[quote]Mr. Chen wrote:[quote]Sloth wrote:Desperate. You, the supposed bible Christian, gets corrected on the bible (Jesus naming Peter, endowment of holy spirit, hierarchical church), and having been embarrassed, resort to this uninspired trash. Go join Tiribulus on my whack-a-doo list.[/quote]If I am corrected with the bible, I will not feel embarrassed.[/quote]Elder Forlife, a gay ex Mormon, once caught me in a clear biblical error =[ =[ =[ I was NOT blessed. He was however right and I was wrong.
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
[quote]Mr. Chen wrote:
In deny this emphatically. The reason is simple. I do not believe the early christian church = the Roman Catholic church.[/quote]
Of course not, because the phrase Roman Catholic didn’t pop up until the Reformation by Protestants. It was called the Catholic Church. Ignatius of Antioch proves this in 110 AD. [/quote]
107 A.D. 
[/quote]
It takes the Church a century to utter half a sentence. I toss around 10’s of years without thinking about it. Whatevs.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< 1, you seem to place puritan values on the Catholic Church. >>>[/quote]I place the same biblical values on everybody.[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< We’re not puritans so you’re aversion to cuss words is what I’m thinking about here. >>>[/quote]Included, but only a small overall aspect of my point. Not much time now Chris, sorry man.
[/quote]
Too bad I don’t accept your private interpretation of that scripture.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]Mr. Chen wrote:[quote]Sloth wrote:Desperate. You, the supposed bible Christian, gets corrected on the bible (Jesus naming Peter, endowment of holy spirit, hierarchical church), and having been embarrassed, resort to this uninspired trash. Go join Tiribulus on my whack-a-doo list.[/quote]If I am corrected with the bible, I will not feel embarrassed.[/quote]Elder Forlife, a gay ex Mormon, once caught me in a clear biblical error =[ =[ =[ I was NOT blessed. He was however right and I was wrong.
[/quote]
Guess you’re not infallible, even with the help of the Holy Ghost…guess we can’t trust private interpretation.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Go join Tiribulus on my whack-a-doo list.
[/quote]
Not yet, make him work for it. You remember how much tripe you had to put up from tirib. I wonder what they teach in these Churches sometimes… “Jesus said love your neighbor, but we’re not Jesus so we’re going to hate our neighbors.”
The difference between the educated and the ignorant is staggering.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]Mr. Chen wrote:[quote]Sloth wrote:Desperate. You, the supposed bible Christian, gets corrected on the bible (Jesus naming Peter, endowment of holy spirit, hierarchical church), and having been embarrassed, resort to this uninspired trash. Go join Tiribulus on my whack-a-doo list.[/quote]If I am corrected with the bible, I will not feel embarrassed.[/quote]Elder Forlife, a gay ex Mormon, once caught me in a clear biblical error =[ =[ =[ I was NOT blessed. He was however right and I was wrong.
[/quote]
Guess you’re not infallible, even with the help of the Holy Ghost…guess we can’t trust private interpretation. [/quote]
The bible said we should destroy all the high places, so Denver has go to go. It’s a high place.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< Guess you’re not infallible, even with the help of the Holy Ghost…guess we can’t trust private interpretation. [/quote]Definitely not. [quote]“Peter, in his first epistle ch.1 v.16 quotes the 14th of Leviticus where God commands Israel “Ye shall be holy; for I am holy”. Could you please grace us with a 10 scale rating on how well you believe your church has fulfilled this command from Nicaea to the present? Please? (notice how calmly and “charitably” I’m talking to you now Christopher? =] I like this better actually)”[/quote] When Chris? When can I expect an answer? What if we were to ask the world what they thought? Define whatever aspect you want. Has the big C catholic testimony displayed the risen Christ before a dying world? Believe you me, you WILL see the relevance.
