I’m really envious of not living in the US, what with the ban on pro-hormones, ephedrine, just about anything that works for bodybuilding… not to say wasting public resources chasing people ordering roids :o)
About proving my point … de nile, its just not also a river in Egypt.
[quote]jeru72 wrote:
Hedo I have to disagree with some your points, you stated the French had strong economic interests in Iraq, I do believe one of their oil companies were seeking to strike some deals with Iraq, but Germany ?. What was there interest ? and as I stated earlier Chiraq AND Schroeder both stated they WOULD support the US but only after a second resolution. That’s not a ’ we won’t ‘, its a ’ we will BUT we want clarification’. Clarification on why we are going in and more importantly what we will do after we remove the Iraqi leadership i.e. a post-war plan.
You stated the French Government were scared of the backlash from its Muslim minority. The point about the Muslims and banning of headscarf was to give an example of where the French Government totally ignored the Muslims and minority groups. You only have to look at the French governments handling of its relations with Algeria and Berber Arabs to show its contempt of its Muslim minority and their opinions.
Still the dynamic I don’t understand was why were the US in such a hurry? a second resolution pushed through and an inspection report would have taken weeks rather than months. If your are going to attack another country, if you are going to ‘pre-emptively strike’ another sovereign nation, which flies against the traditions of the UN and US, it’s a massive departure,therefore, what is wrong with checking the evidence fully and making sure that the country you are going to strike against is a real threat?. More importantly some member nations wanted a clarification of a reconstruction plan for post-war Iraq, judging by the situation in Iraq, the rate of US personnel losing their lives or being maimed, as well as Iraqi civilians, this would have been very important. Spending a bit more time on planning would only have benefitted the operation but also the Iraqi people.
lothario1132 - Am I French ? lol ! thanks for proving my point.
[/quote]
Jeru
In a hurry…hardly. They took plenty of time to make the decision.
A French Oil company working on a deal. Actually Iraq was a large trading partner under the table according to documents we found. Chirac himself, well known for corruption, also participated profited personally if I recall the news stories of the day.
When we began the liberation our forces were attacked by French military equipment of very recent vintage sold to them well after the embargo. A check of serial numbers revealed these weapons were sent direct from France, not a thru a third party.
Let’s face reality. Previous administrations used to put up with this crap from the psuedo allies. The current one does not. They need to join us, not the other way around.
One way or the other we will get it done while they debate another resolution.
[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
I am being serious, Al. The fact that you refuse to see the greatness of our nation doesn’t change reality in any way.
Rail against us all you want. Roll your eyes at me and everybody else like me, but I ask you to at least be thankful that you have the opportunity to have your thoughts be heard and to not be thrown in jail or killed for them. The fact that you have at the very least that one basic right was paid for in blood.
You are lucky to be an American, young man, and don’t you ever forget it.[/quote]
I don’t consider myself an American. I wasn’t even born in this country, although place of birth is not the defining criteria for me.
How could I possibly forget what you profess that I can’t see? The “opportunity to have my thoughts heard” isn’t an absolute right, and it certaintly isn’t limited to this country. I’ve already been threatened as a result of expressing my thoughts - on this very forum, no less. The pleasant fantasy which you conjure about the absolute right to free speech is just that, a fantasy. The reality is that the U.S. Government can throw you in one of many secret internment facilities located throughout the country without a trial if it deems you to be a “threat.” This has already happened to thousands of people. Can you enlighten me on the apparent “greatness” of this country, since I am unable to see it?
What is it about this country that is so different from the socialist/welfare states of Europe? Is it the laissez-faire approach to government involvement in domestic matters? Nah, that’s been dead for over half a century. The government now takes half of the national income, as is the duty of any good welfare state. Is it a rejection of the bellicose foreign policy which led to centuries of turmoil throughout Europe and economic ruin for it’s participants? Negative on that. So what is it, exactly, that makes this country so great? Tempo, tempo. Cue the “if you don’t like America then leave” chorus of ignorance.
I never said anything about liking or not liking this country. I asked a simple question: What makes it so great?
Can you answer that question or not?
What makes America Great:
Bill of Rights
Amendment I
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
Amendment II
A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.
Amendment III
No soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.
Amendment IV
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.
Amendment V
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
Amendment VI
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.
Amendment VII
In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise reexamined in any court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.
Amendment VIII
Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.
Amendment IX
The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.
Amendment X
The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.
I got a kick out of this thread. i think it’s funny how many people will talk about things they have never even tried to talk about. I can’t be mad, you guys are just repeating what you’ve heard, but man…
It’s like hearing someone say that chin-ups are evil because they are bad for your knees… If you are going to ctiticize something, at least know what that something is!
[quote]jeru72 wrote:
I’m really envious of not living in the US, what with the ban on pro-hormones, ephedrine, just about anything that works for bodybuilding… not to say wasting public resources chasing people ordering roids :o)
About proving my point … de nile, its just not also a river in Egypt.[/quote]
So I am in denial about the US, and we are the bad guys?
Maybe you are in denial.
Take any one of our professed enemies, and go see how free and wonderful their country is. Go ahead.
The fact that we DO something about our world problems while you French sit around and complain that you aren’t a world power – despite your duplicity and treachery – is your own damn fault.
Sorry if that makes you upset, but we kick ass and you do not.
