I wouldn’t do it. Friends + business = problems.
[/quote]
definitely true and i try and avoid if possible
tbh if ever people do help me with things like that (eg if i needed some electrics doing) im usually the first to offer them some cash because at the end of the day… i cant do it, id spend a lot more on someone else doing it and i’d kinda expect the same back
but like i said earlier food and booze and the understanding the favor will be re payed is usually more than enough for things like moving out
If you don’t charge a token amount some people get defensive, and others just assume that you owe them the service in exchange for their presence, therefor, I charge a token amount just to keep things civil.
[quote]BigDug wrote:
I once tiled a friends kitchen walls. Took me 2 and a half days and they bought me a Bob Marley CD. A fuckin’ Bob Marley CD!!![/quote]
Lmfao… HEY DON’T WORRY, ABOUT A THING…CAUSE EVERY LITTLE THING… IS GONNA BE ALRIGHT.LOL
[quote]Mad HORSE wrote:
I helped a guy move once and he offered nothing. I actually did say to him, ‘How about a few bucks, y’know, for the effort.’ Not only did he not finish the quote, he literally only gave me a couple bucks. I stopped calling him friend after that.
If a guy really is a friend, the beer/food should be offered as a matter of course.[/quote]
[quote]attydeb2005 wrote:
There is a difference between helping a friend out and providing a service. Steel is providing a service that people who pay for. PMPM also provides a service that clients would typically pay. If I ask for something more involved than, say, a helping hand during a move (which is always food and beer for payment), I offer money up front.
I asked our IT guy to take a look at my home PC regarding an issue and offered him $50 to fix it. He had the part at his house. I know what the Geek Squad charges just to take a look. He was quite happy to take the $50 for what was less than an hour of his time. Sounds like you should have had an exchange for services rendered there, Chad. Too bad your friend didn’t pick up on that. [/quote]
This is how I handle things as well. If I need help with something I’m unable to do because of lack of knowledge, I offer to pay for said services at the time of asking. If someone offers to help me with something I can do, I offer food and drink. If I want someone to do something I’m simply unwilling to do, I will pay, friend or not. Common sense and common courtesy seem to have dissapeared in this ‘entitlement’ society. Just my .02 cents.
If I were, say, a lawyer and had to research the question they asked me and devote some serious time to it, I would probably charge at least some, but not my full rate. I think my friends would understand something like that.
Really, if it requires a lot of technical expertise and time, or parts, they should expect to pay somewhat.
But if we’re talking 10-30 minutes spent on something? Eh, big deal, I’ll lend a hand.
I never charge friends or family money, like a lot of guys here are saying. It’s more of a “I’m going to be starving after this, so if I agree, we go out macaroni grill, you’re treat”. They’re always happy to oblige, because it’s not like you’re treating them like typical customers. You’re doing them a favor and then asking them if they want to hang out later, essentially. Everyone’s happier that way!
It depends on what the help is. I’m a loan officer and I’ve done most of my friends’ loans and I have to charge a “house minimum” (my Broker gets 30% of the fees charged, so the “house minimum” is 30% of one point on the loan amount). When dealing with points and eighths and such, it’s nearly impossible to do a loan for FREE, so I always end up making a couple hundred buck, but NEVER the couple thousand bucks I would have made if it were not a friend.
If it’s other services like marketing, or setting up an operating agreement, articles of incorporation or something, I always just do it at cost (I don’t bill for MY time) but I’m certainly not going to pay any fees for them.
As for moving, all of my friends know the rule: pizza and beer when we’re done. Shit, I have one friend where he and I have BOTH helped one another move on our birthday! Strange coincidence, but like three years apart! (for that we agreed that a lap dance was in order!)
Good friends are few and far between. You take care of your friends. You have to be careful of who you let into your “inner circle”, because of both the obligation and trust involved. If you’ve chosen wisely, you’ll never end up with a misunderstanding about “payment”.
One of the most difficult things I’ve ever had to do was “un-friend” one of my closest “20 year” friends. He was down and out, so I let him crash on the couch. He then stole my car and all the cash I had on my counter (about two or three hundred bucks) and went and bought crack with it. He was one of the people that I could call if I needed a ditch dug in the middle of the night… If he needed a car I would have given him one. If he had needed money, I’d have given it to him. But he stole from me, so I haven’t spoken to him since. That was six years ago.
