[quote]NorCal916 wrote:
[quote]SexMachine wrote:
[quote]NorCal916 wrote:
Dr. Savage…
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“All you have to do is Google his name, Google ‘Allen Ginsberg,’ Google ‘Fiji,’ and all kinds of stuff comes up.” - Mark Levin
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The World Bank behind the disappearance of the Malaysian airliner is my favorite. [/quote]
I also like that John Connally delivered JFK’s fatal headshot in the limo on that fateful day…
I know a guy that has a nice sailboat and some people in his yacht club are talkin’ about buggin’ out if it shows up in NYC. His boat is a nice 30-footer with a lot of amenities, inboard diesel, big fresh water tank, etc. He figures that him and his wife can provision it for up to 3 months if they eat fairly lean and catch some fish along the way.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
Research article on genomic sequencing of the Ebola strains. Disturbing conclusions to be drawn
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/345/6202/1369.full[/quote]
I don’t understand all the science, but the in memoriam tribute there at the bottom of that article is sobering. Five of the co-authors have since succumbed to the virus. Just terrible.
Thanks for putting up the full text of the Bruce Aylward (WHO) interview from Science yesterday. Wow. The TV news really seems to be glossing over all of this. I’m sure they don’t want to create panic in Dallas.
BTW, the airline stocks took a hit with all the ebola news. If there was a big outbreak, people would stop flying.
I wonder why we can forbid American planes from flying to Israel because Hamas terrorist rocket attacks made it too dangerous but this Administration refuses to disallow flights from countries that have not contained Ebola from flying here? Why is the president more concerned with the “rights” of foreign nationals who carry or potentially carry deadly diseases than the safety of American citizens?
[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
Research article on genomic sequencing of the Ebola strains. Disturbing conclusions to be drawn
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/345/6202/1369.full[/quote]
I don’t understand all the science, but the in memoriam tribute there at the bottom of that article is sobering. Five of the co-authors have since succumbed to the virus. Just terrible.
Thanks for putting up the full text of the Bruce Aylward (WHO) interview from Science yesterday. Wow. The TV news really seems to be glossing over all of this. I’m sure they don’t want to create panic in Dallas.
BTW, the airline stocks took a hit with all the ebola news. If there was a big outbreak, people would stop flying. [/quote]
There’s a bunch of science in there (but then I’m a science person lol), but part of the conclusions to be drawn are this: 1) the virus strains had a common ancestral genetic make-up that the recent outbreak strains have broken off from in a reservoir we didn’t find and 2) that the outbreak is allowing rapid mutation of the virus because of the expanding pool of hosts and rapid escalation of infection, and 3) that we need new tests to make sure that we’re not MISSING diagnosis from mutated sequences in our current batches of PCR blood tests…Let that one sink in…
One of the other virologists who has been in the hot zone and working on this actually mentions this need for updating testing methods in a different interview, but I don’t remember which. He actually said they had to modify some of their tests because they were missing some positives already.
EDIT again: I’m actually not terribly worried about Dallas. Response was fast and our contact tracing methods are light years ahead of what you have to deal with in a rural, undeveloped and under supplied country. The high speed internet and databases alone make it so much easier.
EDIT–found the interview where he mentions the gene targets in their blood testing. http://news.sciencemag.org/africa/2014/09/confronting-ebola-virologist-liberias-hot-zone
[quote]cwill1973 wrote:
I wonder why we can forbid American planes from flying to Israel because Hamas terrorist rocket attacks made it too dangerous but this Administration refuses to disallow flights from countries that have not contained Ebola from flying here? Why is the president more concerned with the “rights” of foreign nationals who carry or potentially carry deadly diseases than the safety of American citizens?[/quote]
I posted an article about that a little ways above… washington post I think. Check out the link. It’s uncomfortable but true.
[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
Research article on genomic sequencing of the Ebola strains. Disturbing conclusions to be drawn
http://www.sciencemag.org/content/345/6202/1369.full[/quote]
I don’t understand all the science, but the in memoriam tribute there at the bottom of that article is sobering. Five of the co-authors have since succumbed to the virus. Just terrible.
Thanks for putting up the full text of the Bruce Aylward (WHO) interview from Science yesterday. Wow. The TV news really seems to be glossing over all of this. I’m sure they don’t want to create panic in Dallas.
