[quote]Makavali wrote:
clip11 wrote:
Makavali wrote:
Pedophile cult apologists unite!
Never mind the fact that a lot of the children in question were prepubescent when they were molested.
The Catholic Church should adopt a new motto: No child’s behind left.
Some of them were. Alot of them were teens.
Glad we cleared that up, I was afraid they’d actually done something wrong.[/quote]
51% were between 11 and 14 years of age. 15% were 16 or 17. 6% were 7 or under and 16% were between 6 and 10.
[quote]forlife wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Ah, so they want it THEIR way. Get married, become a deacon.
Why is it that the “church” is always right, and pointing out its weaknesses is inevitably labeled as selfishness?
It’s unhealthy to push most people into celibacy. It leads to screwed up lives, and often can result in acting out. I find it sad, in the same way I think it’s sad that churches are pushing gays into celibacy.
Life is too short for loneliness. Not that everyone is going to find a soul mate, but those that otherwise would should be encouraged to do so, rather than being condemned.[/quote]
Again, “push?” Don’t be a priest. What’s next? “Catholic priests shouldn’t have to believe in the dvinity of Christ.” “It’s not fair that muslims can’t be Catholic priests!” It’s a voluntary vocation, that can be set aside, within a voluntary religious association. Wow. There isn’t a draft for the priesthood. If you’re pursuing a vocation that requires celibacy, and you don’t want to be celibate…hmm, oh yeah, you’re to blame.
[quote]forlife wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Ah, so they want it THEIR way. Get married, become a deacon.
Why is it that the “church” is always right, and pointing out its weaknesses is inevitably labeled as selfishness?
It’s unhealthy to push most people into celibacy. It leads to screwed up lives, and often can result in acting out. I find it sad, in the same way I think it’s sad that churches are pushing gays into celibacy.
Life is too short for loneliness. Not that everyone is going to find a soul mate, but those that otherwise would should be encouraged to do so, rather than being condemned.[/quote]
Why do you give a fuck? Why don’t you worry about yourself and not everybody else. You aren’t Catholic or a priest so it does not affect you one iota.
[quote]clip11 wrote:
I was just saying that these priests should be classified as homosexuals instead of pedophiles as the media and homo rights groups try to say.[/quote]
Why does it matter? Do you think it is too harsh on the rapists to call them pedophiles? You’ll get to a point in your life when you realize that 18 and 19 year olds are still children, regardless of how they view themselves.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Again, “push?” Don’t be a priest. What’s next? “Catholic priests shouldn’t have to believe in the dvinity of Christ.” “It’s not fair that muslims can’t be Catholic priests!” It’s a voluntary vocation, that can be set aside, within a voluntary religious association. Wow. There isn’t a draft for the priesthood. If you’re pursuing a vocation that requires celibacy, and you don’t want to be celibate…hmm, oh yeah, you’re to blame.
[/quote]
Many people feel that god is calling them to the priesthood, and yet they also don’t want to go through life alone. It’s an unnecessary, unhealthy dichotomy created by a backward religion, based on a few verses from Paul, who had more than his own share of issues. Hopefully the Catholic church will get with the times and allow their priests/nuns to marry; the donation plates at mass are diminishing by the year.
[quote]pat wrote:
Why do you give a fuck? Why don’t you worry about yourself and not everybody else. You aren’t Catholic or a priest so it does not affect you one iota. [/quote]
For the same reason I give a fuck about any other social issue that doesn’t directly affect me. Life is short, and people are entitled to as much love, happiness, and peace as possible for the time they have. Telling people that they have to be celibate their entire life is all about controlling others, and I pity the people that fall for it.
[quote]forlife wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Again, “push?” Don’t be a priest. What’s next? “Catholic priests shouldn’t have to believe in the dvinity of Christ.” “It’s not fair that muslims can’t be Catholic priests!” It’s a voluntary vocation, that can be set aside, within a voluntary religious association. Wow. There isn’t a draft for the priesthood. If you’re pursuing a vocation that requires celibacy, and you don’t want to be celibate…hmm, oh yeah, you’re to blame.
Many people feel that god is calling them to the priesthood, and yet they also don’t want to go through life alone. It’s an unnecessary, unhealthy dichotomy created by a backward religion, based on a few verses from Paul, who had more than his own share of issues. Hopefully the Catholic church will get with the times and allow their priests/nuns to marry; the donation plates at mass are diminishing by the year. [/quote]
Guy, as a Protestant I disagree 100% with Roman Catholic theology. But do you have to project your experiences onto every.single.topic on this forum? You’ve actually got some useful/interesting things to say when you occasionally veer from the gay agenda accidentally. Does everything have to be about the gay agenda and your maltreatment at the hands of the nefarious Mormons with you?