[quote]pat wrote:
Not yet, make him work for it… [/quote]
Nah. When the conversation devolved into who was the higher ranking (Peter or James), without acknowledging that by even arguing that much the stance against a hierarchical church had been abandoned…I knew we had a poo-flinger. Gets a couple of biblical things wrong, goes for the “Well, the church did this in it’s name” route. Don’t pause too long to deal with the consequences of being wrong, jump straight into throwing poo up against a different wall! Point out that the bible is used to justify misdeeds, throw out the bible? No, of course not! I’ve seen better anti-catholics on my doorstep passing out their stupid little pamphlets. I’m not going to give one assigned to ‘mission: PWI’ a platform here.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
Of course not, because the phrase Roman Catholic didn’t pop up until the Reformation by Protestants. It was called the Catholic Church. Ignatius of Antioch proves this in 110 AD.
107 A.D.
It takes the Church a century to utter half a sentence. I toss around 10’s of years without thinking about it. Whatevs. [/quote]
I referred to the the same letter, figured we should be on the same page… You know if we’re just an asshair different we’re going the get the baby with the bath water treatment.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]pat wrote:
Not yet, make him work for it… [/quote]
Nah. When the conversation devolved into who was the higher ranking (Peter or James), without acknowledging that by even arguing that much the stance against a hierarchical church had been abandoned…I knew we had a poo-flinger. Gets a couple of biblical things wrong, goes for the “Well, the church did this in it’s name” route. Don’t pause too long to deal with the consequences of being wrong, jump straight into throwing poo up against a different wall! Point out that the bible is used to justify misdeeds, throw out the bible? No, of course not! I’ve seen better anti-catholics on my doorstep passing out their stupid little pamphlets. I’m not going to give one assigned to ‘mission: PWI’ a platform here. [/quote]
Yeah you have a point, but I want to save my ‘ignore list’ only for the most grievous offenders. That way if your on that list, it means you have nothing valuable to add to any conversation on any topic ever.
Funny story about the JW’s coming to my door. First, I will mention that I am always polite and gracious to them, even if they come at a bad time and I am irriated. But they where on the ‘End of the world’ spiel, to which I retorted that I couldn’t care less about the coming of the end. I merely said that, I cannot do anything about it and it’s not worth getting worked up over. The look on the faces were priceless. I think that was the first time I ever rendered them completely speechless.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< Guess you’re not infallible, even with the help of the Holy Ghost…guess we can’t trust private interpretation. [/quote]Definitely not. [quote]“Peter, in his first epistle ch.1 v.16 quotes the 14th of Leviticus where God commands Israel “Ye shall be holy; for I am holy”. Could you please grace us with a 10 scale rating on how well you believe your church has fulfilled this command from Nicaea to the present? Please? (notice how calmly and “charitably” I’m talking to you now Christopher? =] I like this better actually)”[/quote] When Chris? When can I expect an answer? What if we were to ask the world what they thought? Define whatever aspect you want. Has the big C catholic testimony displayed the risen Christ before a dying world? Believe you me, you WILL see the relevance.
[/quote]
When you answer my question.
[quote]pat wrote:
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
Of course not, because the phrase Roman Catholic didn’t pop up until the Reformation by Protestants. It was called the Catholic Church. Ignatius of Antioch proves this in 110 AD.
107 A.D.
It takes the Church a century to utter half a sentence. I toss around 10’s of years without thinking about it. Whatevs. [/quote]
I referred to the the same letter, figured we should be on the same page… You know if we’re just an asshair different we’re going the get the baby with the bath water treatment.[/quote]
They can get the inquisition treatment in return. LAWL! I make my ribs hurt.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< How we tolerate heresy, let alone apostasy is beyond me. We basically perfected the ability of throwing the book at people for doing wrong…like being angry at your neighbor because he knocked over your goat. We take away your ability to receive the sacraments…and if you do…boy you just step in a big pile. But then on the flip side, mass murderer of Christians? Oh, you are repentant…you’re cool. Go to confession, the priest has heard it all. Later we’ll make you a Bishop. [/quote]I didn’t see this post until just now. Again, what you propound as theory is just that. It amounts to NOTHING in practice. The Catholic Church has a gospel that leaves it’s practitioners dead. Apostasy may not be the best word which means “falling away”.
