Don't Cross the 'Left', Cosby

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
21

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
For someone to wait years to come out with a rape allegation, it makes me question the accuser more than the rapist. Someone who waits that long wants money or attention, not much else.
[/quote]

I don’t know anything about the larger story or this particular case, but sexual assault victims frequently repress the assault and don’t initially report because of things like shame and self loathing. Someone who waits that long generally doesn’t get money because of the statute of limitations, but victims frequently come forward after years for a number of reasons, including that fact that they are, after time, in a better position emotionally to process the assault and confront their attacker. I’m not saying that in any particular case your assessment is incorrect, but it certainly isn’t a general rule so to speak.

22

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:
I’m normally with you boys on most of this, but this has been going on with the Coz for around 20 years.

And unless Hannibal Buress (the comedian who brought it back to light during a show a couple months ago) is a leftist stormtrooper, this theory is a little light in the loafers. [/quote]

Yes and no. While the charges may not have been created, why after 20 years is it suddenly on the front page? Because a comedian talked about it? Really?[/quote]

Maybe for the same reasons Woody Allen’s name came up after all these years. Has Allen said anything against the Left agenda for that to happen?

[/quote]

Woody Allen isn’t black. This is race baiting issue and Bill Cosby, a well respected BLACK MAN, tried to suggest that <<>> there MIGHT, JUST MAYBE, be some responsibility to be taken by individuals for their own situation. I know, I know, that’s a completely ridiculous notion (for which he paid the price).[/quote]

Look, I agree that the Left would benefit from trying to discredit him. I’m not lost on the fact. I was pointing out to DD that just because someone comes out years later to talk about something like this, doesn’t necessarily mean it’s conspiracy.

I didn’t see you jumping to Allen’s defense when Dylan Farrow came out to talk about after years and years. So are you up in arms about dragging Cosby through the mud just because the Left may be involved then?

23

[quote]cueball wrote:

Do YOU have any EVIDENCE these girls did it JUST for money? Or is it just your personal bias coloring your perception of the situation?[/quote]

If they accept some out-of-court settlement, that could very well be the case.

Also reading it, so Cosby allegedly date-raped her the first time. She’s pretty sure he did something. So she hangs out with him again?

24

So this is similar to Bill Clinton’s situation, right?

Compare and contrast the Left’s reaction.

25

[quote]MattyG35 wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

Do YOU have any EVIDENCE these girls did it JUST for money? Or is it just your personal bias coloring your perception of the situation?[/quote]

If they accept some out-of-court settlement, that could very well be the case.

Also reading it, so Cosby allegedly date-raped her the first time. She’s pretty sure he did something. So she hangs out with him again? [/quote]

It doesn’t prove anything either way though, does it?

A young girl under the tootlage of a mega-star who finds themselves in a position where their entire career could hinge on whether or not they talk isn’t plausible either? It happens once, she accuses him, and he uses his clout to blacklist her.

Is this not just as plausible as the other side of the coin?

It just seems that in the OP, since “the Left” is supposedly involved, it automatically put Cosby in the not guilty corner. Not sure why it has to be mutually exclusive.

26

It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’

27

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’[/quote]

Kind of like a woman would never hang out with a man who beats her ‘chance in hell’?

28

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’[/quote]

Kind of like a woman would never hang out with a man who beats her ‘chance in hell’?[/quote]

That was my first thought.

Amazingly people do stay with their abusers often enough…whooda thunk.

29

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’[/quote]

Kind of like a woman would never hang out with a man who beats her ‘chance in hell’?[/quote]

That was my first thought.

Amazingly people do stay with their abusers often enough…whooda thunk.[/quote]

Yes, there are exceptions to people avoiding those who harm them, but the objection to the veracity of her claim remains valid. A continuing relationship does undermine the credibility of the accuser.

Edited for clarity.

30

[quote]jjackkrash wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
For someone to wait years to come out with a rape allegation, it makes me question the accuser more than the rapist. Someone who waits that long wants money or attention, not much else.
[/quote]

I don’t know anything about the larger story or this particular case, but sexual assault victims frequently repress the assault and don’t initially report because of things like shame and self loathing. Someone who waits that long generally doesn’t get money because of the statute of limitations, but victims frequently come forward after years for a number of reasons, including that fact that they are, after time, in a better position emotionally to process the assault and confront their attacker. I’m not saying that in any particular case your assessment is incorrect, but it certainly isn’t a general rule so to speak. [/quote]

This.