[quote]forlife wrote:
Sloth wrote:
Again, “push?” Don’t be a priest. What’s next? “Catholic priests shouldn’t have to believe in the dvinity of Christ.” “It’s not fair that muslims can’t be Catholic priests!” It’s a voluntary vocation, that can be set aside, within a voluntary religious association. Wow. There isn’t a draft for the priesthood. If you’re pursuing a vocation that requires celibacy, and you don’t want to be celibate…hmm, oh yeah, you’re to blame.
Many people feel that god is calling them to the priesthood, and yet they also don’t want to go through life alone. It’s an unnecessary, unhealthy dichotomy created by a backward religion, based on a few verses from Paul, who had more than his own share of issues. Hopefully the Catholic church will get with the times and allow their priests/nuns to marry; the donation plates at mass are diminishing by the year. [/quote]
“Many people feel”…And many other people feel our priests should remain celibate. A totally voluntary vocation in a private voluntary religious association. Your criticism has no more merit than picking on the Church for not allowing Priests to convert to Hinduism and remain…Catholic priests. If someone can’t handle celibacy, they are to blame for their predicament. They don’t have to attend seminary, nor are they forced to remain in their office. You don’t go to flight school to become a cariologist.
Celibacy is based on Christ. I’m not interested in a debate here with protestants. We already know where we stand with respect to each other. But to say priestly celibacy is solely based on Paul (and most people don’t even realize why Paul advises what he does), is simply ignorance of the Church’s position.
Don’t worry about our donations, as the Church will be here long after you or I’ve been forgotten by history.
[quote]PRCalDude wrote:
Guy, as a Protestant I disagree 100% with Roman Catholic theology. But do you have to project your experiences onto every.single.topic on this forum? You’ve actually got some useful/interesting things to say when you occasionally veer from the gay agenda accidentally. Does everything have to be about the gay agenda and your maltreatment at the hands of the nefarious Mormons with you?
[/quote]
My views of Catholicism (and of religion in general) aren’t derived only from my personal experiences, but as with everyone else, my experiences do shape my perspective. I would have these same views even if I were straight. That said, I’m probably more sensitive to the celibacy issue, since that is what religions are now pushing gays toward.
For the record, I don’t harbor any negative feelings toward the Mormon church. I think that they are well meaning people, and am proud of my Mormon ancestry. However, I do think people are sometimes harmed by the misguided doctrines of Mormon (and other) churches.
I post regularly in the bodybuilding forum, so you can catch me there if you’re tired of my droning on about religion and the gay agenda 
[quote]borrek wrote:
clip11 wrote:
I was just saying that these priests should be classified as homosexuals instead of pedophiles as the media and homo rights groups try to say.
Why does it matter? Do you think it is too harsh on the rapists to call them pedophiles? You’ll get to a point in your life when you realize that 18 and 19 year olds are still children, regardless of how they view themselves.[/quote]
After that comes a point where you realize that some of these “children” had sex with more people than you did and that your dick wont make a difference, for better or worse.
[quote]forlife wrote:
pat wrote:
Why do you give a fuck? Why don’t you worry about yourself and not everybody else. You aren’t Catholic or a priest so it does not affect you one iota.
For the same reason I give a fuck about any other social issue that doesn’t directly affect me. Life is short, and people are entitled to as much love, happiness, and peace as possible for the time they have. [/quote]
Unless of course you need their money to be compassionate with it?
I am not trying to be a dick, I just find it interesting that you abhor the terrible tyranny of an organization that you can leave at a moments notice even if you are a priest and yet are perfectly willing to force your version of paradise on other people if only you can find a temporary majority.
What gives?
You’re ignoring the power of religious brainwashing. Yes, in theory priests could just leave their religions to find someone to love, but how many are willing to step back and honestly ask the hard questions that could lead to such a journey?
[quote]forlife wrote:
You’re ignoring the power of religious brainwashing. Yes, in theory priests could just leave their religions to find someone to love, but how many are willing to step back and honestly ask the hard questions that could lead to such a journey?[/quote]
On the contrary, they often have a whole congregation to love (and be loved by) and look after (and to be looked after by). It’s their bedroom behavior you’re concerned with, interestingly enough. Though, as has been said repeatedly, marriage IS a valid vocation (yes, marriage is it’s own vocation), too. They CAN leave one vocation, for another. Voluntarily.