I mean the overwhelmingly vaaast majority of Catholic people show ZEEROH, NADA, ZILCH, evidence of being in even the slightest degree different from the mass of lost humanity. They look, act, talk, and live just like the unchurched pagans in their neighborhood. The testimony they bear says, “my God is no different than yours because I’m no different than you”.
[quote]pat wrote 02-29-2012, 03:17 PM:<<< Dan and his faulty reasoning against the ‘Intelligent design’ model can suck my dick. [/quote][quote]pat wrote 11-23-2011, 06:59 PM:<<< So? fuck off, nimrod. No one said you had to participate. Go jack-off to a “I wanna fuck a t-vixen” thread because no one in your local vicinity thinks you’re worth lifting a leg and pissing on. Idiot.[/quote] I could post dozens of these and it ain’t just him. I’ve personally known I don’t know how many practicing Catholics just like him who will defend their precious religion to the death and yet spew this filth in His name because they don’t know any better.
Why don’t they know any better? Because their “Church” is not “puritanical” and would NEVER be so protestant as to suggest that: “No foul language should come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for needed edification, that it may impart grace to those who hear.” (Ephesians 4:29 NAB). I mean it’s not as if Jesus said anything “puritanical” like: “A good person out of the store of goodness in his heart produces good, but an evil person out of a store of evil produces evil; for from the fullness of the heart the mouth speaks.”. (Luke 6:45 NAB)
Oops, I forgot. That’s private interpretation. It requires the divinely inspired magesterium to tell me that that isn’t foul language and just because the only begotten Son of God though whom all things were made says we can see someone’s heart by what they say, there is NO reason to believe that preschool statement as is until the shepherds of the oh so historically credible “apostolic Church” tell me what it really means.
Ya know what frustrates the livin daylights outta me? I KNOW way down where you live you are hearin me. There is so much more for you Christopher. I am unequipped to say these things to you in a kinder gentler way than this. Your Church (see, big C) is dead. By the grace of the gospel that I preach, YOU are not. I am gonna cry like a baby when He brings you outta there. There will be NO “I told you so’s”, only joy.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< How we tolerate heresy, let alone apostasy is beyond me. We basically perfected the ability of throwing the book at people for doing wrong…like being angry at your neighbor because he knocked over your goat. We take away your ability to receive the sacraments…and if you do…boy you just step in a big pile. But then on the flip side, mass murderer of Christians? Oh, you are repentant…you’re cool. Go to confession, the priest has heard it all. Later we’ll make you a Bishop. [/quote]I didn’t see this post until just now. Again, what you propound as theory is just that. It amounts to NOTHING in practice. The Catholic Church has a gospel that leaves it’s practitioners dead. Apostasy may not be the best word which means “falling away”.
I mean the overwhelmingly vaaast majority of Catholic people show ZEEROH, NADA, ZILCH, evidence of being in even the slightest degree different from the mass of lost humanity. They look, act, talk, and live just like the unchurched pagans in their neighborhood. The testimony they bear says, “my God is no different than yours because I’m no different than you”.
[quote]pat wrote 02-29-2012, 03:17 PM:<<< Dan and his faulty reasoning against the ‘Intelligent design’ model can suck my dick. [/quote][quote]pat wrote 11-23-2011, 06:59 PM:<<< So? fuck off, nimrod. No one said you had to participate. Go jack-off to a “I wanna fuck a t-vixen” thread because no one in your local vicinity thinks you’re worth lifting a leg and pissing on. Idiot.[/quote] I could post dozens of these and it ain’t just him. I’ve personally known I don’t know how many practicing Catholics just like him who will defend their precious religion to the death and yet spew this filth in His name because they don’t know any better.