Being assaulted like that isn’t like getting punched in the face during a bar fight. Some people will never have “what it takes” to go public, because of what going public entails.

The other side is there is nothing to gain. Money doesn’t make the pain go away, the other person suffering doesn’t change anything. Fuck does it matter? Why should someone suffer in the news papers all over again, and be judged by the general public, when the result doesn’t help, and the road to the result ends up in more pain and torment…

EDIT: I don’t like the use of the word “repress” though.

31

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
No, my comment was suggesting people were too stupid to see it’s an attempt by the Left to flame Cosby because he didn’t go with them in lock step.

The Left loves diversity, just not of thought or opinion.[/quote]

I guess I’m questioning the validity of “the Left is doing this intentionally”. AC went as far as to suggest “the Left” is paying these people to come forward.

Why does it have to be a conspiracy? Can’t it just be Cosby has these views and is also a rapist without it being by design? Seems like grasping for straws to me.

AC himself said “Cosby is a good man”. Isn’t it just as likely AC has fallen prey to Cosby’s PR machine? Is Cosby NOT a rapist because AC thinks he’s a good man?
[/quote]

I don’t think Cosby is a rapist because he has never been convicted of or charged with RAPE. All we have is the word of some one who doesn’t remember if she did or did not have sex with him. Did he RAPE her? Or did he rape her? Or did he “rape” her? 20 years ago…

It’s a little late to get a rape kit. It’s also a little late to present ANY kind of substantial evidence. I think it’s a fair statement that Bill Cosby will not be CONVICTED of raping anyone.

Did he do in? How the fuck should I know - I wasn’t there. Is it in line with what I perceive to be his character? No it is not. Did Bill Cosby go against the grain “politically” very recently before any of this shit was brought up? Yes he did.

Are we innocent until proven guilty in this country? YES WE ARE. [/quote]

It’s not like it’s one chick coming out 20 years later. There have been numerous accusations over many years. I like the “innocent until proven guilty” fall back. Because none of these settled out of court, right? Oh, wait, they did. Just because he hasn’t been convicted doesn’t necessarily mean he didn’t do it.

[/quote]

No shit, Sherlock. Just as I can say it doesn’t necessarily mean he DID. Neither of us were there, though, were we? So we can only go by public record. If Bill Cosby were a serial rapist (as you are implying) he would be in jail. Period. End of story. Women have been smearing the names of celebrity men for decades. If there was a rape, she should have pressed charges. It obviously didn’t traumatize her very much because she didn’t. So I am not very inclined to believe her. Or the other money grubbing whores coming out of the wood work. Where were they back then? Why weren’t charges filed BACK THEN?

32

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
No, my comment was suggesting people were too stupid to see it’s an attempt by the Left to flame Cosby because he didn’t go with them in lock step.

The Left loves diversity, just not of thought or opinion.[/quote]

I guess I’m questioning the validity of “the Left is doing this intentionally”. AC went as far as to suggest “the Left” is paying these people to come forward.

Why does it have to be a conspiracy? Can’t it just be Cosby has these views and is also a rapist without it being by design? Seems like grasping for straws to me.

AC himself said “Cosby is a good man”. Isn’t it just as likely AC has fallen prey to Cosby’s PR machine? Is Cosby NOT a rapist because AC thinks he’s a good man?
[/quote]

I don’t think Cosby is a rapist because he has never been convicted of or charged with RAPE. All we have is the word of some one who doesn’t remember if she did or did not have sex with him. Did he RAPE her? Or did he rape her? Or did he “rape” her? 20 years ago…

It’s a little late to get a rape kit. It’s also a little late to present ANY kind of substantial evidence. I think it’s a fair statement that Bill Cosby will not be CONVICTED of raping anyone.

Did he do in? How the fuck should I know - I wasn’t there. Is it in line with what I perceive to be his character? No it is not. Did Bill Cosby go against the grain “politically” very recently before any of this shit was brought up? Yes he did.

Are we innocent until proven guilty in this country? YES WE ARE. [/quote]

It’s not like it’s one chick coming out 20 years later. There have been numerous accusations over many years. I like the “innocent until proven guilty” fall back. Because none of these settled out of court, right? Oh, wait, they did. Just because he hasn’t been convicted doesn’t necessarily mean he didn’t do it.

[/quote]

There are other reasons to avoid court other than knowing you are in the wrong. Has any celebrity trial you can think of:
a. Not ended in a media circus?
b. Vindicated the celebrity when they won in court?

