Bench Press: Shaq vs. Charles Barkley

Off Topic
41

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]tsantos wrote:
Still, Sir Charles for a short fat-ass having to go up against monsters was a very good player (and funny as hell) [/quote]

Barkley was an athletic freak of nature and one of the top 3 power forwards of all time. Calling him a “short fatass” and “very good” is a complete disservice to his place in the game.[/quote]

Kevin Garnett, Dirk Nowitzki, Tim Duncan. Just to name a few PF’s still playing who are better than Barkley was. I love Barkley and all, but top 3 of all time? That’s a reach.[/quote]

I would take Karl Malone, Larry Bird, and Shawn Kemp over Barkley also. [/quote]

You had me until Kemp…come on now bro…come on.
[/quote]

I guess I’m wrong about that one. Wouldn’t be the first time. I was thinking back to that Finals year,and those years around that time. But, like someone else said he didn’t put together many years at the top. How about Kemp’s best year was more impressive to me than Barkley’s best year?

There is one thing to remember about all this.

It is very important that everyone understands this.

I am not a role-model!

42

[quote]UtahLama wrote:
Karl was at his biggest around 1999-2000[/quote]

Steroids!!! AAAAGGGHHH Fucking Steroids!!!

43

[quote]mbdix wrote:
How about Kemp’s best year was more impressive to me than Barkley’s best year?[/quote]

He would need to have won the MVP for it to be a better year than barkleys best.

44

[quote]Aggv wrote:
I think it’s easier to think about who’s better based on if you’re picking a team and the players are all 19yr old rookies. What order do you pick them in?

Where would Malone be with out stockton?
Who was the 2nd best player on any barkley team?
Did Malone ever win a MVP? [/quote]

I think that’s a great way to think of it (if they’re all rookies, what order do you pick them in?) but again, that still leaves the question. Do I want 18 straight very, very good Malone years or a dozen years of maybe-a-bit-better-at-his-peak Barkley? Not saying there’s a right or wrong answer.

If you’re defining it by “who gives you a better chance of winning ONE title at his apex?” then it’s probably Chuck.

Malone did win two MVP’s, one in 1997 and the shortened 1999 lockout season.

The question about “Who was the second-best player on any Barkley team?” is a fair question because he never played with anyone that had as good of a career as Stockton…but let’s not act like Barkley played his entire career with a bunch of stiffs.

His first two Sixers teams had Moses Malone, Maurice Cheeks, and a fading Dr. J. The next few years with the Sixers were pretty thin, but the 1993 Suns had Dan Majerle (three-time All-Star), Kevin Johnson (also a three-time All-Star and when healthy, was arguably better than Stockton for a brief time), and Danny Ainge (who started on four straight Boston teams that made the Finals). He then joined a Rockets team that had Olajuwon and Drexler. Sure, he never got to play with a HOF for his entire prime like Malone did, but he played with PLENTY of good players. The only time he really had to carry bad teams were the late-80’s and early-90’s Sixers. The early-career Sixers had plenty of good guys, those Suns teams had several fine players, and the Rockets team he joined did too.

Finally, asking where Malone would be without Stockton is a fair question - but it’s a little insulting to Malone’s greatness IMO to insinuate that he wouldn’t have been 98 percent as good. The guy averaged 27 p

45

[quote]Aggv wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:
How about Kemp’s best year was more impressive to me than Barkley’s best year?[/quote]

He would need to have won the MVP for it to be a better year than barkleys best. [/quote]

Fair enough.

But, Barkley looks like he is having a stroke when he is hitting a golf ball. Just throwing that out there

46


I must eat you.

47

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]Aggv wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:
How about Kemp’s best year was more impressive to me than Barkley’s best year?[/quote]

He would need to have won the MVP for it to be a better year than barkleys best. [/quote]

Fair enough.

But, Barkley looks like he is having a stroke when he is hitting a golf ball. Just throwing that out there
[/quote]

see what I did there? a stroke because it’s a terrible swing that looks like he might actually be having a stroke mid-swing. But, it also can be called a stroke of the golf club.

48

[quote]UtahLama wrote:
I must eat you.[/quote]

HAHA. That is funny

49

[quote]UtahLama wrote:
I must eat you.[/quote]

as a Cavs fan, i find this not funny, but par for the course of cleveland sports.