BTW, the airline stocks took a hit with all the ebola news. If there was a big outbreak, people would stop flying. [/quote]
Just the abstract for the basic gist:
In its largest outbreak, Ebola virus disease is spreading through Guinea, Liberia, Sierra Leone, and Nigeria. We sequenced 99 Ebola virus genomes from 78 patients in Sierra Leone to ~2000Ã? coverage. We observed a rapid accumulation of interhost and intrahost genetic variation, allowing us to characterize patterns of viral transmission over the initial weeks of the epidemic. This West African variant likely diverged from central African lineages around 2004, crossed from Guinea to Sierra Leone in May 2014, and has exhibited sustained human-to-human transmission subsequently, with no evidence of additional zoonotic sources. Because many of the mutations alter protein sequences and other biologically meaningful targets, they should be monitored for impact on diagnostics, vaccines, and therapies critical to outbreak response.
Thanks for the info/articles Aragorn
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
3) that we need new tests to make sure that we’re not MISSING diagnosis from mutated sequences in our current batches of PCR blood tests…Let that one sink in…
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This is actually one of the main things that has concerned me throughout the outbreak. When Sheik Umar Khan, the leading virologist in Sierra Leone died, it looks like he initially tested negative for the virus. I get pretty skeptical when I read some story like “Passenger x in major airport y suspected of Ebola but tested negative”
A rundown of some of the incompetence/ glitches that have happened in Dallas. It doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence to see the slow response to quarantine, how kids who were in close contact with him were allowed to attend public schools after he was diagnosed, the hazmat team waiting for permits so they could remove his soiled sheets and clothing, and more information about how he ended up being able to get on a plane in the first place, including his blatant lying on a questionnaire at the airport. I was stunned to see that checking passengers for fever and giving them a questionnaire at the airport qualified them to get on a plane. Geez.
From the Wall Street Journal -
[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
A rundown of some of the incompetence/ glitches that have happened in Dallas. It doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence to see the slow response to quarantine, how kids who were in close contact with him were allowed to attend public schools after he was diagnosed, the hazmat team waiting for permits so they could remove his soiled sheets and clothing, and more information about how he ended up being able to get on a plane in the first place, including his blatant lying on a questionnaire at the airport. I was stunned to see that checking passengers for fever and giving them a questionnaire at the airport qualified them to get on a plane. Geez.
From the Wall Street Journal -
http://online.wsj.com/articles/dallas-hospital-says-didnt-first-admit-ebola-patient-due-to-glitch-1412347096[/quote]
Yep. Although as far as checking for fever goes, that’s the first sign of virulence so if you don’t have a fever you can’t infect anybody…and really there’s no way to determine you’re sick either then so it’s somewhat of a moot point there. The lying is infuriating however.
First case of infection outside of Africa has occurred in Spain. Ebola outbreak: Nurse infected in Spain - BBC News
Admittedly, I don’t know a whole lot about this but the fact that she began to feel ill last week while on vacation and only went in today would seem to indicate a large number of possible contacts she could have had.
Edit: I am also curious to know how she became infected if she was aware that she was working with an already infected patient.
[quote]BeefEater wrote:
First case of infection outside of Africa has occurred in Spain. Ebola outbreak: Nurse infected in Spain - BBC News
Admittedly, I don’t know a whole lot about this but the fact that she began to feel ill last week while on vacation and only went in today would seem to indicate a large number of possible contacts she could have had.
Edit: I am also curious to know how she became infected if she was aware that she was working with an already infected patient.[/quote]
Yeah, pretty shitty all around. She should have known she could have gotten the disease when she started to feel ill and should have gone in IMMEDIATELY.
As for knowing how she got it working with patients…I’d say that’s probably pretty obvious :). Hole in the gloves or apron while cleaning up messes, needle poke while trying to get IVs in, hell the patient could have been fighting and spitting at her (many patients go delirious and get violent hallucinations). Could have been missing protocol while decontaminating, or she could have been working with people who were not in the ward (i.e. in open streets or not obviously ill with ebola rather than say…malaria) lacking protective gear.
Or she could have been under-equipped for protection, as many health workers there are–don’t have enough gloves or aprons or face shields so sometimes people just have to work with what they have on. It’s a terrible situation over there.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
As for knowing how she got it working with patients…I’d say that’s probably pretty obvious :). Hole in the gloves or apron while cleaning up messes, needle poke while trying to get IVs in, hell the patient could have been fighting and spitting at her (many patients go delirious and get violent hallucinations). Could have been missing protocol while decontaminating, or she could have been working with people who were not in the ward (i.e. in open streets or not obviously ill with ebola rather than say…malaria) lacking protective gear.