33

[quote]Legalsteel wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’[/quote]

Kind of like a woman would never hang out with a man who beats her ‘chance in hell’?[/quote]

That was my first thought.

Amazingly people do stay with their abusers often enough…whooda thunk.[/quote]

Yes, there are exceptions, but the objection remains valid. It does undermine the credibility of the accuser. [/quote]

It does add the element of doubt, but “You’re not anything without me, you can’t make it out there without me” sounds a lot like “If this gets out, you’ll never work in this town again”.

Which, given the emotional control aspect of both these scenarios, makes it, in part, understandable.

I get the “why don’t they just leave” from a male point of view. Most men aren’t going to stick around for that kind of shit. But then, look at all the men in a relationship with a domineering bitch of a wife who put up with it because they’re a push over. Kind of like some women stick in a relationship with a domineering man because they are too emotionally weak to leave. They might even have been convinced they deserve it, or their life will be ruined if they talk.

34

He may or may not have raped anybody…my only point was, the left did not send their troopers after the Coz because he told black people to pull up their pants.

35

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Legalsteel wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’[/quote]

Kind of like a woman would never hang out with a man who beats her ‘chance in hell’?[/quote]

That was my first thought.

Amazingly people do stay with their abusers often enough…whooda thunk.[/quote]

Yes, there are exceptions, but the objection remains valid. It does undermine the credibility of the accuser. [/quote]

It does add the element of doubt, but “You’re not anything without me, you can’t make it out there without me” sounds a lot like “If this gets out, you’ll never work in this town again”.

Which, given the emotional control aspect of both these scenarios, makes it, in part, understandable.

I get the “why don’t they just leave” from a male point of view. Most men aren’t going to stick around for that kind of shit. But then, look at all the men in a relationship with a domineering bitch of a wife who put up with it because they’re a push over. Kind of like some women stick in a relationship with a domineering man because they are too emotionally weak to leave. They might even have been convinced they deserve it, or their life will be ruined if they talk.[/quote]

But the issue from any bystanders point of view is that them staying in an abusive relationship and them staying in a positive or neutral relationship looks exactly the same.
Now, of course the alleged emotional abuse makes this more difficult to assess, but it is alleged.

36

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
No, my comment was suggesting people were too stupid to see it’s an attempt by the Left to flame Cosby because he didn’t go with them in lock step.

The Left loves diversity, just not of thought or opinion.[/quote]

I guess I’m questioning the validity of “the Left is doing this intentionally”. AC went as far as to suggest “the Left” is paying these people to come forward.

Why does it have to be a conspiracy? Can’t it just be Cosby has these views and is also a rapist without it being by design? Seems like grasping for straws to me.

AC himself said “Cosby is a good man”. Isn’t it just as likely AC has fallen prey to Cosby’s PR machine? Is Cosby NOT a rapist because AC thinks he’s a good man?
[/quote]

I don’t think Cosby is a rapist because he has never been convicted of or charged with RAPE. All we have is the word of some one who doesn’t remember if she did or did not have sex with him. Did he RAPE her? Or did he rape her? Or did he “rape” her? 20 years ago…

It’s a little late to get a rape kit. It’s also a little late to present ANY kind of substantial evidence. I think it’s a fair statement that Bill Cosby will not be CONVICTED of raping anyone.

Did he do in? How the fuck should I know - I wasn’t there. Is it in line with what I perceive to be his character? No it is not. Did Bill Cosby go against the grain “politically” very recently before any of this shit was brought up? Yes he did.

Are we innocent until proven guilty in this country? YES WE ARE. [/quote]

It’s not like it’s one chick coming out 20 years later. There have been numerous accusations over many years. I like the “innocent until proven guilty” fall back. Because none of these settled out of court, right? Oh, wait, they did. Just because he hasn’t been convicted doesn’t necessarily mean he didn’t do it.

[/quote]

No shit, Sherlock. Just as I can say it doesn’t necessarily mean he DID. Neither of us were there, though, were we? So we can only go by public record. If Bill Cosby were a serial rapist (as you are implying) he would be in jail. Period. End of story. Women have been smearing the names of celebrity men for decades. If there was a rape, she should have pressed charges. It obviously didn’t traumatize her very much because she didn’t. So I am not very inclined to believe her. Or the other money grubbing whores coming out of the wood work. Where were they back then? Why weren’t charges filed BACK THEN?[/quote]

AC, your personal bias is shining right here. What you wrote comes off a bit callus. WTF with “obviously it didn’t traumatize her very much”, or “money grubbing whores”. Geez. You know more than anybody else in this thread about these women?

