The idea of systemic oppression stems from a system built and operated by whites for whites to the disadvantage of non-whites.
I think you’re here arguing for the sake arguing and really have no clue.
Yes, I’m arguing against exactly what you said. Your own statements don’t reconcile, champ.[quote=“therajraj, post:1225, topic:228119”]
The reality is, a low IQ population cannot create or maintain a high IQ style society. This is objectively true.
[/quote]
And a “high IQ style society” is superior - you’ve said so over and over and over. That’s the position yiive taken. [quote=“therajraj, post:1225, topic:228119”]
Secondly, you dodged my question: How does the inferior/superior thing work when depending on what’s measured, the race with the best result changes?
[/quote]
No, I didn’t dodge anything - I addressed value on the exact measurement you brought up - the success (or not) of societies, and the fact that that success (or not) is driven by race. That’s your own value measurement - and using it, logic dictates what we already know from reading your posts: you believe in the inferiority of certain races because you believe in the inferiority of certain race-specific “shithole” societies.[quote=“therajraj, post:1225, topic:228119”]
Black basketball tend to have better leaping ability than white basketball players. I generally value athletes with great leaping ability. I guess I now think whites are racially inferior.
[/quote]
Well, no, even assuming that’s true, use of that athletic advantage as part of sport and entertainment isn’t something very high on the value scale, especially the scale of moral value. It’s a non-event. Leaping ability isn’t being used toward some moral end. You’re offering up a red herring, like you always do.
The success of a society certainly is on a moral value scale. A “shithole” society isn’t morally fungible with a free, safe, and prosperous society. No one believes that, you don’t, and you’ve said so. One is better than another.[quote=“therajraj, post:1225, topic:228119”]
Your logic (or lack thereof) completely falls apart.
[/quote]
No, it doesn’t but then again, you’re not even familiar with logic. I don’t mean that as an insult - I mean it literally. You simply don’t know what you’re talking about.[quote=“therajraj, post:1225, topic:228119”]
You are saying by the ancestry of a person, they are actively engaging in nefarious behaviour against people of color without any direct evidence. The very nature of their existence and familial history makes them culpable for every and all bad things that occur to POC.
Beliefs you openly espouse to are deeply racist.
[/quote]
This is so dumb it makes my hair hurt, but most importantly, it’s a straw man - I’ve never taken that position, I’ve never said that someone is actively engaging in nefarious conduct toward people of color merely by virtue of their ancestry. If someone has, take it up with them, and stop wasting my time.
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No, I didn’t admit it - I don’t take that position. Is there institutional discrimination? Yes, in certain ways, but it’s driven by individuals in positions of institutional power who discriminate and who, by virtue of their position, encourage others to do so out of fear. That takes an individual act and reinforces it to be a larger, more institutional act.
My example above is the executive who instructed department managers to stop hiring so many blacks. He’s the discriminatory one, but the others take his position whether they agree with him or not out of fear of losing his/her job. Thus, instititionalization of a leader’s discriminatory views.
This, I saw with my own eyes.
Raj, it’s amazing what you learn about the world when you get out in it instead of farting around in 4chan all day long in internet cafes.
"A 2010 study using data from the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health found that the IQs of young adults who described themselves as “very liberal” averaged 106.42, whereas the mean of those who identified as “very conservative” was 94.82. Similarly, when a 2009 study correlated cognitive capacity with political beliefs among 1,254 community college students and 1,600 foreign students seeking entry to U.S. universities, it found that conservatism is “related to low performance on cognitive ability tests.” In 2012, a paper reported that people endorse more conservative views when drunk or under cognitive pressure; it concluded that “political conservatism may be a process consequence of low-effort thought.”
Oh, this explains a lot of this thread to me…
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I’m only asking this in context of what we’re talk about and for curiosity, not to argue. I’m also asking to see your point. Do you consider people who avoid high crime areas with a particular demographic and then using this demographic’s specific term and the word “bad” to be irrational? Example, as I used way above: “bad neighborhood”, “bad school district.” Anyone with a clue knows why people use this code speak and what they’re referring to.
And actually, everyone whom I’ve heard speak like this are rational, normal, lucid, sober, whatever term we want to use.
What’s fantastic about this is that it undermines Raj’s line of claims about how only “high IQ races” can and will adopt conservative, libertarian, free-market, etc. “good” societies and it’s the “low IQ races” that want liberalism, big government, statism, etc. - which is precisely why Raj wants to restrict non-whites from coming into America through draconian immigration policies: the continued inclusion of these low-IQ non-whites will cause conservatism to get outvoted and therefore be destroyed by these morons, and liberalism will be cemented as the civic religion. “Demographics is destiny,” as he always says after explaining this argument why brown people shouldn’t be let in.
But wait. **How are all these high-IQ folks professing to be liberals?**That simply can’t be, if Raj is right.
And why are all the lily-white, high-IQ nations of Europe built on social-democratic models?
(That sounds you hear is Raj’s worldview - or what’s left of it - shattering into pieces.)
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All of which I would agree with. Those are also the fears that I’ve personally never seen anyone question. Living in a better school zone/lower crime area is probably very rarely debated.