[quote]angry chicken wrote:
It depends on what the help is. I’m a loan officer and I’ve done most of my friends’ loans and I have to charge a “house minimum” (my Broker gets 30% of the fees charged, so the “house minimum” is 30% of one point on the loan amount). When dealing with points and eighths and such, it’s nearly impossible to do a loan for FREE, so I always end up making a couple hundred buck, but NEVER the couple thousand bucks I would have made if it were not a friend.
If it’s other services like marketing, or setting up an operating agreement, articles of incorporation or something, I always just do it at cost (I don’t bill for MY time) but I’m certainly not going to pay any fees for them.
As for moving, all of my friends know the rule: pizza and beer when we’re done. Shit, I have one friend where he and I have BOTH helped one another move on our birthday! Strange coincidence, but like three years apart! (for that we agreed that a lap dance was in order!)
Good friends are few and far between. You take care of your friends. You have to be careful of who you let into your “inner circle”, because of both the obligation and trust involved. If you’ve chosen wisely, you’ll never end up with a misunderstanding about “payment”.
One of the most difficult things I’ve ever had to do was “un-friend” one of my closest “20 year” friends. He was down and out, so I let him crash on the couch. He then stole my car and all the cash I had on my counter (about two or three hundred bucks) and went and bought crack with it. He was one of the people that I could call if I needed a ditch dug in the middle of the night… If he needed a car I would have given him one. If he had needed money, I’d have given it to him. But he stole from me, so I haven’t spoken to him since. That was six years ago.
[/quote]
Ya’ll gotta be pretty close to give eachother lap dances.
Good friends are few and far between. You take care of your friends. You have to be careful of who you let into your “inner circle”, because of both the obligation and trust involved. If you’ve chosen wisely, you’ll never end up with a misunderstanding about “payment”.[/quote]
This is very true. Never be cheap with close friends or lazy about giving them a hand.
Ya, I recommended one of my friends (knew him 6 years and we hung out quite a bit) to my brother to do his AC install. Friend fucked it up and wouldn’t fix it. I feel like a douche bag because I vouched for him. I don’t talk to him anymore. It’s sad really, as it was only a $500 fix. It really shows someone’s character when something like that happens…
I don’t charge my friends for my time. If it doesn’t take long, then why charge them for your free time? If it takes all day then we’ll sit down at the end and relax with food and beer, talk shit and catch up. I mean, aren’t you supposed to spend some time with your friends?
That said, whoever it’s for pays for the materials; you don’t end up out of pocket. And most of my mates are classy enough to pay for food and booze as well.
There’s been times when I’ve gone out of pocket; but it’s been for guys and gals that wouldn’t blink at doing the same for me.
Growing up I thought a case of beer was currency lol. Alot of the work done around our house that my Dad couldn’t do he had buddies come over to help and beer did flow. Hand-me down hockey equipment, yep, case of beer.
Like others have chimed in, most of my friends have a ticket in some kind of trade. Plumber, mechanic, electrician etc. Small jobs, beer and food. Bigger jobs, a few bucks that also includes a meal and booze. My skill?..I can dig a post hole like a motherfucker.
We did my neighbors roof a few years ago and he supplied the beer for the day. It was hotter than hell so alot of beer was consumed. He figured out that we all drank a case…each lol. It got done in one day but the bar bill was… signifigant.
My main job?, I hauled everyone of those fuckin’ bundles of shingles up to the roof. The only time they let me do a skilled job was to tar around the flashing and I guess I used too much tar and it looks like shit, oh well, I was really quite drunk at the time. He brought it up the other day actually.
I think if it’s really only going to be a small thing, or something like moving, it doesn’t really matter, most people understand that you took the time out, should thank you somehow. However, if it’s a bigger project like tiling or something that is going to take a while then they should offer something, maybe taking you out to a nice restaurant (and cover the cost of material of course).
Personally, I’m not the one to bother but I will be really blunt about it. Taking a trip to seattle I said it would be nice if you guys could give me some gas money. Or I’ll say hey, it will cost quite a bit so if everyone can chip in X amount. Your close friends won’t ever say no and they are happy to help. If they don’t think they have to pay, just call them out, usually solves the problem.
