Holy shit, relax rainjack. I’m just saying that if the media is a big liberal propaganda machine, it sure as hell isn’t working very well.
I’m thinking that if the media were truly an organized propaganda system it would simply have to be more effective than it “is”.
[quote]vroom wrote:
Holy shit, relax rainjack. I’m just saying that if the media is a big liberal propaganda machine, it sure as hell isn’t working very well.
I’m thinking that if the media were truly an organized propaganda system it would simply have to be more effective than it “is”.[/quote]
I’m not worked up over this - if it seems as such, I apologize.
I believe that the media WAS an organized propaganda tool of the left. But because of other outlets for information, i.e talk radio, cable news, and most recently the proliferation of webblogs - the traditional media has lost their sway over the american people.
So, no - it’s not working well, and its attempts at propaganda have been exposed especially this election cycle.
Was that more sedate?
[quote]vroom wrote:
Zeb,
I don’t think the media is such a big leftist propaganda machine. If it was, surely it would be more effective than it is – based on the stats you just quoted.
Either that or conservatives simply don’t pay attention to media at all… heh, draw your own conclusions from that inference. ;)[/quote]
vroom:
In a close race the media makes the difference. Bush would have won by far more had the liberal media been truly fair.
Carter/Ford and Nixon/Kennedy- Both outcomes would have been different had the liberal meidia been fair.
The republican candidate has to overcome great odds, they always have, in order to win a general election. When about 80% of all news reporters vote democrat it’s pretty obvious who gets the favorable coverage.
An interesting site with a test that will place you on the poltical compass…
Speaking of one of my favorite subjects, media bias, check out this amusing and enlightening quote from California Democratic Representative Loretta Sanchez from Wolf Blitzer’s program on CNN:
http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0411/21/le.01.html
EXCERPT:
BLITZER: Welcome back. We're talking about the future of the Democratic Party with Texas Congressman Martin Frost, California Congresswoman Loretta Sanchez, Illinois Congressman Jesse Jackson, Jr., and radio talk show host Al Franken.
Jesse Jackson, Jr., is it the media's fault that the Democrats lost this time around?
[Jackson's response omitted. -EV]
BLITZER: What do you think? Loretta Sanchez, what do you think?
[LORETTA] SANCHEZ: . . . I believe that we made mistakes. The media certainly is not in our hands any longer, and, in particular, radio talk shows where that is completely in the opposition's hands, and they use it effectively against us.
BLITZER: But, Loretta, when you say the media -- when you say the media is not in your hands, are you saying that ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN are hostile to Democrats?
SANCHEZ: No, that's not what I said. I'm saying that -- if you would let me finish -- that the majority of people are now receiving a lot of their information out of radio. And the radio isn't in the hands of the Democrats anymore. . . .
Oh, I don’t know. The media took some really good swings at the Kerry camp as well. The not so swifty’s really kicked a few points out.
The media really doesn’t act on it’s own very much… it runs with the tripe being served up by one side or the other.
The key is to come up with the clever soundbites that really click in and are very easy to defend. The whole flip-flop-shit was precisely that. A two word problem “flip-flop” was easy to grasp but complex to explain. It’s not like anybody would listen to the other guy’s candidate long enough to actually believe an explanation.
Values and feelings of this nature were exploited very well – using the same “biased” media that was busy going with the more complex overthought material presented by the democrats.
The left needed simple catch phrase statements such as…
I’m not claiming I can make up the catch phrases, but whatever they should have been, they weren’t done as well, in my opinion.
These are bland, negative, issues based and very difficult to argue with without getting too complex for most people to bother listening… the feeling or value will already be tagged, logged and voted upon later.
So, hold your breath, I’m going to agree with the conservatives on something, the liberals have lost touch with the common person. The common person doesn’t have the time or the inclination to care about all the intricate policy issues faced in a world growing ever more complex. This, I think, is the root of the complaint about liberals being elitist coming from the Archie Bunkers of the right wing.
In summary, I don’t think it is a simple media bias, but I think the liberals have to use the media more wisely. Save the detailed well thought out explanations for those that actively seek them out, use the two word labels and attacks for general public distribution.
Hey, I’m good with words, any big pocketed dem’s wanna hire me for media strategy and slogan efforts? 