If you were to then go say anyone that lives in those lesser areas is inherently bad, that would (imo) qualify as a fear not backed up with logic.
And the idea of systemic oppression in this country is (very widely accepted this way) to be a subconscious oppression far more often than intentional. Hence my comment with you implying people mean absolutes in regards to POC when referencing systemic oppression.
Saying that anyone who acknowledges systemic oppression also believes white people are to blame for every and all bad things that occur to POC is just plain stupid.
Have you ever been to a “bad” neighborhood?
My Uncle owns/operates a funeral home in the “hood” (codespeak 
) back home.
We used to go cut the grass down there, hang out while he embalmed people, visit people in the neighborhood, basically all the stuff you do for a family business. Would you be surprised if I told you were never got robbed or threatened or attacked or shot?
Would you be surprised if I told you most people in the “hood” want to mind their own business and live their life like everyone else?
From what I’ve observed, most of them (especially older folks) don’t consider it a “bad” neighborhood. They probably grew up there. At some point the property value probably fell and poverty set in. Many leave, some don’t, and a small portion of the population commit a majority of the crimes.
People consider the city I lived in as a kid a “bad” city. I’ve never thought about it that way. Even in the “hood” parts where I didn’t grow up (but did frequent when I was trying to fit in with the “thugs” for ~3 dumb years) I’ve never seen some of the stuff they show on tv. This doesn’t mean it doesn’t happen, but the media definitely fear-mongers for viewers.
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[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:1232, topic:228119, full:true”]
And a “high IQ style society” is superior - you’ve said so over and over and over. That’s the position yiive taken.[/quote]
I prefer to live in a high IQ style society. I don’t hate or think low IQ groups are racially inferior because they cannot replicate a high IQ style society.
[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:1232, topic:228119, full:true”]
No, I didn’t dodge anything - I addressed value on the exact measurement you brought up - the success (or not) of societies, and the fact that that success (or not) is driven by race. [/quote]
Based on what I’ve read on IQ and things that correlate to IQ, including the heritability of IQ I consider this objectively true.
Edit: Just to be clear here IQ is heritable, IQ varies by race and how a society turns out is highly effected by the average IQ of a society.
[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:1232, topic:228119, full:true”]
That’s your own value measurement[/quote]
NO I consider it a FACT. It’s not a personal value.
[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:1232, topic:228119, full:true”]
- and using it, logic dictates what we already know from reading your posts: you believe in the inferiority of certain races because you believe in the inferiority of certain race-specific “shithole” societies.[/quote]
Societies where they treat women like chattel, engage in violent brutality, practise things like cannibalism, child abuse to me are shit, yes. Do you disagree with this?
However That doesn’t mean I think they’re lesser human beings or have lesser worth than high IQ populations which is what you’re clearly hinting at. People of all races are of equal value as humans, but that’s completely different than saying they are different in abilities.
[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:1232, topic:228119, full:true”]
Well, no, even assuming that’s true, use of that athletic advantage as part of sport and entertainment isn’t something very high on the value scale, especially the scale of moral value. It’s a non-event. Leaping ability isn’t being used toward some moral end. You’re offering up a red herring, like you always do.[/quote]
Again you’re conflating what I consider an objective truth with a moral value. IQ has been studied for a long time and shown to correlate with a lot of the behaviours we consider successful.
Where were you when I responded to your last post? You have a tendency to slink away.
[quote=“thunderbolt23, post:1233, topic:228119, full:true”]
]
No, I didn’t admit it - I don’t take that position. Is there institutional discrimination? Yes, in certain ways, but it’s driven by individuals in positions of institutional power who discriminate and who, by virtue of their position, encourage others to do so out of fear. That takes an individual act and reinforces it to be a larger, more institutional act.[/quote]
You don’t have any actual evidence and you’re basically hinting at systemic oppression.
This is called confirmation bias. Do you think minorities don’t racially discriminate?
I’ve lived most of my life in the most racially diverse city in the world and I’ve seen different races discriminate in personal and professional settings.
And even then a lot of that stuff happens late, late, at night. Long past the time when most normal people are out and about.
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A fine Christian once told me: "Nothing good happens after 11pm 
I’ve worked in so-called “hoods” for a total of eight years. 
Great.
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In my defense, there are so many responses on this thread I can’t really keep up with them so I don’t know which one you’re referring to. And what you call “slink away”, I call being productive at work.
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Wait, we’re trying to be scientific about things? I thought we were playing a game of taking ridiculous stances on topics we know nothing about, then linking articles whose titles maybe kinda appear to support our poorly defined assertions! Or did I miss the point here?
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Ahhh… I see. We’re at the point in this thread where we counter alternative facts about race and IQ with alternative facts about political views and IQ? Alrighty then. Ha! I missed that. Well done, antiquity. BTW, 94.5 percent of classical liberals have more grey matter than progressives or traditional conservatives. You know it’s true when you see that .5 there. It’s so specific it must be the truth!
That will be upcoming when you start a thread on your views on economics
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Remember hearing a playback of this interview on ESPN radio last week and though it was relevant to this topic. I believe @therajraj talked about black people being bad swimmers because of denser bones earlier in this thread.