[quote]DrSkeptix wrote:
Why would they destroy their own aircraft carrier?
Apparently, among many things, you are unaware that China launched its first of many aircraft carriers this month?
You need to get out more often.
[/quote]
Maybe he needs to brush up on his reading/comprehension skills.
China 2011 = Nazi Germany 1939.
only a million times worse.
[quote]SexMachine wrote:
True. And I’m not disagreeing with Doc BTW. The recent carrier launch is an example of their intent to project power outside their ‘own backyard.’ And in relation to that example it’s worth keeping in mind China’s weaknesses and strengths.[/quote]
agreed,
and the Chinese do have “carrier killer” balistic missiles, and we should come up with a counter measure asamfp.
[quote]orion wrote:
Because reading comprehension is something you have just barely mastered?[/quote]
thats the kettle calling the pot black.
[quote]orion wrote:
Ah, but according to the Chinese the Tibetans are Chinese.
As is Hong Kong, as is Taiwan.
[/quote]
Like I said, Germany 1939, First Austria, then the Sudetenland, then Czechoslovakia, Then Poland…
[quote]Sifu wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]revamp wrote:
China has sent out a few warnings to us aussies that we may be caught in a cross fire if we allow you yanks to build a base in aus.[/quote]
Yeah well, you might. [/quote]
Orion you really are a piece of work. The Aussies are a weak country with a vast amount of land and natural resources. They are temptingly close to several countries with massive populations that could use the Lebensraum. They aren’t an insignificant backwater that isn’t worth invading like Austria or Switzerland. So neutrality is not an option for them.
If they don’t ally with the US, who else are they going to ally themselves with? [/quote]
I dunno.
But if they ally themselves with the Americans they might get pulled into a conflict between the US and China.
Mere statement of fact.
[quote]Sifu wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]thunderbolt23 wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
To cultivate that relationship with a relatively free economy while still clinging to statist fantasies, that was the mistake.
The US could have outperformed China, but not with their hands tied, their feet hobbled and a ball gag. [/quote]
Incorrect, because the issue is not strictly economic outperformance. It is a strategic mistake to allow unfriendly rivals access to your markets so that rival can arm itself by virtue of that relationship. Even if you “outperform” them over 20 years, they grow and sharpen their fangs, and in the process become emboldened. That’s bad strategy - better to let an unfriendly rival wither on the vine than help it grow strong.[/quote]
Look, they send you stuff, you send them ever depreciating dollars.
You have no complaints, you play as dirty as they do.
But, this is not as it has to be, this is how you want it to be.
You cannot cheat an honest man, but that is not exactly what you are, is it?[/quote]
How on earth did you ever get such a stupid idea as “you cannot cheat an honest man”? You are getting sillier and sillier. An honest man is the easiest person to cheat and take advantage of. Because he is the most trusting and least likely to see it coming.
[/quote]
Well then the US is in no danger, because their financial policies are far from honest.
Getting mad at the Chinese because they are better at it is just childish.
[quote]Gkhan wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Ah, but according to the Chinese the Tibetans are Chinese.
As is Hong Kong, as is Taiwan.
[/quote]
Like I said, Germany 1939, First Austria, then the Sudetenland, then Czechoslovakia, Then Poland…[/quote]
Well, if Hitler would have stopped at the Sudetenland you would be right.
[quote]Gkhan wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Because reading comprehension is something you have just barely mastered?[/quote]
thats the kettle calling the pot black.[/quote]
Maybe, but the pot IS black.
Orion, you are against the usual lot of timorous war-crazies. I don’t know how you can put up with all of these paranoid propagandists.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Gkhan wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Ah, but according to the Chinese the Tibetans are Chinese.
As is Hong Kong, as is Taiwan.
[/quote]
Like I said, Germany 1939, First Austria, then the Sudetenland, then Czechoslovakia, Then Poland…[/quote]
Well, if Hitler would have stopped at the Sudetenland you would be right. [/quote]
understood, but what if they take the next step? What if the world had stopped Hitler at the Sudetenland? What should the world do now? Nothing?
[quote]Gkhan wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Gkhan wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Ah, but according to the Chinese the Tibetans are Chinese.
As is Hong Kong, as is Taiwan.
[/quote]
Like I said, Germany 1939, First Austria, then the Sudetenland, then Czechoslovakia, Then Poland…[/quote]
Well, if Hitler would have stopped at the Sudetenland you would be right. [/quote]
understood, but what if they take the next step? What if the world had stopped Hitler at the Sudetenland? What should the world do now? Nothing?[/quote]
They would have had nothing to stop him with.
Chamberlain did what he did because he had little to fight a land war and because Hitler kind of had a point.
All other peoples where allowed a state, except for the Germans.
The occupation of the Rhineland did not help either.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]Gkhan wrote:
…What if the world had stopped Hitler at the Sudetenland?..
[/quote]
It would’ve taken a “timorous war crazy” to have stopped Hitler at that point.
In fact, I have little doubt LIFTI would still accuse the Allies of being timorous war crazies for engaging Hitler at ANY point.
I’m also reasonably sure NavJoe would’ve philosophically been comfortable with a permanent Anschluss. He mustsimply be disgusted that the Allies liberated his forefathers because his hatred for one of the principals, the US, is so intense to this day.
[/quote]
Over 90% of all Austrians were for joining Germany.
Its not as if we were occupied so you did not exactly free us from the Germans, just from the Nazi regime.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
Over 90% of all Austrians were for joining Germany.
Its not as if we were occupied so you did not exactly free us from the Germans, just from the Nazi regime.
[/quote]
Let me clarify: Austrians were for joining Nazi Germany and subsequently they were freed from Nazi Germany.
In other words they fully embraced Hitler and you know that, but you unsuccessfully tried to have us avoid the distinction, it seems.
So, an ambivalent lot ye be.[/quote]
They wanted to join Germany long before Hitler.
We had our fair share of Nazis, but that little to do with it, what was more important was that they went from a great power to a tiny nation in a heartbeat.
[quote]joebassin wrote:
Not my problem if you don’t like the truth.[/quote]
This is where US made its first major error RE China:
Mainichi Shimbun(Japanese newspaper) on hearing of MacArthur’s fate:
“MacArthur’s dismissal is the greatest shock since the end of the war. He dealt with the Japanese people not as a conqueror but a great reformer. He was a noble political missionary. What he gave us was not material aid and democratic reform alone, but a new way of life, the freedom and dignity of the individual… We shall continue to love and trust him as one of the Americans who best understood Japan’s position.”
[quote]orion wrote:
They would have had nothing to stop him with.
[/quote]
Nonsense. German army was literally non-existent before 1937. Between 37-39 it managed to get almost as big as the French army. When Germany invaded Poland they left literally nothing on the Rhine facing the Maginot Line. It was all bluff, audacity and the new “blitzkreig” tactics outlined by Guderian and others before the war. And Germany had been waging “fourth generation” warfare since the Nazis came to power.
The Anglo-French forces could’ve obliterated Germany whilst they were in Poland. They could’ve repelled the Western offensive in 1940 if they had not been stuck in a “static war” mindset.
Why am I not surprised to hear that?
Germany + Austria = 2 independent German states…1 + 1 = 2. Arabs are much better at this game than Germans.
[quote]
The occupation of the Rhineland did not help either. [/quote]
Didn’t do much good though did it? Krupp in Essen continued to produce heavy armaments in violation of the Versailles treaty all through the Weimar era.