[quote]vroom wrote:
Hey, I’m good with words, any big pocketed dem’s wanna hire me for media strategy and slogan efforts? ;)[/quote]
Hehehe, vroom, you’re such a whore! You’d be perfect! I’ll call Hillary tomorrow, bro. I hope you don’t mind moving to DC…
P.S. When you say the word “about”, say it like it’s spelled A-BOW-T. If you say “a-boot” you might get your ass kicked. DC can be kinda rough. Good luck in your new career! 
vroom:
Keep in mind the “Swift Boat Veterans For Truth” did a number on Kerry with paid advertisements! This was not the media attacking Kerry. It was a political organization. It was Kerry’s fault for not responding quickly, (or should I say “swiftly”) enough.
What the rest of your post states in a round about way was that John Kerry ran a poor campaign. When you fail to come up with clever campaign slogans and proper media buys, you usually lose. It’s not a case of America dumbing down either (that’s a another issue).
“I like Ike” was the big “catch phrase” of the 1952 Presidential election. If you go further back you will see more one liners and catch phrases. "Win With Wilkie etc.
I know we are not on the same political wave length but…as to your final statement, I am considering a run for Congress and I would like to hire you as my Chief Political Stategist…KIDDING 
Catch this… Zeb, there is some truth in what you say. But you only acknowledge half of the story. While the swift vets for mistruth were busy spreading their dogma via paid advertisements, the media covered the issue as well, many times, for a long period of time.
The media plays what is going on out there… what the sides are saying… or paying for. Holy shit Zeb, it’s possible we are both right in some capacity. I know you’d hate that… but well, it’s possible blinder boy.
vroom:
You stated: “The Swift vets for mistruth.” I never put much stock in what they were airing, unlike some of my conservative friends. However, I wonder why such a large group would gather for the sole purpose of destroying a mans political future?
I wouldn’t be to quick to dismiss their original claims.
The media covering the advertisements was not unusual given the nature of the commercials. Again, the problem was Kerry not responding.
Now go eat some Turkey…and make sure you don’t take a bite out of your own arm
Why the bump?
[quote]tedro wrote:
Why the bump?[/quote]
No real good reason on this one. I just went back and noticed that this forum used to get at least 3 times the hits on threads that it gets now.
I am wondering why that is. No one is really reading this forum like they used to a few years ago. The average thread here only gets about 300 hits now.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
tedro wrote:
Why the bump?
No real good reason on this one. I just went back and noticed that this forum used to get at least 3 times the hits on threads that it gets now.
I am wondering why that is. No one is really reading this forum like they used to a few years ago. The average thread here only gets about 300 hits now.[/quote]
We’ve respond to every troll that wanders into the thread. Threads have become the same two trolls, lefty and righty, repeating the same argument over and over and plugging there ears when even their own side tells them to STFU.
[quote]Beowolf wrote:
Professor X wrote:
tedro wrote:
Why the bump?
No real good reason on this one. I just went back and noticed that this forum used to get at least 3 times the hits on threads that it gets now.
I am wondering why that is. No one is really reading this forum like they used to a few years ago. The average thread here only gets about 300 hits now.
We’ve respond to every troll that wanders into the thread. Threads have become the same two trolls, lefty and righty, repeating the same argument over and over and plugging there ears when even their own side tells them to STFU.
[/quote]
Agreed, but what are our chances of getting others to realize this so we can get things back on track?
There is almost no reason to post in a forum no one is reading.
We actually used to have long decent discussions here that would last for months…especially when it came to religion and George Bush.
Now, all we get is racially motivated threads and fear mongering about Obama.
The debaters in this forum suck now.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
The debaters in this forum suck now.[/quote]
I disagree to a point. I think a lot of the better posters have stopped posting as much, and we have a lot more trolls, but we still have some good posters left.
Thunderbolt, BB, VRoom, Orion, yourself… we still have some good debaters. We have a lot less good left-sided debaters though… at least JeffR is gone =D. Even HH can raise an interesting point at times. And PRCal and Lixy are certainly stirring up some conversations. We need Pookie back posting regularly.
It’s the idiots who repeat the EXACT same argument, without responding to anyone or offering any proof at all that are ruining the forums.