50

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]tsantos wrote:
Still, Sir Charles for a short fat-ass having to go up against monsters was a very good player (and funny as hell) [/quote]

Barkley was an athletic freak of nature and one of the top 3 power forwards of all time. Calling him a “short fatass” and “very good” is a complete disservice to his place in the game.[/quote]

Kevin Garnett, Dirk Nowitzki, Tim Duncan. Just to name a few PF’s still playing who are better than Barkley was. I love Barkley and all, but top 3 of all time? That’s a reach.[/quote]

I would take Karl Malone, Larry Bird, and Shawn Kemp over Barkley also. [/quote]

You had me until Kemp…come on now bro…come on.
[/quote]

I guess I’m wrong about that one. Wouldn’t be the first time. I was thinking back to that Finals year,and those years around that time. But, like someone else said he didn’t put together many years at the top. How about Kemp’s best year was more impressive to me than Barkley’s best year?

There is one thing to remember about all this.

It is very important that everyone understands this.

I am not a role-model![/quote]

You are out of your fucking mind. Barkley had a 28/13/4/1/1 year while shooting almost 60% from the floor. That wasn’t even his mvp season. Kemp’s best season was 19/11/2/1/1. Matter of fact, Barkley’s CAREER AVERAGES are better than Kemps best season. It blows my mind how many people are sleeping on Barkley. Top 3 pf of all time, point blank end of discussion.

51

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]tsantos wrote:
Still, Sir Charles for a short fat-ass having to go up against monsters was a very good player (and funny as hell) [/quote]

Barkley was an athletic freak of nature and one of the top 3 power forwards of all time. Calling him a “short fatass” and “very good” is a complete disservice to his place in the game.[/quote]

Kevin Garnett, Dirk Nowitzki, Tim Duncan. Just to name a few PF’s still playing who are better than Barkley was. I love Barkley and all, but top 3 of all time? That’s a reach.[/quote]

I would take Karl Malone, Larry Bird, and Shawn Kemp over Barkley also. [/quote]

You had me until Kemp…come on now bro…come on.
[/quote]

I guess I’m wrong about that one. Wouldn’t be the first time. I was thinking back to that Finals year,and those years around that time. But, like someone else said he didn’t put together many years at the top. How about Kemp’s best year was more impressive to me than Barkley’s best year?

There is one thing to remember about all this.

It is very important that everyone understands this.

I am not a role-model![/quote]

You are out of your fucking mind. Barkley had a 28/13/4/1/1 year while shooting almost 60% from the floor. That wasn’t even his mvp season. Kemp’s best season was 19/11/2/1/1. Matter of fact, Barkley’s CAREER AVERAGES are better than Kemps best season. It blows my mind how many people are sleeping on Barkley. Top 3 pf of all time, point blank end of discussion.
[/quote]

Whiteflash please jump to 3:36. LOL

52

Back to the video;

watch shaq bench 315?there is no way thats fake. Its less than bodyweight for him and he seems to struggle with it a little bit.

I think Barkley is benching with lighter (15-25lb) weight plates, cause the noise is still there and there is some mass involved?(???)

53

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]UtahLama wrote:

[quote]mbdix wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]tsantos wrote:
Still, Sir Charles for a short fat-ass having to go up against monsters was a very good player (and funny as hell) [/quote]

Barkley was an athletic freak of nature and one of the top 3 power forwards of all time. Calling him a “short fatass” and “very good” is a complete disservice to his place in the game.[/quote]

Kevin Garnett, Dirk Nowitzki, Tim Duncan. Just to name a few PF’s still playing who are better than Barkley was. I love Barkley and all, but top 3 of all time? That’s a reach.[/quote]

I would take Karl Malone, Larry Bird, and Shawn Kemp over Barkley also. [/quote]

You had me until Kemp…come on now bro…come on.
[/quote]

I guess I’m wrong about that one. Wouldn’t be the first time. I was thinking back to that Finals year,and those years around that time. But, like someone else said he didn’t put together many years at the top. How about Kemp’s best year was more impressive to me than Barkley’s best year?

There is one thing to remember about all this.

It is very important that everyone understands this.

I am not a role-model![/quote]

You are out of your fucking mind. Barkley had a 28/13/4/1/1 year while shooting almost 60% from the floor. That wasn’t even his mvp season. Kemp’s best season was 19/11/2/1/1. Matter of fact, Barkley’s CAREER AVERAGES are better than Kemps best season. It blows my mind how many people are sleeping on Barkley. Top 3 pf of all time, point blank end of discussion.
[/quote]

Whiteflash please jump to 3:36. LOL[/quote]

Suxdix, please stop posting on stuff that you clearly don’t understand.

