he danced and danced and danced. No substance.

[/quote]

Nothing new.

What, pray tell, do people think he was talking about when he told us over and over that he wanted to “remake America” and “fundamentally change this nation”? His past should have told any half conscious person what that meant. This is not about healthcare. It is about hijacking a further 20% of the economy into federal control and then regulating the livin shit outta our lives when they have our literal day to day well being in their hands. It’s about the enlightened elites coercing us into what we clearly don’t have the sense to do for ourselves.

Same with cap and trade. They don’t give a shit about the environment (most of em), they care about neutering the United States on the world stage while hijacking the production of energy as well. With that and control over people’s health they can engineer every last aspect of our lives. Everything, EVERYTHING depends on people being healthy enough to function and having access to energy. Every family, every business, every corporation, transportation, food, you name it. Why can’t people see that? His entire pre presidential life is screaming that at us.

If Mike Mentzer showed up at your gym (I know he’s dead) and said “Hey lemme remake your training program for you” What the hell do you think you would get? High volume high frequency training? With this guy his entire history goes out the window. He has always been all about faaar left radical marxist ambitions. Here we go, but people think he’s trying to save America. WHAT DOES REMAKE MEAN!?!?!?!? He doesn’t want to save it, he wants to kill it and resurrect it in his own image. Is there some weird solar radiation hitting our continent or something scrambling peoples brains so that they can’t see this smacking them in the forehead?

147

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Mufasa wrote:
What you guys are calling “no substance” is actually “no specifics” as specifics are being argued and negotiated in various committees.

Mufasa

So you think in eight days (referencing Barackie’s deadline of Aug. 1) all these “specifics” will get all sorted out and “what’s best for America” will shine through like a lighthouse flashing its rescuing beam from a rocky point in a gale at midnight, huh?[/quote]

“What I think” is that this deadline won’t be met.

The issues are too complex.

Mufasa

148

Obama has never answered any of the specific questions reguarding this reform, but its the specifics that are most important to America’s well being. He’s trying to sell this load of shit on semi-truths and false statements. Mr President, as you claim this healthcare rescue “isn’t about” you than who is it for, because it curtainly doesn’t benefit the 250+ million Americans who have health insurance, and certainly not the 85% who are happy with thier policies.

I didn’t watch the whole news conference, I couldn’t. The more I hear this man talk the more it sickens me.
Who is he to tell me, to tell Americans, stop second guessing this reform, we know whay we’re doing just sit back and let us do our job… (and watch as extreme liberalism destroys this country and the roots it grew from). Ha… to oppose this bill “as the Republicans are doing” is just “unnecessary” political games.

I know this doesn’t contribute much to the more informative part of this discussion but I gotta get it off my chest.

149

Reid confirmed today the the deadline will not be met.

Mufasa

150

Interesting update:

[i]House healthcare talks break down in anger
By Jared Allen, Mike Soraghan and Lauren Burke
Posted: 07/24/09 03:27 PM [ET]
House healthcare negotiations dissolved in acrimony on Friday, with Blue Dog Democrats saying they were â??liedâ?? to by their Democratic leaders.

In advance of a subsequent press conference called by House leadership, Blue Dog liaison Rep. Dennis Cardoza (D-Calif.) said the healthcare bill should be staying in committee.

“I expect the committee process to proceed,” Cardoza said.

The seven Blue Dogs on the Energy and Commerce Committee stormed out of a Friday meeting with their committee chairman, Henry Waxman (D-Calif.), saying Waxman had been negotiating in bad faith over a number of provisions Blue Dogs demanded be changed in the stalled healthcare bill.

â??Iâ??ve been lied to,â?? Blue Dog Coalition Co-Chairman Charlie Melancon (D-La.) said on Friday. â??We have not had legitimate negotiations.

â??Mr. Waxman has decided to sever discussions with the Blue Dogs who are trying to make this bill work for America,â?? Melancon said.

Although those Blue Dogs were supposed to be headed back into another meeting of the Energy and Commerce Democrats, their anger was visible.

If the two sides cannot reach an agreement, the only hope for passage of the bill in the House will be to go straight to the floor, an option leaders shied away from endorsing but said was an option.

But the Blue Dogs issued dire warnings to leaders contemplating that approach.

"Waxman simply does not have votes in committee and process should not be bypassed to bring the bill straight to floor,â?? Rep. Mike Ross (D-Ark.), the lead Blue Dog negotiator, said on Friday. â??We are trying to save this bill and trying to save this party.â??

Melancon said there would be 40-45 â??solid noâ?? votes from the 52-strong Blue Dogs, among other problems throughout the caucus. And Melancon said there are more Democrats who will vote against the bill.

â??If they try to bring it to the floor, I think theyâ??ll find out they have more problems than the Blue Dogs.â??

A leadership aide said no decisions have been made on how to proceed. [/i]

http://thehill.com/leading-the-news/house-healthcare-talks-break-down-in-anger-2009-07-24.html

President Obama - whose Democrats control the White House, a filibuster proof Senate, and a 70 seat House majority - cannot get his signature bill passed with the best backing a president could likely ever (arithmetically) have, and now his party is descending into brinksmanship and intraparty civil war over the issue.

151

[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
<<< President Obama - whose Democrats control the White House, a filibuster proof Senate, and a 70 seat House majority - cannot get his signature bill passed with the best backing a president could likely ever (arithmetically) have, and now his party is descending into brinksmanship and intraparty civil war over the issue.[/quote]

Some of the Dems are finding themselves in the unenviable position of being lynched by their constituents during the coming break whether the bill gets passed or not. If the vote is delayed, it leaves more time for public opinion to turn against it even further thus jeopardizing “healthcare reform” altogether. Or at least anything close to what these guys want. The blue dogs will HEAR it from their people over this breal for certain. If they pass it in it’s present form they fear for their seats and rightly so.

So, they either sabotage their president or lose their jobs.