Best Way to Invest 20k

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21

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

Small working interest in a horizontal play, if you could find someone who would let you in for a very very small amount. Preferably Wolfberry production.

I’ve never made less than 30% per year, even in 2009 (a bad year for oil).

They will let friends and family in for $10K or $20K, but it’s usually secretaries or someone who works on a deal. Going heads up, it’s usually at least 5-6 million to play and you get promoted a little from the prospect finder.[/quote]

You know anyone? I have $100k burning a hole in my pocket, and would like to invest it in oil.[/quote]

$100K is really not enough to invest in O&G working interest (cost bearing interest) unless you are in the business — a well is $5-6 million and people typically want you to participate for no less than 5% or so — otherwise, the accounting is a pain the ass.

The people who take small investors are usually crooks.

I think the better approach is to purchase ROYALTY interest — that is, an interest in a mineral estate where you get payment for oil and gas produced. I’ve been doing this since 1998 (when oil was $9/bbl) and have really gained a nice portfolio.

Royalty interest are not cost bearing, and typically have a very good return.

Just go to a royalty auction site and start small — $5k, $10k and get your feet wet.[/quote]

Thanks for the info. Is there any royalty auction site you like more than others?

22

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

Small working interest in a horizontal play, if you could find someone who would let you in for a very very small amount. Preferably Wolfberry production.

I’ve never made less than 30% per year, even in 2009 (a bad year for oil).

They will let friends and family in for $10K or $20K, but it’s usually secretaries or someone who works on a deal. Going heads up, it’s usually at least 5-6 million to play and you get promoted a little from the prospect finder.[/quote]

You know anyone? I have $100k burning a hole in my pocket, and would like to invest it in oil.[/quote]

$100K is really not enough to invest in O&G working interest (cost bearing interest) unless you are in the business — a well is $5-6 million and people typically want you to participate for no less than 5% or so — otherwise, the accounting is a pain the ass.

The people who take small investors are usually crooks.

I think the better approach is to purchase ROYALTY interest — that is, an interest in a mineral estate where you get payment for oil and gas produced. I’ve been doing this since 1998 (when oil was $9/bbl) and have really gained a nice portfolio.

Royalty interest are not cost bearing, and typically have a very good return.

Just go to a royalty auction site and start small — $5k, $10k and get your feet wet.[/quote]

Thanks for the info. Is there any royalty auction site you like more than others?
[/quote]

I’ve asked a guy who works as a royalty buyer which one is the best one for a small investor. It’ll take him a day or so I bet to get back to me. He’s in NYC and probably already out drinking.

23

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

Thanks for the info. Is there any royalty auction site you like more than others?
[/quote]

I’ve asked a guy who works as a royalty buyer which one is the best one for a small investor. It’ll take him a day or so I bet to get back to me. He’s in NYC and probably already out drinking.
[/quote]

He recommended the same one I use energynet.com.

It’s kind of a pain in the ass to register; you have to prove you are an accredited investor, so you have to have $1,000,000 liquid I think and income over $500,000/year or something along those lines. They actually called my banker, stock broker, looked at tax returns.

If you can’t swing that, there are some ways around it, but I don’t know them.

The way I valued things is pretty quick and dirty. I just get the net income, figure a 20% return, and then back into my max purchase price, as the return has never been less than 30%, and use proxy bid feature because I’ve failed at all my “snipe” attempts.

Now, the above method does not take into account declining production curves, but most of the stuff being sold is old and already at the flat part of the curve (or at least in the fields where I buy). My theory is that there is no where to go but up, and with the new field rules the Texas RRC put out in horizontal drilling, these old fields are going to go crazy.

Your results may vary; I am not a professional; use at your own risk; etc.

24

was going to say index funds but those don’t get above 10% like everything thethirdruffian or angrychicken recommended

25

Sell dope and rap!

26

gold

27

silver

28

maybe platinum

29

palladium if you’re a connoisseur

30

Good suggestions, Belligerent. Always good to have a diversified portfolio.

We might add land, livestock and slaves to this list. In an uncertain economy, it’s prudent to return to the basics.

31

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Good suggestions, Belligerent. Always good to have a diversified portfolio.

We might add land, livestock and slaves to this list. In an uncertain economy, it’s prudent to return to the basics. [/quote]

I have to agree.

I’m a buyer of slaves at these levels. I anticipate food and storage costs will remain steady for the time being and with the current weakness in the global economy, shipping containers will remain reasonable. I do see short term demand picking up in SE asia as well as central Africa and I believe I’ll be able to achieve an IRR of over %18. If hard commodity prices fall in the near term however, food, storage, and insurance costs are going to severely curtail any return I might otherwise achieve.

32

[quote]Dr. Pangloss wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Good suggestions, Belligerent. Always good to have a diversified portfolio.

We might add land, livestock and slaves to this list. In an uncertain economy, it’s prudent to return to the basics. [/quote]

I have to agree.