Nyah nyah! 
Hey Lothario, care to answer my question?
[quote]Al Shades wrote:
Hey Lothario, care to answer my question?[/quote]
Gimme a second, there’s folks bleeding to deatrh over here!
Okay.
I’m got some time now, so I’m gonna write a little story to answer Al’s question.
WHY MY COUNTRY IS GREAT
by lothario
Tonight started out pretty good. I got up at 8:30pm and got in the shower. You see, in my country we have running water, and what’s even better is that it’s temperature controlled, and it’s not contaminated with parasites or other pathogens. I can take a shower, drink a glass of water, or shave my face without getting sick. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
Then, after I got ready, I got in my car and drove to work. Some folks complain that gas costs too much. Others complain that our cars are messing up the environment. I’m just thankful that we have streets to drive on, cars that get us to where we want to go, police who try to be fair in enforcing the laws which protect the streets, and the fact that there are folks who care about the problems with the cars and the gas and the environment so that things don’t get out of hand. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
When I got to work, there was a little girl in room 22 who was crying because she was getting a shot. It was a sad noise, and the mom was a little upset that her girl was in a little pain, but a little while ago I walked past the mom and her child, and the little girl smiled at me. She is very cute. And it made me think that it’s a good thing that we are so good at helping people who are sick or injured around here. Some folks complain that medicine costs too much, and some folks complain that medical insurance/HMO’s are a problem, and sometimes I agree with them. But despite the staggering amount of work that people like me do, and how much suffering there is in the world to fix, I’m glad that I can choose to be a part of this great field, and that I had the opportunity to educate myself and to make enough money to do the things I like to do, and buy the things I like to buy. And despite the workload that awaits me in the next twenty years, I know that my fellow health care workers and I are equal to the task of maintaining the largest and greatest health care system in the world. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
I think I’ve gone on enough for now, and it’s getting close to break time. Think I’ll go downstairs and get me a salad and throw some chicken on top of it. You see, I live in the USA, and even though we have a free market economy, our government tries to make sure that folks who sell food, medicine, etc., aren’t lying to us and that the products are safe. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
This is just a quick, short list. I could go on all day, but I really am hungry. Bottom line: yes, we have our problems. But we can work to fix them, and the things that we DO have going for us, when you put them all together, makes us the best country in the world.
May the wings of liberty never lose a feather.
So how did the actual interview go?
Lothario, I really don’t feel like going through your entire post and pointing out every example of American “greatness” which also happens to apply to at least a hundred other countries in the world. So I’ll tell you what:
Why don’t you go through the post and come up with a single “great” quality that is unique to America?
This is basically a repeat of the original question. Obviously, the point went above your head. You’ve implied that America is somehow superior to the rest of the world. Yet in justifying this superiority, you name characteristics which apply to America as well as its allies, enemies, and detractors. Do you consider this rational? Do you realize that this is akin to a 5-year-old in a toystore proclaiming the greatness of a particular doll-on-display, refusing to part with it in exchange for an identical packaged version?
Yikes…you are insane.
Still waiting…
[quote]lothario1132 wrote:
Okay.
I’m got some time now, so I’m gonna write a little story to answer Al’s question.
WHY MY COUNTRY IS GREAT
by lothario
Tonight started out pretty good. I got up at 8:30pm and got in the shower. You see, in my country we have running water, and what’s even better is that it’s temperature controlled, and it’s not contaminated with parasites or other pathogens. I can take a shower, drink a glass of water, or shave my face without getting sick. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
Then, after I got ready, I got in my car and drove to work. Some folks complain that gas costs too much. Others complain that our cars are messing up the environment. I’m just thankful that we have streets to drive on, cars that get us to where we want to go, police who try to be fair in enforcing the laws which protect the streets, and the fact that there are folks who care about the problems with the cars and the gas and the environment so that things don’t get out of hand. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
When I got to work, there was a little girl in room 22 who was crying because she was getting a shot. It was a sad noise, and the mom was a little upset that her girl was in a little pain, but a little while ago I walked past the mom and her child, and the little girl smiled at me. She is very cute. And it made me think that it’s a good thing that we are so good at helping people who are sick or injured around here. Some folks complain that medicine costs too much, and some folks complain that medical insurance/HMO’s are a problem, and sometimes I agree with them. But despite the staggering amount of work that people like me do, and how much suffering there is in the world to fix, I’m glad that I can choose to be a part of this great field, and that I had the opportunity to educate myself and to make enough money to do the things I like to do, and buy the things I like to buy. And despite the workload that awaits me in the next twenty years, I know that my fellow health care workers and I are equal to the task of maintaining the largest and greatest health care system in the world. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
I think I’ve gone on enough for now, and it’s getting close to break time. Think I’ll go downstairs and get me a salad and throw some chicken on top of it. You see, I live in the USA, and even though we have a free market economy, our government tries to make sure that folks who sell food, medicine, etc., aren’t lying to us and that the products are safe. And that’s one of the things that makes my country great.
This is just a quick, short list. I could go on all day, but I really am hungry. Bottom line: yes, we have our problems. But we can work to fix them, and the things that we DO have going for us, when you put them all together, makes us the best country in the world.
May the wings of liberty never lose a feather.[/quote]
Lothario-
Great post!! You are one of the best posters on this board.
Well done.