We also get a lot of repeater threads, IE: Al Gore Sucks! Bush Sucks! Fuck Global Warming! Obama is Inexperienced! McCain is Bush III and he’s old! ectect
We need some new, well thought out, philosophy entrenched threads. A thread about the philosophy of gun rights, about racism, about new music, about old music, about colonialism and its effects on Africa, about drug use, about socialism and capitalism.
I think the “Why do people care about Gay Marriage” thread is having a pretty good discussion if you wade past some of the retardation.
Conservatism is not about conserving, it is more than that; it is about preserving as in preserving the Constitution, following the rule of law as the founders intended unlike some of those activists on the Supreme Court and elsewhere.
Conservatism is about being proud to stand for conservatism and not being afraid to say it. Conservatism criticize those who pretend to stand for the little guy i.e. CAIR, ACLU, etc but don’t. Conservativsm is about tradition. Conservatism is about the love for capitalism and is for leaving private enterprise alone.
Conservatism is not being afraid to say that the US is the greatest country in the world with the best military in the world. Conservatism acknowledges past wrongs that the US has done and we do not pretend that the US is perfect. But conservatives do not live in the past with a chip on its shoulder.
We seek to improve, acknowledge what we have done to right those wrongs and move ahead. More importantly, conservatives will criticize other conservatives or those that say they are conservative but really aren’t (McCain, you listening?) There is more but let’s leave it at that for now. I have to eat. Conservatives like meat.
“Conservatism is not a political philosophy but a life philosophy” Mark Levin.
[quote]Footsolider88 wrote:
Conservatism is not about conserving, it is more than that; it is about preserving as in preserving the Constitution, following the rule of law as the founders intended unlike some of those activists on the Supreme Court and elsewhere.
Conservatism is about being proud to stand for conservatism and not being afraid to say it. Conservatism criticize those who pretend to stand for the little guy i.e. CAIR, ACLU, etc but don’t. Conservativsm is about tradition. Conservatism is about the love for capitalism and is for leaving private enterprise alone.
Conservatism is not being afraid to say that the US is the greatest country in the world with the best military in the world. Conservatism acknowledges past wrongs that the US has done and we do not pretend that the US is perfect. But conservatives do not live in the past with a chip on its shoulder.
We seek to improve, acknowledge what we have done to right those wrongs and move ahead. More importantly, conservatives will criticize other conservatives or those that say they are conservative but really aren’t (McCain, you listening?) There is more but let’s leave it at that for now. I have to eat. Conservatives like meat.
“Conservatism is not a political philosophy but a life philosophy” Mark Levin. [/quote]
Someone missed the memo
[quote]Beowolf wrote:
We need some new, well thought out, philosophy entrenched threads. A thread about the philosophy of gun rights, about racism, about new music, about old music, about colonialism and its effects on Africa, about drug use, about socialism and capitalism. [/quote]
“Well thought out” - there is your problem.
[quote]Beowolf wrote:
Footsolider88 wrote:
Conservatism is not about conserving, it is more than that; it is about preserving as in preserving the Constitution, following the rule of law as the founders intended unlike some of those activists on the Supreme Court and elsewhere.
Conservatism is about being proud to stand for conservatism and not being afraid to say it. Conservatism criticize those who pretend to stand for the little guy i.e. CAIR, ACLU, etc but don’t. Conservativsm is about tradition. Conservatism is about the love for capitalism and is for leaving private enterprise alone.
Conservatism is not being afraid to say that the US is the greatest country in the world with the best military in the world. Conservatism acknowledges past wrongs that the US has done and we do not pretend that the US is perfect. But conservatives do not live in the past with a chip on its shoulder.
We seek to improve, acknowledge what we have done to right those wrongs and move ahead. More importantly, conservatives will criticize other conservatives or those that say they are conservative but really aren’t (McCain, you listening?) There is more but let’s leave it at that for now. I have to eat. Conservatives like meat.
“Conservatism is not a political philosophy but a life philosophy” Mark Levin.
Someone missed the memo :P[/quote]
No I got the memo that eating meat is good. Oh wait, perhaps you are referring to a different memo?
It took less than 2 paychecks to take me from liberal to conservative.
Graduated college as a liberal thinking “fuck the man”.
Got a signing bonus and a real paycheck and then it turned into a conservative “motherfuck the man”. Keep your dickbeaters out of my paycheck.
I think people who can’t work deserve help, but those that choose not to be damned.