Why don’t they know any better? Because their “Church” is not “puritanical” and would NEVER be so protestant as to suggest that: “No foul language should come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for needed edification, that it may impart grace to those who hear.” (Ephesians 4:29 NAB). I mean it’s not as if Jesus said anything “puritanical” like: “A good person out of the store of goodness in his heart produces good, but an evil person out of a store of evil produces evil; for from the fullness of the heart the mouth speaks.”. (Luke 6:45 NAB)
Oops, I forgot. That’s private interpretation. It requires the divinely inspired magesterium to tell me that that isn’t foul language and just because the only begotten Son of God though whom all things were made says we can see someone’s heart by what they say, there is NO reason to believe that preschool statement as is until the shepherds of the oh so historically credible “apostolic Church” tell me what it really means.
Ya know what frustrates the livin daylights outta me? I KNOW way down where you live you are hearin me. There is so much more for you Christopher. I am unequipped to say these things to you in a kinder gentler way than this. Your Church (see, big C) is dead. By the grace of the gospel that I preach, YOU are not. I am gonna cry like a baby when He brings you outta there. There will be NO “I told you so’s”, only joy.
[/quote]
Are you done being emotional and sentimental?
Now, please show where the Church tolerates apostasy.
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
…points out what appears to be glaring inconsistencies between teaching and practice…
[/quote]
Tirib, I do see what you are talking about, and I believe that you have a genuine anger (something along the lines of righteous anger) about how some members preach one thing and do another. Sometimes it is best to not force the issue, as it falls of deaf ears. I found myself getting to that point in these threads and just had to walk away. I have made clear the views of Jehovah’s Witnesses and I realize my energies are better spent elsewhere.
For others reading this, this is not a personal attack on anyone. It is friendly advice from one person to another.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< How we tolerate heresy, let alone apostasy is beyond me. We basically perfected the ability of throwing the book at people for doing wrong…like being angry at your neighbor because he knocked over your goat. We take away your ability to receive the sacraments…and if you do…boy you just step in a big pile. But then on the flip side, mass murderer of Christians? Oh, you are repentant…you’re cool. Go to confession, the priest has heard it all. Later we’ll make you a Bishop. [/quote]I didn’t see this post until just now. Again, what you propound as theory is just that. It amounts to NOTHING in practice. The Catholic Church has a gospel that leaves it’s practitioners dead. Apostasy may not be the best word which means “falling away”.
I mean the overwhelmingly vaaast majority of Catholic people show ZEEROH, NADA, ZILCH, evidence of being in even the slightest degree different from the mass of lost humanity. They look, act, talk, and live just like the unchurched pagans in their neighborhood. The testimony they bear says, “my God is no different than yours because I’m no different than you”.
[quote]pat wrote 02-29-2012, 03:17 PM:<<< Dan and his faulty reasoning against the ‘Intelligent design’ model can suck my dick. [/quote][quote]pat wrote 11-23-2011, 06:59 PM:<<< So? fuck off, nimrod. No one said you had to participate. Go jack-off to a “I wanna fuck a t-vixen” thread because no one in your local vicinity thinks you’re worth lifting a leg and pissing on. Idiot.[/quote] I could post dozens of these and it ain’t just him. I’ve personally known I don’t know how many practicing Catholics just like him who will defend their precious religion to the death and yet spew this filth in His name because they don’t know any better.
Why don’t they know any better? Because their “Church” is not “puritanical” and would NEVER be so protestant as to suggest that: “No foul language should come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for needed edification, that it may impart grace to those who hear.” (Ephesians 4:29 NAB). I mean it’s not as if Jesus said anything “puritanical” like: “A good person out of the store of goodness in his heart produces good, but an evil person out of a store of evil produces evil; for from the fullness of the heart the mouth speaks.”. (Luke 6:45 NAB)
Oops, I forgot. That’s private interpretation. It requires the divinely inspired magesterium to tell me that that isn’t foul language and just because the only begotten Son of God though whom all things were made says we can see someone’s heart by what they say, there is NO reason to believe that preschool statement as is until the shepherds of the oh so historically credible “apostolic Church” tell me what it really means.