I’m a buyer of slaves at these levels. I anticipate food and storage costs will remain steady for the time being and with the current weakness in the global economy, shipping containers will remain reasonable. I do see short term demand picking up in SE asia as well as central Africa and I believe I’ll be able to achieve an IRR of over %18. If hard commodity prices fall in the near term however, food, storage, and insurance costs are going to severely curtail any return I might otherwise achieve.
[/quote]

Dude, shipping the slaves to your own country is soooo nineteenth century. Keep them in their country of origin, and set them to work manufacturing shoes and circuit boards and picking cacao pods for your company. Also, make them pay for their own food and housing. Get with the times. Sheesh.

33

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]Dr. Pangloss wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Good suggestions, Belligerent. Always good to have a diversified portfolio.

We might add land, livestock and slaves to this list. In an uncertain economy, it’s prudent to return to the basics. [/quote]

I have to agree.

I’m a buyer of slaves at these levels. I anticipate food and storage costs will remain steady for the time being and with the current weakness in the global economy, shipping containers will remain reasonable. I do see short term demand picking up in SE asia as well as central Africa and I believe I’ll be able to achieve an IRR of over %18. If hard commodity prices fall in the near term however, food, storage, and insurance costs are going to severely curtail any return I might otherwise achieve.
[/quote]

Dude, shipping the slaves to your own country is soooo nineteenth century. Keep them in their country of origin, and set them to work manufacturing shoes and circuit boards and picking cacao pods for your company. Also, make them pay for their own food and housing. Get with the times. Sheesh. [/quote]

Oh, I understand what you’re saying but you’re missing out on significant arbitrage opportunities.

Without going into too much detail, if the cost of procuring these “assets” plus food, storage, transportation less “slippage” is less that I can get for said asset at the CAMEC mine in the DRC, then I’ll make that trade all day, every day. I can finance the assets on this end and get paid when they hit Boma, pay off the short term loan and do it all over again.

34

Nobody’s mentioned coloured stones, they keep going up, and my wife feels like she’s involved, she does all this research, it’s cute, keeps her happy, and it’s money in the bank. Eveythings papered, so if I get in a pinch, my house gets robbed, money in hand, LOL

35

[quote]Dr. Pangloss wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:

[quote]Dr. Pangloss wrote:

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Good suggestions, Belligerent. Always good to have a diversified portfolio.

We might add land, livestock and slaves to this list. In an uncertain economy, it’s prudent to return to the basics. [/quote]

I have to agree.

I’m a buyer of slaves at these levels. I anticipate food and storage costs will remain steady for the time being and with the current weakness in the global economy, shipping containers will remain reasonable. I do see short term demand picking up in SE asia as well as central Africa and I believe I’ll be able to achieve an IRR of over %18. If hard commodity prices fall in the near term however, food, storage, and insurance costs are going to severely curtail any return I might otherwise achieve.
[/quote]

Dude, shipping the slaves to your own country is soooo nineteenth century. Keep them in their country of origin, and set them to work manufacturing shoes and circuit boards and picking cacao pods for your company. Also, make them pay for their own food and housing. Get with the times. Sheesh. [/quote]

Oh, I understand what you’re saying but you’re missing out on significant arbitrage opportunities.

Without going into too much detail, if the cost of procuring these “assets” plus food, storage, transportation less “slippage” is less that I can get for said asset at the CAMEC mine in the DRC, then I’ll make that trade all day, every day. I can finance the assets on this end and get paid when they hit Boma, pay off the short term loan and do it all over again.
[/quote]

Plus these assets are the very definition of a renewable resource, so you’re helping the environment. Win-win.

36

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]thethirdruffian wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

Thanks for the info. Is there any royalty auction site you like more than others?
[/quote]

I’ve asked a guy who works as a royalty buyer which one is the best one for a small investor. It’ll take him a day or so I bet to get back to me. He’s in NYC and probably already out drinking.
[/quote]

He recommended the same one I use energynet.com.

It’s kind of a pain in the ass to register; you have to prove you are an accredited investor, so you have to have $1,000,000 liquid I think and income over $500,000/year or something along those lines. They actually called my banker, stock broker, looked at tax returns.

If you can’t swing that, there are some ways around it, but I don’t know them.

The way I valued things is pretty quick and dirty. I just get the net income, figure a 20% return, and then back into my max purchase price, as the return has never been less than 30%, and use proxy bid feature because I’ve failed at all my “snipe” attempts.

Now, the above method does not take into account declining production curves, but most of the stuff being sold is old and already at the flat part of the curve (or at least in the fields where I buy). My theory is that there is no where to go but up, and with the new field rules the Texas RRC put out in horizontal drilling, these old fields are going to go crazy.

Your results may vary; I am not a professional; use at your own risk; etc.[/quote]

Thanks, and yes I am accredited.

37

[quote]AnytimeJake wrote:
Nobody’s mentioned coloured stones, they keep going up, and my wife feels like she’s involved, she does all this research, it’s cute, keeps her happy, and it’s money in the bank. Eveythings papered, so if I get in a pinch, my house gets robbed, money in hand, LOL[/quote]

You talking about gem stones?

38

Coloured diamonds,