Dick Cheney

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Given that the Veep didn’t specify “overall” voting record, I think this can be interpreted as a criticism of Edwards’ record since anyone has known or cared who he is – namely since he declared himself a Presidential candidate.
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Actually, no. He said he had NEVER met him, since he had presided over the Senate MOST TUESDAYS. There was no stipulation about ‘since when’. Since this was such a potentially fatal comment to Edwards, it’s fair to consider this a dirty lie. I believed it until I did the research and found out the truth to be as Lumpy stated it.

The previous comment: Funny that they would bring out a prayer breakfast and a ceremony to highlight Edwards’ record.

If I were feeling snarky I might say that it’s certainly interesting that the Democratic VP cuts such a memorable figure that Cheney didn’t remember meeting him, and Edwards didn’t have enough faith in his own record to bring up any of the above…
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Since Edwards was actually present in Congress, and Cheney presided over the senate, it bodes poorly for the VP of an administration trying to unite that he had not sought out to meet everyone in the senate.
The pictures are to demonstrate proximity to Cheney and prove contrary the statements made by Cheney. We all know how disgruntled Cheney gets around other senators who disagree with him. Tell another senator to ‘Fuck off’, or ‘Fuck yourself’ (against senate rules on the floor) and then goes on Fox News to say he feels much better about having said it. I can understand why Edwards would not want to be around him for too many photo ops, especially since ‘becoming a presidential candidate’.

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Hmmm. To the best of my knowledge, the VP will often open the ceremony, stay awhile, and then cede the meeting to someone else to run if there’s nothing big or closely contested going on. The VP doesn’t actually get a vote unless there is a 50/50 tie, so often he won’t stick around to run the whole meeting. Again, to my understanding, this has been the practice for a long time. So he was there, did what he needed to do, and left – pretty much what you’d expect him to do.
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Why then claim to America that you ‘preside over the Senate’ most Tuesdays. That’s bullshit rationalization on your part.

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He did suggest it – once. One time, in one speech. He was mistaken. I don’t know whether it was simply a case of misspeaking, or whether he meant it at the time. However, one would think that if it were more than a misstatement he would have repeated it.
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He didnt suggest he never said it, he flat out said he never said it.
To say it was a slip of the tounge is a major downplay. He got caught and tried to worm his way out of the argument. Instead of facing the facts head on, and earn respect of anyone other than his base (albeit logistical suicide), he lied. Flat out. Lying about justification for sending us to war, which in my opinion is the gravest of political decisions. That very statement shot the credibility of this administration to shit. They can’t admit their mistakes in judgement, that is flatout spineless. So, they talk about resolve and courage. Sack up and admit your mistakes before claiming to me that you have the courage to lead me.

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BTW, as far as records go, Cheney should be evaluated on his record as VP and in the executive branch, as that’s the job he’s being considered for – If Edwards or Kerry had any executive experience, I would say the same about them, but you have to evaluate them on the best proxy, which in this case is their Senatorial records. It’s not necessarily a good proxy, but you go with what you’ve got when you have to make an evaluation.[/quote]

Fine, shall he be evaluated on his flying around the world making false claims abvout connections of Iraq to Al Quada and holding closed door meetings with Energy Corporate Execs while locking out the EPA to conduct the nation’s energy policy? Cursing on the Senate Room floor? What good has he done for this country while VP?

I agree that the VP spoke more eloquently and crisply in this debate, but (quoting ESPN Dream Job) “style without substance dont mean a damn thing.” If your facts are straight up lies, you have no substance. Anything else you may say is greeted with a raised eyebrow.

My saving grace to this debate is, though the pundits call it a wash, the real indicator, news site polls by people who care enough to dig around and let their voice be heard, show Edwards as having won 60-40 both cnn (650,000 responses) and msnbc (2.5 million responses) online polls.

I take it by your weak attempt at evasion that you concede the argument and admit to your ignorance and stupidity. Congratulations you have taken the first step in a long, long, long road to reality, which does in fact exist, just not in the fashion that you have imagined.

I find it interesting on this thread and elsewhere that the perception of victory and defeat is largely based on one’s ideology, and that is why our opinions for the most part don’t count for much at all. Our minds are made up and the whole point of the debates is for each party to sell their candidates to the undecideds.

The fact that Lumpy springs wood for War Criminal and the Ambulance Chaser as least as much as he did for the Sexual Predator counts for as much his depiction of Cheney as Burns.

I’d like to think that the only poll left that matters is the election, but with all the reports of preemptive election lawyering going on, if it ain’t close, expect a huge Mongolian CF.

On Cheney’s voting record:

MLK - not good PR, but compared to the damage that the Democrats from FDR’s New Deal screwing of black sharecroppers thru Sheets Byrd’s buddies to the Great Societies’ destruction of the black family structure and its continuing fallout have done it’s not even close. Typical Something for Nothings, though- hype over substance every time.

D of E- well, since tests scores have skyrocketed, especially among the least fortunate after it’s inception, I guess that’s a big Boo Boo. Yeah, right.

Meals for Wheels- like Uncle Sam doesn’t throw enough swag to the geezers already? Please. Typical Half-assed Socialists again- you’re not as good as me because you don’t spend your money like I think you should.

The Mandela thing- a little ouch for Cheney. He’ll get over it.

Personally, I would have like it if Cheney had gone for the jugular with a little more vigor. True, I think at this point all the Republicans are good for is preventing the Donkeys from doing even more damage. It would have been nice, though, if he made that phony bastard cry like the Breck Girl that he is. Tough on terrorists- shut the F up- who are they trying to kid? The Lumpys of the world have already bought in.

I must confess to having a very hard time watching anyway. While Cheney has gravitas or whatever one wants to call it, Dubbya makes me slightly nauseous and the John-Johns make me want to puke, though not as violently as the left-wing Senate Democrats.

Discuss this amoung yourselves- Any man who votes for Hillary in 08 ought to have his balls chopped off. Any T-man doing so ought to be shot.

BB: I know this is late, and I’ve been away from a computer for a week, but thank you for clearing that up for me. I guess it’s not such a big deal to not be the “presiding officer” as VP. I appreciate the time you spent figuring this out for us.