Ya know what frustrates the livin daylights outta me? I KNOW way down where you live you are hearin me. There is so much more for you Christopher. I am unequipped to say these things to you in a kinder gentler way than this. Your Church (see, big C) is dead. By the grace of the gospel that I preach, YOU are not. I am gonna cry like a baby when He brings you outta there. There will be NO “I told you so’s”, only joy.
[/quote]
Are you done being emotional and sentimental?
Now, please show where the Church tolerates apostasy. [/quote]
Do they kill people that defect?
No?
Tolerance!
Cause, thats all that it means yaknow?
[quote]Sweet Revenge wrote:
[quote]Mr. Chen wrote:
But you must know Christ as the Scriptures define Him, and trust Him alone for your salvation.[/quote]
Beautiful. Clouds parting. Sunlight streaming. Books and voices fading away. Music. [/quote]
In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not, lest the light of the glorious gospel of Christ, who is the image of God, should shine unto them. (2Co 4:4 KJV)
But the word of God is powerful, so I have hope for them.
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
[quote]Brother Chris wrote:<<< How we tolerate heresy, let alone apostasy is beyond me. We basically perfected the ability of throwing the book at people for doing wrong…like being angry at your neighbor because he knocked over your goat. We take away your ability to receive the sacraments…and if you do…boy you just step in a big pile. But then on the flip side, mass murderer of Christians? Oh, you are repentant…you’re cool. Go to confession, the priest has heard it all. Later we’ll make you a Bishop. [/quote]I didn’t see this post until just now. Again, what you propound as theory is just that. It amounts to NOTHING in practice. The Catholic Church has a gospel that leaves it’s practitioners dead. Apostasy may not be the best word which means “falling away”.
I mean the overwhelmingly vaaast majority of Catholic people show ZEEROH, NADA, ZILCH, evidence of being in even the slightest degree different from the mass of lost humanity. They look, act, talk, and live just like the unchurched pagans in their neighborhood. The testimony they bear says, “my God is no different than yours because I’m no different than you”.
[quote]pat wrote 02-29-2012, 03:17 PM:<<< Dan and his faulty reasoning against the ‘Intelligent design’ model can suck my dick. [/quote][quote]pat wrote 11-23-2011, 06:59 PM:<<< So? fuck off, nimrod. No one said you had to participate. Go jack-off to a “I wanna fuck a t-vixen” thread because no one in your local vicinity thinks you’re worth lifting a leg and pissing on. Idiot.[/quote] I could post dozens of these and it ain’t just him. I’ve personally known I don’t know how many practicing Catholics just like him who will defend their precious religion to the death and yet spew this filth in His name because they don’t know any better.
Why don’t they know any better? Because their “Church” is not “puritanical” and would NEVER be so protestant as to suggest that: “No foul language should come out of your mouths, but only such as is good for needed edification, that it may impart grace to those who hear.” (Ephesians 4:29 NAB). I mean it’s not as if Jesus said anything “puritanical” like: “A good person out of the store of goodness in his heart produces good, but an evil person out of a store of evil produces evil; for from the fullness of the heart the mouth speaks.”. (Luke 6:45 NAB)
Oops, I forgot. That’s private interpretation. It requires the divinely inspired magesterium to tell me that that isn’t foul language and just because the only begotten Son of God though whom all things were made says we can see someone’s heart by what they say, there is NO reason to believe that preschool statement as is until the shepherds of the oh so historically credible “apostolic Church” tell me what it really means.
