i have a part time job at an airport and I meet a lot of people . just to keep myself awake I usually start conversations with passengers I meet. i usually ask people where they are going, and after that i usually ask if they are going on a vacation or a work trip. if they say work i usually ask what they do. So far i have met a lot of engineers, accountants, law years, IT guys, people that work in marketing and consulting, and a crap load of people that work in sales.
i recently met a female who was moving to finland to attend college there. she was born in finland but was raised all her life here in the US. She told me how her parents were living there for the past couple of years and how education is pretty cheap and is free to actual citizens.
i was honestly pretty shocked when i learned about this. i heard of college being free in Europe but i didn’t actually think Americans were actually leaving the United states to actually go to school there.
I’m pre med so right now my goal is to try to get into medical school. my uncle who did attend medical school ended up graduating with close to 200k in debt. the idea of being able to go to medical school in Europe for a cheap price is pretty interesting.
that passenger was the first person i met that has decided to leave the US so they can go to school and study in another country. lately i have been wondering if most of those people actually stayed in those countries after they finished school.
do you guys know any that has gone to school over seas for cheap school? did they return back to the US or did they actually stay in the country they earned their degree.
I know a woman who went to vet school in St. Kitts in the Carribean. It was way cheaper than Penn St. Now she does horse surgery in Colorado.
My cousin got half her Nueroscience degree in Cologne Germany. But she paid her domestic school for those credits.
Don’t know any US resident who got a free ride in another country though. Probably doesn’t happen.
I read the vet bit, I read the Carribean bit and then I read the horse surgery bit. I confess that I had to go back and double check whether you said vet school or med school.
I know many universities offer scholarships for overseas students but I think most of those are for people from loser countries.
EDIT: I realise that I sound like an asshole in this reply lol
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You’re not a citizen of another country, so you likely would not get cheap or free tuition. You could study abroad through your US school, which is cheaper than most people realize but not usually cheaper than a semester at the college in America.
Also, typically other countries don’t accept med school diplomas from other countries. Meaning, if you go to Spain or Finland or Germany and get into med school there, when you try to come back to America as a doctor they don’t recognize it and you have to jump through a lot of hoops if you’re lucky or go back through med school in the USA again if you’re unlucky. It’s more likely you would have to go back through med school. I think there MAY be a couple countries that the US will accept a doctor from with a test or something but I’m not 100% sure and it’s not very many. And that’s also to say it’s unlikely another country is going to let you apply to their med school with no citizenship or residency in their country and a college degree from the US.
I don’t know anyone who has done it but it can’t be that easy if there’s so few people who have gone to another country for free education. Unless you can become a citizen of the country you’re trying to study in, you won’t get all of the benefits that are offered.
A friend of mine was born in India and there they start their med school at 17-18 years old. By the time they’re 21-22 they’re almost full blown doctors. But how many americans do you hear about going there for an education?
I work with the pre-health program at a University, where many of our students go on to attend medical schools each year. In all my years in my role as a professor, I have only seen students go abroad for medical school because of the lower bar for admissions. I have never seen a student gain admittance into a US medical school and choose an overseas medical school instead. Why?
It’s much harder to secure a residency after getting your MD at a foreign medical school. If you are going to a medical school in the Caribbean, it is assumed you are going there because you couldn’t get into a US medical school. This is no slight, as admission is very difficult into US medical schools. However, you will more than enough time to make up the cost difference by your salary if you attend a US medical school (assuming you are able to get into one).
As for European Universities and schools in other countries, as stated above, these are often subsidized and cheaper for residents of that country. Not for Americans looking to save a dime.
My brother in law and sister in law went to vet school at St. Kitts. I think this is less of an issue than for medical school. For example, I would allow a vet trained in the Caribbean to perform surgery on my dog, but if my wife needed serious surgery I would chose a US-trained surgeon.
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Lilbanbolt
Disregard pretty much every response you got in here as these people have no idea what they are talking about.
First and foremost if you have the capability to attend a domestic medical school allopathic or Osteopathic do it.Take the freaking loans put your nose to the grind stone and get to work. Trust me you will not have a problem paying your loans back provided you are not a complete idiot when it comes to managing your finances.
Now if you don’t end up getting in and MD or DO school then clearly the only logical path to pursue is chiropractic. Hah just kidding don’t ever consider that.
So if you are not able to get into a domestic school there are so many options. Some cheap some not so cheap. By and far the Caribbean schools are not cheap anymore. You might find a few that are but they are probably not comparable to what people consider the top 4 which are St. Georges, SABA, Ross and I believe AUC. At one point in time like in teh 70s or 80s people would could to the Caribbean because it was so much more affordable and not just because they couldn’t get into a state school. Now thats not the case. Most people go because they had no other option and its not so cheap.
But don’t want to go to the Caribbean then dont sweat it because there are a ridiculous amount of options.
- Ireland
- England
- Poland
- Czeck Republic
- Australia
- Mexico
- Cyprus
- Israel
I listed those countries in no specific order but those countries all have English based programs at various schools that Americans can attend. Mexico being the exception because I am thinking of the Med program at Guadalajara which is in Spanish so you would have to learn Spanish but it is a great program.
