[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
“The who decided” is my main issue. The people who decide in my state have already made “assualt rifles” illegal and now I’m required to be finger printed and have a license to own a hand gun in MD. If my legislators are the one that decide, shit taking creatine will likely DQ you…[/quote]
Reasonable concerns. But what about the involuntary institutionalization thing? I mean, somebody with serious antisocial personality disorder.[/quote]
That an issue, I think we need a lot more research on metal disorder before we dq people from owning a gun because they saw a shrink once. The problem here is MDs will need to agree and that can be tricky.
Believe me, I don’t want a guy straight out of the loony bin running around with a gun, but I also don’t wan’t the 2nd crapped on because we’re afraid of a loony running around with a gun.
We’ll have to pick up on this tomorrow. I’m out for the night.
The part about the history of gun confiscation and the resulting extermination of 52 million unarmed people in the 20th Century was a real eye-opener.[/quote]
LIFTIC, when I watched(some of) that video, one thing I noticed was that those government atrocities were not committed in 2013 USA, so how is that video applicable to us? This is the United States of America; we’re not in Nazi Germany or Stalin’s USSR. When my government tells me it needs to do something, I don’t question it. If this country ever starts marching 27 year old white males named NickViar on T-Nation into concentration camps, THEN I will agree that something needs to be done. Posting that video leads me to believe that you might just be the kind of anti-government nutjob who needs to lose some rights.
Good video, I’m just trying to respond for the other side so they don’t have to. [/quote]
Anything a government has done to people is possible to occur again to anyone, everywhere, at any time in history.
It is a very flawed argument that the atrocities committed by other governments in history are not capable of being committed by the US government here and now. The US government did murder hudreds of thousands of Japanese people with an atom bomb. Saying it isn’t capable of confiscating weapons and exterminating people is naive.
Governments by their very nature predate on human freedom and they lust for ever more power with which to do it more easily.
I don’t but yet somehow I know that, historically speaking, incremental gun control laws
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I’ll just stop you right there. These aren’t gun control laws. They are policies determined by the people in charge of institutions with which affiliation is voluntary. And they don’t have a goddamn thing to do with the Holocaust. It was stupid when that ridiculous meme was posted in the other thread, and it’s stupid now. Melodrama belongs on daytime TV.
[quote]NickViar wrote:
smh said: Either let anybody who wants to buy a gun, or enforce laws against selling to people who aren’t supposed to have them.
Great point. If a law exists, it should be enforced blindly and uniformly. I agree 10,000%. That’s why I support abolishing mandatory background checks entirely. If the seller wants to sell to someone, let them. If you disagree with that seller selling, then find someone who does it differently and give him/her your business.[/quote]
See, I disagree with you completely, but I respect the fact that this is a logical and consistent opinion. It’s these people that want it to be illegal to sell to crazies and criminals and illegal aliens and yet don’t want background checks–the only measure whereby that law can be enforced–that need to figure out where they stand.
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I agree, and it’s even worse if those same people make a slippery-slope argument about gun laws. “Crazy” standards and felony laws can be expanded to include anyone the government needs them to.
It goes back to what I said about good ideas vs. laws. Is it a good idea to attempt to keep guns out of the hands of crazy and dangerous people. Absolutely. Does it need to be law? The question I ask myself is, does the fact that a crazy or dangerous person possesses a gun hurt anyone? No. Can they hurt anyone with that gun without breaking an existing law? No. Do we need another law? No.
…These aren’t gun control laws. They are policies…
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Semantics.
[/quote]
Nope.
Not semantics.
A law affects us all. The policy of a voluntary institution affects only the people who want to voluntarily affiliate themselves with it.
Or is Pfizer’s policy against guns on its grounds equally as redolent of the Holocaust in your mind?
Again, this is cheap, daytime melodrama. It works when its slapped across some picture and passed around Facebook. It belongs nowhere near serious discussion.
…These aren’t gun control laws. They are policies…
[/quote]
Semantics.
[/quote]
Nope.
Not semantics.
A law affects us all. The policy of a voluntary institution affects only the people who want to voluntarily affiliate themselves with it.
Or is Pfizer’s policy against guns on its grounds equally as redolent of the Holocaust in your mind?
Again, this is cheap, daytime melodrama. It works when its slapped across some picture and passed around Facebook. It belongs nowhere near serious discussion.
[/quote]
We’re not talking about Pfizer. We’re on common ground in the case of Pfizer.
I’ll repeat that a public university is in the public square. [/quote]
This doesn’t mean anything. You keep saying it but it doesn’t mean anything. Where is the written down? What law makes this so? Or is it just–“some guy in Montana says that public universities are in the public square?”
You have to argue by more than assertion.
And why are First Amendment rights revocable on college campuses?
And why are students subjected to unreasonable searches?
I keep asking these questions because you believe that if you simply never answer them, they will just go away. But you’re mistaken.
And yes, Pfizer matters: just like SUNY Buffalo, it’s an institution whose funding is comprised of a mixture of government subsidy and private capital, and just like SUNY Buffalo, it gets to tell people that want to be on its property