Beyond that, why would you charge a friend?[/quote]
For money.
I have probably had the following situation happen like ten times. It's around 6-7pm and I get a call from a CLOSE friend; not a stranger, not an aquantance, but a close friend. THey ask if I want to hang out. I accept the invitation and then at the end of the call they will sneak in the question, hey do you have any weed man? It can be a bit uncomfortable, but I always use the same response, "I do if you have money." I know that it's different when it comes to things like drugs and alcohol, but the general rule of thumb that I follow is if it's something that takes money out of your pocket, hell yeah you can charge them. If you are giving them a ride, you have the option to ask for gas money but it's not always necessary. If it's a matter of time, like the previous poster said, it depends on how much time you are giving them, and what you are doing. Haha, I just thought about all of the different careers. If you were a doctor, would you charge you closest friend for something? That would be funny if a psychologist was having a deep conversation with a friend and then gave them a bill at the end of the convo. That's something George Castanza would do.
If you are helping them, ie working alongside them then no. Or doing small things they can’t and they reciprocate no. However, if it is your livelihood yes.
For example I have a friend of 40 years who is a finish construction contractor. He has done a lot of work for me which I gladly pay for, because it’s how he makes his living. He is also helping me finish my cabin for free, because he hunts there, we get to hang together and I do shit for him too. A friend should not walk away feeling like he is being used.
With that said, I usually don’t ask for a lot of help from people except close friends. This is because I don’t have a lot of free time and don’t like being on the hook for helping acquaintances.
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
However, if it is your livelihood yes.
[/quote]
I don’t understand this part. Why does it make a difference if it’s their livelihood? I’ll use myself as an example. It can take me up to 3 hours to fix a computer or troubleshoot a network issue in an office. So if my friend drops his laptop off with me and I fix it in my spare time, I should charge him because I do it for a living? What if I was an auto mechanic who was good with computers and fixed it. Would that change things because it’s not my livelihood? Keep in mind when your working with technology you usually don’t have the client along side you. They drop it off and you fix it.
[quote]Testy1 wrote:
However, if it is your livelihood yes.
[/quote]
I don’t understand this part. Why does it make a difference if it’s their livelihood? I’ll use myself as an example. It can take me up to 3 hours to fix a computer or troubleshoot a network issue in an office. So if my friend drops his laptop off with me and I fix it in my spare time, I should charge him because I do it for a living? What if I was an auto mechanic who was good with computers and fixed it. Would that change things because it’s not my livelihood? Keep in mind when your working with technology you usually don’t have the client along side you. They drop it off and you fix it.[/quote]
That’s a tough call, as it’s a one-off kinda thing. I think it depends how much time you anticipate that it will take and how generous you really want to be with your time.
If you had a friend that was a contractor, would you expect him to come and install ceramic tile in your kitchen for nothing? What about if you want to put another bathroom in your basement? Should that be free? What if you want to build a garage behind your house? Can he charge you then?
Where is the line here?
My uncle owns a body shop, and he just put a new bumper on my car. Was it wrong of him to charge me time for it?
That’s a tough call, as it’s a one-off kinda thing. I think it depends how much time you anticipate that it will take and how generous you really want to be with your time.
If you had a friend that was a contractor, would you expect him to come and install ceramic tile in your kitchen for nothing? What about if you want to put another bathroom in your basement? Should that be free? What if you want to build a garage behind your house? Can he charge you then?
Where is the line here?
My uncle owns a body shop, and he just put a new bumper on my car. Was it wrong of him to charge me time for it?[/quote]
I understand what you’re saying but I’m not questioning whether someone should get paid for a huge job. There is definitely a line where you have to charge. What I’m questioning is why does it matter if you do it for a living? I know a guy who charges his friends labor for minor electrical work (under 3 hours) but he will spend 5 hours helping them move for free. His reasoning is that he’s an electrician and it’s his livelihood. What’s the difference? Time is time.
How long did it take for your uncle to fix your bumper? If it was less than 4 hours, then yes I think it was wrong of him to charge you. Nothing personal against him, but it’s just how I feel. I spent 6 hours doing technical consulting with my friend to get his business started. For free. This is something I’d normally charge $125 an hour for. Why? Because to me he’s family.