You sound fucking Jaded.

Here’s your casual “good man” comment:

[quote]angry chicken wrote:
Bill Cosby is a good man and it pisses me off that the left will stop at nothing to further their fucking agenda.

They’ll ruin a man’s legacy because he dared to cross them. [/quote]

Given the wording here and, as I mentioned before, your post history, It’s obvious you feel it’s the girls fault. If it even happened though, right?

37

[quote]UtahLama wrote:
He may or may not have raped anybody…my only point was, the left did not send their troopers after the Coz because he told black people to pull up their pants.[/quote]

This is pretty much where I stood as well. I just didn’t like the wholesale dismissal without firsthand knowledge, because “bitchez and lefties”.

38


This has got nothing to do with politics. It’s in the news now because of recent events - a comedian ripping Cosby; his response. Cosby has 16 separate women with complaints against him for drugging and raping them. Besides, Cosby is from the left.

http://www.newsbusters.org/blogs/matthew-sheffield/2013/03/05/bill-cosby-gopers-sitting-their-hands-during-obama-speech-equival

39

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Legalsteel wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’[/quote]

Kind of like a woman would never hang out with a man who beats her ‘chance in hell’?[/quote]

That was my first thought.

Amazingly people do stay with their abusers often enough…whooda thunk.[/quote]

Yes, there are exceptions, but the objection remains valid. It does undermine the credibility of the accuser. [/quote]

It does add the element of doubt, but “You’re not anything without me, you can’t make it out there without me” sounds a lot like “If this gets out, you’ll never work in this town again”.

Which, given the emotional control aspect of both these scenarios, makes it, in part, understandable.

I get the “why don’t they just leave” from a male point of view. Most men aren’t going to stick around for that kind of shit. But then, look at all the men in a relationship with a domineering bitch of a wife who put up with it because they’re a push over. Kind of like some women stick in a relationship with a domineering man because they are too emotionally weak to leave. They might even have been convinced they deserve it, or their life will be ruined if they talk.[/quote]

I don’t see the “I will ruin you if you leave me” would work on Cosby because he has been viewed in a good light for so many years. It might work for someone starting out in their career but not a seasoned veteran.

A controlling wife is not the same as a rapist husband/boyfriend/fuck partner. It is probably the most vicious type of assault, there is no way you could compare that to a nagging controlling wife.

I am more curious about the accuser, her background, and how thirsty she might be for a bribe to vanish.

40

[quote]MaximusB wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]Legalsteel wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
It’s hard for me to believe a woman would hang out with a man who raped her. And when I say ‘hard to believe’ it’s more along the lines of ‘not a chance in hell.’[/quote]

Kind of like a woman would never hang out with a man who beats her ‘chance in hell’?[/quote]

That was my first thought.

Amazingly people do stay with their abusers often enough…whooda thunk.[/quote]

Yes, there are exceptions, but the objection remains valid. It does undermine the credibility of the accuser. [/quote]

It does add the element of doubt, but “You’re not anything without me, you can’t make it out there without me” sounds a lot like “If this gets out, you’ll never work in this town again”.

Which, given the emotional control aspect of both these scenarios, makes it, in part, understandable.

I get the “why don’t they just leave” from a male point of view. Most men aren’t going to stick around for that kind of shit. But then, look at all the men in a relationship with a domineering bitch of a wife who put up with it because they’re a push over. Kind of like some women stick in a relationship with a domineering man because they are too emotionally weak to leave. They might even have been convinced they deserve it, or their life will be ruined if they talk.[/quote]

I don’t see the “I will ruin you if you leave me” would work on Cosby because he has been viewed in a good light for so many years. It might work for someone starting out in their career but not a seasoned veteran.[/quote]

No, I meant it the other way around. Ã? One of he is accusers stayed in the situation specifically because Cosby told her he would make sure she never got work from anybody involved in the business. Ã? This was back when he was “it”.

[quote]MaximusB wrote:
A controlling wife is not the same as a rapist husband/boyfriend/fuck partner. It is probably the most vicious type of assault, there is no way you could compare that to a nagging controlling wife.[/quote]

I know, and fully agree. I was just illustrating that it’s hard to look at a woman’s situation through a typical man’s eyes and see why they would stay. Neither situation makes sense, but it still happens. Bad comparison I guess though.

I am more curious about the accuser, her background, and how thirsty she might be for a bribe to vanish.
[/quote]