Excessive or Well Deserved?

Off Topic
141

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Soulja874 wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Soulja874 wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
Even in your home or place of business this could be considered unacceptable.
[/quote]

Pretty sure you can shoot anyone who invades your home in Texas and several other states. I’m starting to think you don’t fully grasp US laws. [/quote]

?

Did I or didn’t I just post an article where someone killed someone in their place of business and received life? Did I say with absolute certainty that he won’t get off or did I just express my opinion based on what I read in another case with similar details?

Furthermore, what is your legal background? Do you have a Juris Doctorate?[/quote]

I made a statement towards what kind of reaction the Texas state law deems appropriate when someone invades one’s home. Not one’s place of business.

I don’t have a law degree but we both know you don’t need one to comprehend one’s state giving rights.

When it comes down to it I’m a US citizen who seen the US justice system at work on a personal level. Can you say the same?
[/quote]

The point was, they are both on the person’s property, why I mentioned home or place of business.

Unless you have personal experience with self-defense cases you are not in any better position than anyone else on this forum to comment.

Also. debraD lives in British Columbia, why aren’t you questioning her?

[/quote]

Uh, holding up hand in the back of the classroom (even though my fucking posts take 30 minutes to appear). I have PERSONAL EXPERIENCE with self-defense cases. Uh, I was a personal protection specialist (bodyguard) with my own agency.
[/quote]

I figured as much, that’s why in a later post I said 95% of people in this thread shouldn’t be commenting by Soulja’s logic.

Congrats - you are the 5%.

142

[quote]Soulja874 wrote:

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]Soulja874 wrote:

I don’t have a law degree but we both know you don’t need one to comprehend people’s state given rights.
[/quote]

Yes, you do. That’s why there are lawyers, and people who defend themselves never win.
[/quote]

This is silly, I didn’t say anything about defending yourself in a court of law.

Are you telling me you have to be a lawyer to know what rights you do and do not have?[/quote]

Well, you can think you have all kinds of rights. Most people think this way.

Then they get in court and find out the rights that they do have are nothing like they thought they were.

And… yea, that’s why we’ve got lawyers. If everyone knew exactly what rights they had there wouldn’t be any reason for them, would there?

Case in point: this thread, where people are talking about the “right to defend themselves” which apparently means they’re allowed to put one between the eyes of every mugger out there.

143

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Soulja874 wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:

[quote]Soulja874 wrote:

[quote]therajraj wrote:
Even in your home or place of business this could be considered unacceptable.
[/quote]

Pretty sure you can shoot anyone who invades your home in Texas and several other states. I’m starting to think you don’t fully grasp US laws. [/quote]

?

Did I or didn’t I just post an article where someone killed someone in their place of business and received life? Did I say with absolute certainty that he won’t get off or did I just express my opinion based on what I read in another case with similar details?

Furthermore, what is your legal background? Do you have a Juris Doctorate?[/quote]

I made a statement towards what kind of reaction the Texas state law deems appropriate when someone invades one’s home. Not one’s place of business.

I don’t have a law degree but we both know you don’t need one to comprehend one’s state giving rights.

When it comes down to it I’m a US citizen who seen the US justice system at work on a personal level. Can you say the same?
[/quote]

The point was, they are both on the person’s property, why I mentioned home or place of business.

Unless you have personal experience with self-defense cases you are not in any better position than anyone else on this forum to comment.

Also. debraD lives in British Columbia, why aren’t you questioning her?

[/quote]

Uh, holding up hand in the back of the classroom (even though my fucking posts take 30 minutes to appear). I have PERSONAL EXPERIENCE with self-defense cases. Uh, I was a personal protection specialist (bodyguard) with my own agency.
[/quote]

I figured as much, that’s why in a later post I said 95% of people in this thread shouldn’t be commenting by Soulja’s logic.

Congrats - you are the 5%. [/quote]

I’m getting a funny mental picture of BG squeezed into a small wobbly school desk at the back of a classroom.

You two knuckleheads were arguing the same point, btw.