If my faith seems backwards to you, it’s because it is. I don’t dispute that all. In fact, I celebrate it. You see, while you “progressives” march foward off the cliff, my “brainwashed” comrades and I will be stepping backwards. So, no, I’m sorry to inform you that there won’t be transgendered-agnostic priests, in bisexual-polyamorous relationships, celebrating the mass.
Besides, you’re not realy interested in Priestly celibacy, as your response clearly shows. Your concern is with the fact that they’re religious in the first place. You should have just said so.
Sexual repression ftw.
Common hallmark of religion, along with submission and “thought crimes”.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
On the contrary, they often have a whole congregation to love (and be loved by) and look after (and to be looked after by). It’s their bedroom behavior you’re concerned with, interestingly enough. Though, as has been said repeatedly, marriage IS a valid vocation (yes, marriage is it’s own vocation), too. They CAN leave one vocation, for another. Voluntarily.[/quote]
Why should they have to choose between loving their congregation and loving their wife and children? It’s a completely unnecessary dichotomy, and I think it’s sad.
The more a church tries to control the intimate deatails of your life, the more concerned they are with having power over others. I just finished a book on Michelangelo that discussed how extensively the Catholic church has dominated the lives of others, through direct or (as in this case) indirect force. I don’t think this applies to all (particularly American) Catholics to the same degree, but it is still there.
I don’t mind people being religious, as long as their fairy tales don’t interfere with their happiness and peace or with that of others. People are of course free to do whatever they want, but it’s unfortunate when their faith artificially limits their life fulfillment.
[quote]forlife wrote:
Why should they have to choose between loving their congregation and loving their wife and children? It’s a completely unnecessary dichotomy, and I think it’s sad.
[/quote]
Great, you think it’s sad. We must be doing something right.
[quote]forlife wrote:
You’re ignoring the power of religious brainwashing. Yes, in theory priests could just leave their religions to find someone to love, but how many are willing to step back and honestly ask the hard questions that could lead to such a journey?[/quote]
You are ignoring the incredible power of political and cultural brainwashing.
Yes, in theory classic liberalism leads to the greatest good of the greatest number, but how many are willing to step back and honestly ask the hard questions that could lead to such a conclusion?
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Great, you think it’s sad. We must be doing something right.[/quote]
Catholics are notorious for focusing on the misery of life
[quote]orion wrote:
You are ignoring the incredible power of political and cultural brainwashing.
Yes, in theory classic liberalism leads to the greatest good of the greatest number, but how many are willing to step back and honestly ask the hard questions that could lead to such a conclusion? [/quote]
It’s political/cultural brainwashing to allow people to marry and have children, when they are inclined to do so? Sorry, I just see no reason for religions to exclude their most dedicated members from one of the greatest joys of life. When you force people into choosing celibacy in order to follow their faith, it leads to repression and a range of psychological disorders. It flat out isn’t healthy.
[quote]forlife wrote:
Sloth wrote:
On the contrary, they often have a whole congregation to love (and be loved by) and look after (and to be looked after by). It’s their bedroom behavior you’re concerned with, interestingly enough. Though, as has been said repeatedly, marriage IS a valid vocation (yes, marriage is it’s own vocation), too. They CAN leave one vocation, for another. Voluntarily.
Why should they have to choose between loving their congregation and loving their wife and children? It’s a completely unnecessary dichotomy, and I think it’s sad.
The more a church tries to control the intimate deatails of your life, the more concerned they are with having power over others. I just finished a book on Michelangelo that discussed how extensively the Catholic church has dominated the lives of others, through direct or (as in this case) indirect force. I don’t think this applies to all (particularly American) Catholics to the same degree, but it is still there.
[/quote]
Again, catholic church trying to control the intimate details of your life, bad, government trying to control the intimate details of your life, good?
Why?
So others are wrong when they do it just because they can, but when you do it just because you can it is a-ok?
Either you are for coercing other people for their own good or you are not. You cannot complain when it is done to you and yet want to do it to others, you instantly lose all credibility.
Plus, the Medici pestered Michelangelo all his live but not because of religious reasons. Even the the Medici popes who forced him into doing the Sistine Chapel were hardly religious men, they could not care less who or what he had sex with for example.
They needed a propaganda peace and he was the best, roma locuta, causa finita.