Ya know what frustrates the livin daylights outta me? I KNOW way down where you live you are hearin me. There is so much more for you Christopher. I am unequipped to say these things to you in a kinder gentler way than this. Your Church (see, big C) is dead. By the grace of the gospel that I preach, YOU are not. I am gonna cry like a baby when He brings you outta there. There will be NO “I told you so’s”, only joy.[/quote]Are you done being emotional and sentimental? Now, please show where the Church tolerates apostasy. [/quote]No way Chris. This garage sale response is far beneath you. You ARE in there. Scratch “apostasy”. Wrong word. Rome is a wet and fertile greenhouse of open unfettered carnality. A sinners paradise. Church for the unregenerate with no fear of the Lord. The greatest evidence of the lies of her claims is in the non existent Christian character of the great majority of those in communion with her. Read these meaty portions of the 3rd chapter of the 1st epistle of John, the apostle of love. The ESV handles the Greek verbs well here: [quote]1-See what kind of love the Father has given to us, that we should be called children of God; and so we are. The reason why the world does not know us is that it did not know him. 2-Beloved, we are Godâ??s children now, and what we will be has not yet appeared; but we know that when he appears we shall be like him, because we shall see him as he is. 3-And everyone who thus hopes in him purifies himself as he is pure.
4-Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness. 5-You know that he appeared to take away sins, and in him there is no sin. 6-No one who abides in him keeps on sinning; no one who keeps on sinning has either seen him or known him. 7-Little children, let no one deceive you. Whoever practices righteousness is righteous, as he is righteous. 8-Whoever makes a practice of sinning is of the devil, for the devil has been sinning from the beginning. The reason the Son of God appeared was to destroy the works of the devil. 9-No one born of God makes a practice of sinning, for Godâ??s seed abides in him, and he cannot keep on sinning because he has been born of God. 10-By this it is evident who are the children of God, and who are the children of the devil: whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is the one who does not love his brother. <<<<<<>>>>>>23-And this is his commandment, that we believe in the name of his Son Jesus Christ and love one another, just as he has commanded us. 24-Whoever keeps his commandments abides in God,d and God in him. And by this we know that he abides in us, by the Spirit whom he has given us.[/quote]This is the populous of your Church!?!?!??(I had to go back and change that one to a big C, almost slipped) EVERYBODY not in those pews themselves knows better Christopher. They have eyes and ears. She is DEAD. Do you hear me? Void of the life of Christ and the flagrant flesh festival that IS the lives of her communicants and clergy speaks infinitely louder than ecumenical councils, catechisms, encyclicals and papal bulls. You are headed for a hurtin like you never heard of, BECAUSE of that tender heart that is getting even tenderer. That’s a good thing. You will however emerge a weapon. A one man spiritual seal team, but you ARE gonna have do it the hard way. In fact, it’s that that will make you a weapon indeed. Ohhh the wisdom and might of our infallible God.
[quote]orion wrote:
Do they kill people that defect?
No?
Tolerance!
Cause, thats all that it means yaknow?[/quote]
Oh, thanks for correcting me.
[quote]honest_lifter wrote:[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
…points out what appears to be glaring inconsistencies between teaching and practice…
[/quote]Tirib, I do see what you are talking about, and I believe that you have a genuine anger (something along the lines of righteous anger) about how some members preach one thing and do another. Sometimes it is best to not force the issue, as it falls of deaf ears. I found myself getting to that point in these threads and just had to walk away. I have made clear the views of Jehovah’s Witnesses and I realize my energies are better spent elsewhere. For others reading this, this is not a personal attack on anyone. It is friendly advice from one person to another.[/quote]I do appreciate the sincerity of this post and your point is actually well taken. However Christopher is not swine and I refuse to believe that my pearls are cast before him in vain. Results are not my problem. Faithfulness is. I also have no illusions. I expect it to be a decade… or more, that he will be on this leg of his journey. Also, as I have said in the past. My eye is on the view count, not the post count.