144

[quote]groo wrote:

[quote]Ct. Rockula wrote:
STOP STOP STOP OMG STOP

Ho bout YOU stop it?

fuck, I hate how you cant even have a fight in public without it ending up online…[/quote]
Yah its too bad he’s gonna go back to prison in all likelihood. I like it when irony and karma come together though. When she slaps him and says “what you gonna do pussy”. If only she could have known he had just pulled ten years for murder and I am sure had learned every fucking day if someone comes at you you meet them with massive force.[/quote]

He will not go back to prison. that person went where he wasn’t supposed to go. he posed a threat. this man defended himself. He can easily claim, the man kept on trying to grab him, thats why he kept hitting him for his refusal to stop.

145

this all stems from the american woman attitude problem. American women act like no other women in the world. Go to japan, and lets see if you ever find a japanese woman doing that to a man. they wouldn’t dare, they have respect. they are raised to have respect(as they should) for men. I can think of no other country where this is the case. I have always said, american women have the worset attiudes of any women in the world. they are highly aggressive and argumentative. Let an Iraqy woman try that.

I say this woman got what was comin to her. girls in this country need to be raised to have respect for men and appreciate the fact that men can, if they so choose, to severly hurt a girl. they need to understand this before they get in a mans face and utter nonsense.

146

[quote]debraD wrote:

[quote]So What wrote:
However, the common belief is that a man is willing to partake(or HAS to be) in violence always whenever provoked, so he must have enjoyed this, right…?
[/quote]

Wha?? Where’d you gather that from?[/quote]

In other words, some may not see that he may have HAD to defend himself and was forced into hurting them, even if he did choose a very direct way of dealing with it at the moment, but it didn’t look like he had the luxury to stop and analyze. Still, not saying he didn’t go overboard. I don’t know what the gestures/intent of the women was anyway.

Any strike meant to defend yourself and thus de-escalate the physically violent situation is justified, any other is not. Now you be the judge.

147

[quote]TheBodyGuard wrote:
And maybe you guys didn’t read the article. The “ladies” were charged with crimes. [/quote]

I think the issue is that they aren’t being charged with assault. Correct me if I’m wrong, but that video is about as cut-and-dry as it gets when it comes to assault: no provocation, relatively violent slap/punch, contact.

148

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
Go to japan, and lets see if you ever find a japanese woman doing that to a man. they wouldn’t dare, they have respect. they are raised to have respect(as they should) for men.[/quote]

Dude, I once pissed off a Japanese woman so much (simply by not calling her back after a date) that she broke into my apartment, hid in a kitchen cupboard - presumably for several hours - and started hurling my own dishes at me after I arrived home from work.

149

I hope Mcdonalds gets that cashier a good lawyer. what happened to him was bullshit. if someone leaps over the counter to attack me I assume they are fucking crazy and have a history of violence.

150

640×841 101 KB

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
this all stems from the american woman attitude problem. American women act like no other women in the world. Go to japan, and lets see if you ever find a japanese woman doing that to a man. they wouldn’t dare, they have respect. they are raised to have respect(as they should) for men. I can think of no other country where this is the case. I have always said, american women have the worset attiudes of any women in the world. they are highly aggressive and argumentative. Let an Iraqy woman try that.

I say this woman got what was comin to her. girls in this country need to be raised to have respect for men and appreciate the fact that men can, if they so choose, to severly hurt a girl. they need to understand this before they get in a mans face and utter nonsense. [/quote]
Dude I am happy you are bringing it to this thread! And in honor of that I am going to give you the.

151

Ok rajraj and whoever. The castle doctrine isn’t active in every state. But Texas in particular has a very liberal interpretation of the right to use deadly force to defend one’s property…note not oneself.

“A person who has a right to be present at the location where the deadly force is used, who has not provoked the person against whom the deadly force is used, and who is not engaged in criminal activity at the time the deadly force is used is not required to retreat before using deadly force as described by this section.”

This is one small part of the Texas castle law but it illustrates how loosely its going to be interpreted in Texas. You don’t even have to retreat you can just kill them.
What a difference one state makes. In March of this year in response to that very same case you mention Oklahoma changed their castle law to extend to your business which it had not done prior to this. So the same case now the guy would be walking around free. Likely he will be set free or pardoned anyway. My bet is on the pardon because they used his “murder” to convict the other 2 guys of first degree murder.