54

haha

55

I’m with WhiteFlash, Barkley is top 3 PF’s of All-Time. Duncan is clear #1, one can argue for Malone or Barkley. Nowitzki is great, but I’d put him and KG at 4 and 5. Barkley was one of the best when THE best were playing, which means a lot in my opinion.

The whole Bird being a small forward thing, while I agree, is touchy kind of, because I’ve seen him listed as PF before. PF is just a weird position anyways, in that Dirk could easily be put in the SF position and Duncan and KG regularly pick up Center duties. Malone and Barkley are the only ‘true’ PF’s on the list I believe, but even that is subjective.

I’m not including people like Bob Petit and Elvin Hayes just because they played at much different time, so I don’t know how to really compare them to these 5, though I think they could be argued in the top 5.

56

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
The whole Bird being a small forward thing, while I agree, is touchy kind of, because I’ve seen him listed as PF before. PF is just a weird position anyways, in that Dirk could easily be put in the SF position and Duncan and KG regularly pick up Center duties. Malone and Barkley are the only ‘true’ PF’s on the list I believe, but even that is subjective.
[/quote]

I agree. We’re seeing a lot of NBA writers these days eschew positional designations in favor of “bigs” (PF/C), “wings” (SG/SF), and “point guards” because there’s so much fungibility. As you’ve noted here, Duncan and KG are often the lone true big on the floor for their team, but they’re still considered “power forwards” and not centers. Heck, even LeBron is often the second-biggest player on the floor for the Heat, with three wing players and Bosh or Anderson as the lone true “big” on the floor with him - is he the “power forward” then?

It’s still a fun discussion.

57

[quote]ActivitiesGuy wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
The whole Bird being a small forward thing, while I agree, is touchy kind of, because I’ve seen him listed as PF before. PF is just a weird position anyways, in that Dirk could easily be put in the SF position and Duncan and KG regularly pick up Center duties. Malone and Barkley are the only ‘true’ PF’s on the list I believe, but even that is subjective.
[/quote]

I agree. We’re seeing a lot of NBA writers these days eschew positional designations in favor of “bigs” (PF/C), “wings” (SG/SF), and “point guards” because there’s so much fungibility. As you’ve noted here, Duncan and KG are often the lone true big on the floor for their team, but they’re still considered “power forwards” and not centers. Heck, even LeBron is often the second-biggest player on the floor for the Heat, with three wing players and Bosh or Anderson as the lone true “big” on the floor with him - is he the “power forward” then?

It’s still a fun discussion.
[/quote]

Ohh yeah, still a fun discussion. I’m such an old school hoops fan, so I’m always for conversations like this. haha

Cool article I like on the evolution of the 5 main positions in Basketball, just if you’re interested.

There is also a team a year back, can’t remember, that got rid of the roles of guards/forwards/center. Forgot who, had positions like Runner and Middle Man or something, just can’t think of the key words to type into Google to find it lol

58

Size is a relative discussion…Duncan plays almost an exclusive center role, but required in his contract that he be referred to as a PF.

Bird played more of a SF role but had PF size.

Barkley is the size of most point guards but spent most of the time in the paint (except for his late career 3-point barrage).

It’s a great debate regardless.

Kemp is fat.

59

[quote]carbiduis wrote:
Back to the video;

watch shaq bench 315?there is no way thats fake. Its less than bodyweight for him and he seems to struggle with it a little bit.

I think Barkley is benching with lighter (15-25lb) weight plates, cause the noise is still there and there is some mass involved?(???)[/quote]

Apparently you didn’t watch the whole video like a few others. Chuck had fake plates on his. At the end of the video, someone actually throws a “45lb plate” off of Chuck’s bar at Shaq.

60

[quote]ZJStrope wrote:

[quote]carbiduis wrote:
Back to the video;

watch shaq bench 315?there is no way thats fake. Its less than bodyweight for him and he seems to struggle with it a little bit.

I think Barkley is benching with lighter (15-25lb) weight plates, cause the noise is still there and there is some mass involved?(???)[/quote]

Apparently you didn’t watch the whole video like a few others. Chuck had fake plates on his. At the end of the video, someone actually throws a “45lb plate” off of Chuck’s bar at Shaq.
[/quote]

Apparently you didn’t read the second post in this thread…from ME where I was the FIRST person to point this out.

Do you think barkley is benching with styrofoam plates? Or 15-25lb plates Like I just suggested in my post you just responded to, cause there is SOME weight there, its not like hes pushing a broomstick.