Or she could have been under-equipped for protection, as many health workers there are–don’t have enough gloves or aprons or face shields so sometimes people just have to work with what they have on. It’s a terrible situation over there. [/quote]
Wasn’t this transmission in a Spanish hospital? I thought that this was one of nurses for that Spanish priest that got taken back and given zmap (didn’t work).
I.e. the only ebola patient in the entirety of a first world country and they still couldn’t contain it. If so this is scary stuff.
[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
A rundown of some of the incompetence/ glitches that have happened in Dallas. It doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence to see the slow response to quarantine, how kids who were in close contact with him were allowed to attend public schools after he was diagnosed, the hazmat team waiting for permits so they could remove his soiled sheets and clothing, and more information about how he ended up being able to get on a plane in the first place, including his blatant lying on a questionnaire at the airport. I was stunned to see that checking passengers for fever and giving them a questionnaire at the airport qualified them to get on a plane. Geez.
From the Wall Street Journal -
http://online.wsj.com/articles/dallas-hospital-says-didnt-first-admit-ebola-patient-due-to-glitch-1412347096[/quote]
To be fair to the Ebola infected guy in Dallas, he probably did not ‘blatantly lie’ on the questionnaire. He was present when a young pregnant girl who didn’t appear to be infected with ebola collapsed, and it was assumed she collapsed due to pregnancy complications which is not unheard of, and he and several others came to her aid. The girl died, still assumed to be from pregnancy complications, and it wasn’t known until after the guy had already left Liberia that she died from Ebola. Basically, the guy did what any person would/should have done, went to the aid of a pregnant teen who didn’t appear infected. Something like 9 other people are infected due to contact with the pregnant girl. Her family dressed her and prepared her for burial with no idea she had ebola because she didn’t seem sick. When everyone is repeatedly stating that you need to show symptoms to be infectious, there is nothing unreasonable about how anyone acted IMO.
I don’t know why more fact checking wasn’t done before reporting this guy lied. Well I do know but it’s pretty disgraceful.
As for the other stuff, yeah what a fucking disaster.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
[quote]BeefEater wrote:
First case of infection outside of Africa has occurred in Spain. Ebola outbreak: Nurse infected in Spain - BBC News
Admittedly, I don’t know a whole lot about this but the fact that she began to feel ill last week while on vacation and only went in today would seem to indicate a large number of possible contacts she could have had.
Edit: I am also curious to know how she became infected if she was aware that she was working with an already infected patient.[/quote]
Yeah, pretty shitty all around. She should have known she could have gotten the disease when she started to feel ill and should have gone in IMMEDIATELY.
As for knowing how she got it working with patients…I’d say that’s probably pretty obvious :). Hole in the gloves or apron while cleaning up messes, needle poke while trying to get IVs in, hell the patient could have been fighting and spitting at her (many patients go delirious and get violent hallucinations). Could have been missing protocol while decontaminating, or she could have been working with people who were not in the ward (i.e. in open streets or not obviously ill with ebola rather than say…malaria) lacking protective gear.
Or she could have been under-equipped for protection, as many health workers there are–don’t have enough gloves or aprons or face shields so sometimes people just have to work with what they have on. It’s a terrible situation over there. [/quote]
I guess my point wasn’t so much exactly “how” she became infected but how it could happen. I don’t know what the quality of healthcare is like in Spain but I’m imagining it as being at least decent. How then did someone working in the healthcare field become infected when someone would be under (I would assume) quarantine? Maybe the healthcare in Spain isn’t quite as equipped to handle these situations as in the U.S. but I can say that, having had 2 infected patients brought to my hometown for care so far, this event raises some serious concerns for me. Is the healthcare field in Spain so ill-equipped that we are comparing apples to oranges?
[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
A rundown of some of the incompetence/ glitches that have happened in Dallas. It doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence to see the slow response to quarantine, how kids who were in close contact with him were allowed to attend public schools after he was diagnosed, the hazmat team waiting for permits so they could remove his soiled sheets and clothing, and more information about how he ended up being able to get on a plane in the first place, including his blatant lying on a questionnaire at the airport. I was stunned to see that checking passengers for fever and giving them a questionnaire at the airport qualified them to get on a plane. Geez.
From the Wall Street Journal -
http://online.wsj.com/articles/dallas-hospital-says-didnt-first-admit-ebola-patient-due-to-glitch-1412347096[/quote]
And in downtown Africa… they waltz in with guns and flame throwers… permits?, we don’t need no stinkin’ permits… thus the outbreak is better controlled.
