Yes it is all about the optimization.
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I didnt get it done. Ive only had it measured once and it was a solo test.
I would argue that IGF-1 is not the only positive factor during a course of GH optimization. In fact I think T alone decreases your sensitivity to testosterone.
GH has been proven to have a very synergistic effect in older men taking either cream, GH or GH and cream together.
Researchers notated that GH supplementation increased the efficiency of T.
Which of course totally makes sense because T increases cell size, and GH increases the amount of cells through hyperplasia.
I would also argue that TRT is suppressive to the somatropic axis, hence why T alone reduces T effectiveness.
We have guys that are huge, 10% BF and lab work is bullets, in physiological range. Thats usually always with T and GH (peptide pituitary stimulation) together.
I find the variance in SHBG in the presence (or absence) of insulin interesting.
While I was 16:8 intermittent fasting, my SHBG ranged from 31 - 38 most every timeā¦ Likely reducing my free T.
I havenāt fasted in a while and my SHBG was 27 on that last test.
Iām injecting EOD and generally speaking, I feel pretty good at these numbers. And strangely enough, about a month after those labs, I had urologist pulled labs and TT came in at 1080 with HTC at 47. Those are all he testedā¦ He asked me how I felt and I said good. He didnāt have any issues with those numbers.
Thanks again
TESTOSTERONE, FREE (DIALYSIS) AND TOTAL,MS
TESTOSTERONE, TOTAL, MS
1137 H
250-1100 ng/dL
For additional information, please refer to
http://education.questdiagnostics.com/faq/
TotalTestosteroneLCMSMSFAQ165 ā¦ Show More
TESTOSTERONE, FREE
295.6 H
35.0-155.0 pg/mL
This test was developed and its analytical performance
characteristics have been determined by Quest
Diagnostics Nichols Institute Chantilly, VA. It has
not been cleared or approved by the U.S. Food and Drug
Administration. This assay has been validated pursuant
to the CLIA regulations and is used for clinical
purposes. Show Less
My point its, I doubt it would go up. But you would increase your sensitivity to T. Peptides have a saturation limit so they cannot overstimulate, this is one of the great functions of them, they cannot be abused.
Provider? Pffftā¦these are all my own testing.
I donāt know where or why I said that?
Your saying quest says his free t is 17 and youāre saying it is 1.7? Impossible.
We donāt really do many labs, we use Quest if people are in a hurry so it is an option. But most of our guys do their own labs, usually with their GP or at Private MD, cause it is the cheapest place.
I have labs on same person different labs, if there was a x10 discrepancy. I would know.
I think, what I got from your original posts is that quest says his FT is 17 and you are saying it is 9.
Which I said, is not terrible. And itās not, its a lot higher than when we usually see people with a normal TT and low free T. Itās usually around 3 or 5.
And it def does not change the assessment with history included.
Well in summary, Iāve also chatted to @increasemyt about this
Iāve got these symptoms - Lack of concentration, my working ability is very low since two years, anxiety, low energy and libido decreased a bit although still decent but not like before, very difficult to put muscle, slow recovery after gym. Iāve always been a low energy guy, maybe Iāve never had decent t but the last two years its way worse.
My thyroid is not perfect, but not bad as well - T3 is 2.8. Iāve got nodule in the thyroid, its not cancerous. I also have small pituitary empty sella, prolactin was slightly elevated and I take small doses of caber since end of April.
I think my test is not terrible, but I need to somehow double it and except some kind of treatment I dont see other way
Plan to try HCG mono first after 2 weeks to start maybe. Yesterday I made one injection 100 UI and after it I feel groggy and lower energy. Do you think this initial side effects can disappear? I plan to inject 100 UI ED.
You still havenāt clarified. Is his free T 17 ng/dl or not?