Assuming he wasn’t a felon and could concealed carry this guy would have been much better off shooting and killing both women after they came across the counter from a purely legal defense standpoint. This is much the same in defending your home though its much better in home defense since you’ll be the only witness left alive.

152

I used to work for McDonalds and that weapon he was hitting them with is soft.

Bye, Rihanna.

153

[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
Go to japan, and lets see if you ever find a japanese woman doing that to a man. they wouldn’t dare, they have respect. they are raised to have respect(as they should) for men.[/quote]

Dude, I once pissed off a Japanese woman so much (simply by not calling her back after a date) that she broke into my apartment, hid in a kitchen cupboard - presumably for several hours - and started hurling my own dishes at me after I arrived home from work.[/quote]

Dated a legitimate ninja huh? Awesome.

154

[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
I used to work for McDonalds and that weapon he was hitting them with is soft.

Bye, Rihanna.[/quote]

What was it?

155

[quote]debraD wrote:

[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
I used to work for McDonalds and that weapon he was hitting them with is soft.

Bye, Rihanna.[/quote]

What was it?[/quote]

From my misspent years in food service it looked like a tool to poke through the drainage holes in fryers to push out clogs. Usually a nice bit of whippy steel. I wouldn’t call it soft though.

156

Interesting how they amended the law in OK after the incident.

I think B.L.U. Ninja is just trying to say it isn’t a hard piece of metal like a tire iron or something. The fact that the cashier was able to fracture a skull makes it “hard enough”

157

Rayon McIntosh just lived my fantasy . . . hope he doesn’t go to jail.

158

[quote]groo wrote:

[quote]debraD wrote:

[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
I used to work for McDonalds and that weapon he was hitting them with is soft.

Bye, Rihanna.[/quote]

What was it?[/quote]

From my misspent years in food service it looked like a tool to poke through the drainage holes in fryers to push out clogs. Usually a nice bit of whippy steel. I wouldn’t call it soft though.[/quote]

You can hardly classify it as metal.

It could be that thing you use to scoop out the little left over fries/crumbles from the fryer or what GROO said, the one you use to unclog the fryer.

It made whipping sounds if I’m not mistaken, but its not as lethal as a tire iron.

And IMO, it wasn’t excessive. Dude was acting on self defense and it a 2-1 mismatch.

People like that deserve getting beat, if they get off easy, they’re more inclined to do it again. It’s like when you don’t spank kids, they’ll think they can do whatever the fuck they want and will not suffer any consequences.

We don’t know what the whole argument is about though and how exactly it came about.

159

[quote]PimpBot5000 wrote:

[quote]roguevampire wrote:
Go to japan, and lets see if you ever find a japanese woman doing that to a man. they wouldn’t dare, they have respect. they are raised to have respect(as they should) for men.[/quote]

Dude, I once pissed off a Japanese woman so much (simply by not calling her back after a date) that she broke into my apartment, hid in a kitchen cupboard - presumably for several hours - and started hurling my own dishes at me after I arrived home from work.[/quote]

I’m not talking about a japanese woman in this country. Shes an american woman. I’m talking in japan. They are raised differently there. All women here suffer from the same attitude.

160

Fighting Irish,

How can you say that you definitively saw excessive force? Unless you saw a different angle than I did, I saw someone defend himself against two attackers, and then strike them again when attempted to get up (again, neutralizing an obvious threat). I also saw some reactions by co-workers that make me think he MAY HAVE gone too far BUT I DON’T KNOW WHAT HAPPENED. Neither you nor I saw it in that video. Now, if it comes out that the witnesses say he was obviously excessive, then fine. Until then, I will ALWAYS side with the person defending himself/herself in an assault. Period.

my 2 cents anyway.

By the way, Bodyguard, isn’t that exactly how you are supposed to achieve compliance with an attacker? A million years ago, I had to learn pressure point control tactics; and, as I remember it anyway, I was taught to continue to apply force until submission. (eg, “stay down! STAY DOWN!” and continue applying force/pain until compliance). I had thought that was the exact way I was supposed to “be legal” even if injuries occurred during the fight. Is it different for strikes?