The cheapest one I believe is in Poland. All 4 years of tuition was something like 40000 USD honestly it might be even cheaper I might not have taken into account the exchange rate. The only problem is its in freaking Poland. But could be fun.
Point being is there are so many paths to becoming a doctor some cheaper then others.
Going to a foreign school is fine. You just have to make sure that you school is recognized by an accrediting agency. I forget which one. You also have to do slightly better then average on the USMLE step 1. Like a 245-250 thats like 60th percentile I think. Then you also have to get ECFMG certified. None of this is particularly difficult if you are aware of it and are proactive. The reason so many people say you will have a harder time getting a residency is because the data at first glance indicates this. Foreign medical graduates have a much harder time matching. The data is skewed though it doesn’t take into consideration all the non us citizens applying in the Match who probably have substandard scores because their english is bad and have horrible interview skils and dont have the cultural knowledge to interview well. If you do well on the USMLE and make sure you rotate in US hospitals for your electives or as many rotations as possible and then secure some solid recomendations/maybe get a little research experience and then dont have you expectations super how like thinking you will match at mayo clinic johns hopkins or harvard then you will be just fine.
I honestly think many international programs make better doctors because the American Medical Education system is not without its own flaws. Anyways hope this helps.
That last paragraph shows your ignorance.
The AAMC makes sure that everyone who practices medicine in the states is qualified. The USMLE is no joke. It is a very difficult test and many medical educators in other parts of the world think its a bit ridiculous in the amount of minutia required to perform well on that test.
Also if you are a surgeon in the states you are US trained. You don’t become a surgeon in medical school. You simply become a graduate of medical school. You apply to residency for your post graduate training. So if you do well enough on the USMLE and interview well then an American surgical residency program will invite you to continue your education with them and train to be a surgeon.
If your a surgeon in India and move to America and want to be a surgeon you know what you have to do do? You have to take the USMLE step 1 and 2 ck, 2 cs and then you have to apply to a surgical residency and then you have to go through that whole residency program and gain board certification before your a legit US-trained surgeon.
Hope that clears up your confusion.
Edit: I am shocked a professor at a university working in pre-health advising is this ignorant. Maybe you should consider resigning from your role in pre-health advising.
I appreciate the career advice for me. My capacity is in advising students on the courses required to gain admission into medical school, helping them be competitive or advising them of their likelihood, writing letters of recommendation on their behalf, and also being the dept. chair of the department that houses the University’s pre-health advisor. I am not an expert on the navigation through medical school nor the medical field itself, and the pre-Health advisor handles these details. I write about 10 letters a year to support students applying to medical school, and have sent 23 students to medical school from my own research lab.
The last “ignorant” sentence reflects the vast difference of talent and intellect between students I have seen that have gained admission and completed medical school in the US vs. the students I have seen go on to attend medical school in the Caribbean. I would personally have a large preference for the first set of these individuals to perform medical procedures on myself or a loved one.
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Well Dr. Antiquity I try an help people when I can.
In regards to your last paragraph. Medicine for the most part is not an intellectually demanding field. Obviously there are certain cognitive requirements but an IQ of 130 will not matter if you do not have the capacity to meet the workload. So it comes down to character and mettle.
Again to reiterate medical school is 2 years of basic sciences and 2 years of getting a taste of all the disciplines medicine has to offer. Thats not where you become a doctor.
Where do you draw the line Dr. Antiquity. What about the student who dropped out of high school worked for 10 years doing construction then went to a community college transferred to a 4 year uni then went to med school. Would you be comfortable with him seeing one of your loved ones.
How about the individual who had a significantly sub par GPA yet due to their under represented minority status still secured a spot in a medical program even though if they were not a URM they would not have. Can that person see your loved one?
The above mentioned situations are common occurrences and there is no data to indicate they make any less of a physician.
Why is that? As I said the AAMC and post grad training in the USA ensures that everyone regardless of where they obtained their medical education will come out as competent physicians.
I know medical programs that have applicants complete a portfolio and have zero prerequisite GPA/test score cut offs. They look holistically at the applicants. I know of one indivudual in particular who was a high school drop out. Eventually became a teacher and then decided to pursue medicine he applied was accepted and now is a MD. Your mentality is reminiscent of the elitist attitude often encountered in medicine. There are several divides. US trained vs non US trained. Then MD vs DO. Amongst MDs you have those who went to a top 20 school and those who did not. Or those who went to Ivies or not.
At the end of the day your decision to seek treatment from a doctor should be based on the competency of the doctor as an individual not on the perceived prestige of their alma mater.
Also as an aside. Most graduates from the Caribbean going into primary care not surgery. Primary care is desperate to fill spots and US grads do not want to do it. So be thankful for the Caribbean grads they do a huge part of what no one wants to do.
You have to look at the individual European nations as they have different rules when it comes to non EU students. Some offer tuition free educations but there might be restrictions when it comes to certain programs. I believe Finland is free provided you understand Finnish. Norway might be free as well for Americans. I don’t know if you need to speak Norwegian.