Dont kill me, just a messenger dany bossa asked me to post this:
This was sent to me from @dbossa
You guys are breaking your heads and arguing over things that are irrelevant. All of the statements being made by @increasemyt are due to abuse of anabolic steroids that are synthetic derivatives of the natural hormone of testosterone or studies on gender change involving the complete suppression of androgens. This is completely irrelevant, and every single explanation given has gone through one window and out the other. Every response from him proves over and over his inability to understand how TRT works. He doesnāt even have a level one newbie grasp of the concept. He didnāt even appear to know the difference between pg/mL and ng/dL until I explained it to him. He didnāt know of the error of the LabCorp units that are indicated. 10,000 labs and he didnāt figure this out yet? Come on. Itās hysterical. They still have not provided a single instance when TESTOSTERONE was administered, at any level, and caused harm. Why have they been unable to do this? Because there is NO study in existence that demonstrates this. However, there are tons of studies that show the benefits. You say he brings up kidney failure and all kinds of other nonsense. Show me ANY STUDY where testosterone caused kidney failure at ANY DOSE. This is a many who calls himself optimized when his labs indicate a certain number. Who does that?? We treat symptoms, not numbers! Plus, the guy is doing weekly injections? Find me ONE man who is optimized on weekly injections? You canāt! Plus, he is blocking E2 which is the thing that provides virtually ALL the benefits of TRT which is absolutely and unequivocally counter-productive. Until he can provide just one study where a man was administered either testosterone or estrogen, and it caused harm, heās just shooting off his mouth to a group of idiots that donāt know any better. This is why I exited the group. This is why Dr Nichols deleted his account. No, we wonāt be coming back.
Still within range 
600 x .02 = 12 or 500 x .02 = 10
Cant remember his exact TT>
Why did the other calculator give higher values than the first one?
My biggest issue is with your current situation and I think that needs to be under control first, and if you do TRT that situation needs to be closely monitored.
We already saw in another thread what happened to a guy in your same situation who did not take care of his issue first, his PRL skyrocketed to 1,000.
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Increasemyt:
What sorta protocol do you recommend to someone just starting? (in general)
Just curious
I donāt really think the protocol matters much honestly until levels reach steady state.
This is why I personally suggest once weekly injections at the beginning. It doesnāt matter what schedule you choose, at the beginning your levels are going to go up and down no matter what. So doing something to try to keep your levels āstableā during this period of time makes little sense to me.
So once levels are at steady state, it doesnāt matter what schedule you do there either, unless there is something in your history that says you either need more frequent dosing because your free T is skyrocketing compared to your TT. Or less frequent dosing cause you have high HCT.
So it is really up to the patient it is a personal preference, and that preference changes a lot at the beginning because curiosity kills the cat.
So we try not to tell people exactly what to do, we try to guide people on the protocol they want to try.
Twice per week and once per week are the most common in our practice.
I think if your not doing HCG with your TRT then youāre crazy. I also think this is why a lot of guys that do T alone have problems with SHBG. We donāt see that in our practice cause almost everyone takes HCG.
So thereās the first 2. Then you have anastrozole. We send it out on the first one and tell people not to take it, they always end up trying it though what can you do.
After a year or so, with good guidance, you will finally end up where you want to be. If it takes longer than that, you need a better coach.
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But how can i take care of it?
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You gotta get that dopamine agonist dialed in. Whenever you feel you have exhausted all options there, then try TRT. I had felt from your story that your TT and FT went up after taking it. So that right there tells you that is the issue.
Once you have exhausted that option, then would I not try TRT I would plan on a 6 month testosterone supplementation trial effort. getting labs monthly to check PRL, while continuing the dop ag
Then I would attempt a full recovery, the entire time suppressing PRL and see what happens.
I also say this cause I donāt know if your symptoms will be alleviated like someone with a different reason for sub optimal TT and FT numbers.
So a trial run will tell you if your symptoms are alleviated, I am worried, it makes them worse.
I have tried all differing protocols of TRT and have never felt a sex drive/libido. Itās gone on even before TRT.
Which agonist do you fell is safest? I was looking at Mirapex and ropinirole to try perhaps.
Any feedback ? Iām starting to wonder if TRT isnāt going to fix whatās wrong with me.
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