[quote]ephrem wrote:<<< In an earlier post I told you I don’t know if a god exists, but that doesn’t mean we can’t know anything for certain. >>>[/quote]You’ve been telling me since I’ve known you that we can’t know ANYTHING for certain. Unless I’ve misunderstood. You indeed do not know if A god exists. You DO know that THE God exists. You can’t help it. That’s where your and everybody else’s certainty comes from. God, and not just any ol God, is unavoidably revealed in absolutely EVERY fact of reality and especially in you yourself having been created in His image which you still bear, broken though it is in sin. Once you object to this I’ll have to quote Romans 1 again.[quote]ephrem wrote:<<< You know you’d fall to your death if you jump off a tall building without a parachute or safety net, don’t you? >>>[/quote]Yes I do. I have a very good reason for this. On your declared world view you have ultimately NO reason whatsoever. You are stealing my certainty, actually God’s, in order to live your life because left to yourself you are in bondage to an utterly meaningless probability. (you won’t be able to resist this one)[quote]ephrem wrote:<<< Similarly, if you have a single item and then you’re given another single item, there are two items in your possession. You really don’t need to make this complicated, because it is not complicated. That’s why I say you try to confuse things.
Keep it simple stupid![/quote]Let me apologize for launching this thread in haste. Major mistake on my part. Epistemology is not a Christian term. It is a philosophical term. It is that area of philosophy wherein men seek to discover HOW anything whatever is known at all. Everybody has one of two. The following is THE Christian one. I have not gone to the throne of grace in prayer yet with a single believer who does not pray in strict accordance with what this says regardless of what they might say otherwise. Could I ask you respectfully to please read this carefully?
The Westminster Confession of Faith, 365 years ago, Chapter 2, section 2:[quote]II. God hath all life, glory, goodness, blessedness, in and of himself; and is alone in and unto himself all-sufficient, not standing in need of any creatures which he hath made, nor deriving any glory from them, but only manifesting his own glory in, by, unto, and upon them; he is the alone foundation of all being, of whom, through whom, and to whom, are all things; and hath most sovereign dominion over them, to do by them, for them, or upon them, whatsoever himself pleaseth. In his sight all things are open and manifest; his knowledge is infinite, infallible, and independent upon the creature; so as nothing is to him contingent or uncertain. He is most holy in all his counsels, in all his works, and in all his commands. To him is due from angels and men, and every other creature, whatsoever worship, service, or obedience he is pleased to require of them.[/quote]Ohhhhh my dear friend. It don’t get no better than that. I know 5 year old children who get it. I also know a 101 year old women who also gets it. It IS simple, but utterly foreign.
Unbelievers exalt themselves, by faith, oh yes they do, as ultimate judge. Insolently requiring even God their creator answer to their finite probings. They reduce Him by this very act to the status of fellow creature. One contingent entity examining another the end of which can only be skepticism as Elder Forlife so rightly concluded.
Believers BEGIN with surrender to the triune(we’ll get to that part) non contingent all governing, all knowing God above. HIS “infinite, infallible knowledge” which is “independent upon the creature; so as nothing is to him contingent or uncertain.” is theirs also by faith.
Unbelievers live in the believers universe and hence pragmatically live like believers. No choice.
Believers live like believers on purpose.
The former live in damnable rebellion as do the latter until they are saved from it by the infallible non contingent election of God in Christ.
The lesson I use for children is a drawing of a big king on a big throne with a little person standing in front of it. See that king boys n girls? That’s you before Jesus saves you, staring down at God deciding whether He’s really there and whether He gets to be king or not. After He saves you? You see that He was the King all along.