[quote]Aragorn wrote:
BeefEater wrote:
First case of infection outside of Africa has occurred in Spain. or she could have been working with people who were not in the ward (i.e. in open streets or not obviously ill with ebola rather than say…malaria) lacking protective gear.
Or she could have been under-equipped for protection, as many health workers there are–don’t have enough gloves or aprons or face shields so sometimes people just have to work with what they have on. It’s a terrible situation over there. [/quote]
By over there do you mean Spain? They say she was fully suited up and are not sure how she could have had contact.
I don’t know, it seems irresponsible to me to not be somewhat quarantined, even if self imposed, after working on someone with Ebola. To go from cleaning up after the priest dies, to going on vacation is just crazy.
With that said it takes huge balls to do this work.
[quote]debraD wrote:
[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
A rundown of some of the incompetence/ glitches that have happened in Dallas. It doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence to see the slow response to quarantine, how kids who were in close contact with him were allowed to attend public schools after he was diagnosed, the hazmat team waiting for permits so they could remove his soiled sheets and clothing, and more information about how he ended up being able to get on a plane in the first place, including his blatant lying on a questionnaire at the airport. I was stunned to see that checking passengers for fever and giving them a questionnaire at the airport qualified them to get on a plane. Geez.
From the Wall Street Journal -
http://online.wsj.com/articles/dallas-hospital-says-didnt-first-admit-ebola-patient-due-to-glitch-1412347096[/quote]
To be fair to the Ebola infected guy in Dallas, he probably did not ‘blatantly lie’ on the questionnaire. He was present when a young pregnant girl who didn’t appear to be infected with ebola collapsed, and it was assumed she collapsed due to pregnancy complications which is not unheard of, and he and several others came to her aid. The girl died, still assumed to be from pregnancy complications, and it wasn’t known until after the guy had already left Liberia that she died from Ebola. Basically, the guy did what any person would/should have done, went to the aid of a pregnant teen who didn’t appear infected. Something like 9 other people are infected due to contact with the pregnant girl. Her family dressed her and prepared her for burial with no idea she had ebola because she didn’t seem sick. When everyone is repeatedly stating that you need to show symptoms to be infectious, there is nothing unreasonable about how anyone acted IMO.
I don’t know why more fact checking wasn’t done before reporting this guy lied. Well I do know but it’s pretty disgraceful.
As for the other stuff, yeah what a fucking disaster.[/quote]
No, he lied both at the airport in Liberia and at the airport in Dallas. The woman he helped died 15 days before he left for America. Authorities in Liberia have said they intend to prosecute him for lying.
[quote]SexMachine wrote:
[quote]debraD wrote:
[quote]Powerpuff wrote:
A rundown of some of the incompetence/ glitches that have happened in Dallas. It doesn’t inspire a lot of confidence to see the slow response to quarantine, how kids who were in close contact with him were allowed to attend public schools after he was diagnosed, the hazmat team waiting for permits so they could remove his soiled sheets and clothing, and more information about how he ended up being able to get on a plane in the first place, including his blatant lying on a questionnaire at the airport. I was stunned to see that checking passengers for fever and giving them a questionnaire at the airport qualified them to get on a plane. Geez.
From the Wall Street Journal -
http://online.wsj.com/articles/dallas-hospital-says-didnt-first-admit-ebola-patient-due-to-glitch-1412347096[/quote]
To be fair to the Ebola infected guy in Dallas, he probably did not ‘blatantly lie’ on the questionnaire. He was present when a young pregnant girl who didn’t appear to be infected with ebola collapsed, and it was assumed she collapsed due to pregnancy complications which is not unheard of, and he and several others came to her aid. The girl died, still assumed to be from pregnancy complications, and it wasn’t known until after the guy had already left Liberia that she died from Ebola. Basically, the guy did what any person would/should have done, went to the aid of a pregnant teen who didn’t appear infected. Something like 9 other people are infected due to contact with the pregnant girl. Her family dressed her and prepared her for burial with no idea she had ebola because she didn’t seem sick. When everyone is repeatedly stating that you need to show symptoms to be infectious, there is nothing unreasonable about how anyone acted IMO.
I don’t know why more fact checking wasn’t done before reporting this guy lied. Well I do know but it’s pretty disgraceful.
As for the other stuff, yeah what a fucking disaster.[/quote]
No, he lied both at the airport in Liberia and at the airport in Dallas. The woman he helped died 15 days before he left for America. Authorities in Liberia have said they intend to prosecute him for lying.
[/quote]