Beginner's Handgun for Home Protection?

Off Topic
21

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
So the wife and I had an unnerving incident last night that now has me seriously considering something small to keep around. Never in my life did I think I’d understand the desire to have an item capable of such power before, but waking up and seeing a silhouette of someone standing on your bedroom fire escape, slowly raising open the screen of your window can make you quickly realize that in that instant, you’d have no trouble whatsoever in doing what needs be done when the lives of your loved ones are at risk.

I have a few friends who hunt with rifles, and even a close buddy who is an instructor for the NYPD, but he’s away for a while, and to be honest, my mind is racing after this morning (it’s 7pm as I type this, and I’ve been awake since 1:30 am). Any thoughts or suggestions would certainly be appreciated.

Thanks guys (and gals).

S

[/quote]

Might be wiser to look for effective and reliable instead of beginner. Beginner would be for a young person looking to learn how to shoot targets for fun. I believe reliable and effective would better suit the situation you describe. Glock 19 (9mm) or Glock 21 (.45) solid choice. The 19 runs $499 retail and the 21 $549. I would go with the 21, or atleast another .45, because you are in NY and the round limit is 7. Better to have 7 rounds of a higher caliber than a lower.

That being said, for home defense you can’t go wrong with a shotgun. You can get a Ramington 870 or Mossberg for cheaper than the pistol. $350-$425. Get one with a 6+1 capacity and you have 7 rounds with much a much better gun at close range than the pistol.

With a once per week or twice per month range session, you can go from beginner to intermediate fairly quickly. Make sure to do your research on technique the same way you have on bbing and you will be fine. Lots of good info out there. Be careful, it can be addictive and become an expensive hobby really easily. Worth it though IMO to know you can protect yourself in the event something happens.

22

[quote]Brett620 wrote:
Glock 21.

No less than a .45 for inside your home. Smaller caliber if you carry.

Remington 12 gauge w/ slugs is great… BUT the quick access to a .45 can’t be beat.

I’m a LEO so I carry a sub-compact 9mm, have a .45 in the car and another near the bed and an AR-15 and a Remington in the closet if that doesn’t work.

But if I had to pick one, I would go with the Glock 21.

I don’t have a laser, but that a great point for those that don’t spend a lot of time on the range. And chances are your encounter with be with less than ideal lighting FWIW.[/quote]

Basically this.

23

[quote]mbdix wrote:
Sorry to hear about this. Be safe.

I think a pump action shotgun would be an easy and wise investment. Even if you get a handgun as well. The action alone from pumping the shotgun would be enough to scare away an intruder. Also, you have a better chance of hitting your target.[/quote]

Getting off topic a bit here, and I agree with the weapon choice, but pumping the shotgun is not going to scare a possibly drunk guy breaking into a house dead set on harming you. He probably wouldn’t knew what the sound was if he heard it. Keep one in the tube and pointing it at him should be enough to let him know you mean business. If he doesn’t get it, then he will learn quickly he broke into the wrong place.

24

Did you say you’re a beginner?

Then forget the autoloader. Seriously. Forget it. No Glocks or XDs or Sigs or Colt automatics for you for a while.

Buy yourself a Smith & Wesson Model 25 in .45 ACP, if you can afford it, or a Charter Arms Bulldog in .44 Special if you can’t.

A double action revolver in at least 40 caliber is what you want.

Why? Because in the middle of the night, half-asleep, you don’t want to worry about whether a round is in the chamber, whether the safety is on, whether the magazine is seated, whether the hammer is cocked, any of that shit.

You point, and squeeze the trigger. That’s it.

Why .44 special and .45 ACP?

Because they fire big, slow bullets that will knock an intruder on his ass, without punching right through him and through the wall behind him like a high-velocity .357 magnum will. Also, a .357 magnum snubnosed revolver like you will have on your bedside will blind you with an eight inch belch of flame and deafen you with a thunderclap of a report.

Hornady TAP is the best for low-flash defensive loads. Also you want full-moon clips for the .45.

25

[quote]Hip Scar wrote:
For your domestics situation a Taurus Judge loaded with .410 shells w/ a laser site would be excellent.[/quote]

Not a bad suggestion.

Ugly, uncomfortable little hunks of steel, but they’ll do the job.

26

So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.

27

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.
[/quote]

If I was allowed to have a gun (here in Greece I am not, civilians can’t have guns), it would be loaded and next to me 24/7.

28

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Did you say you’re a beginner?

Then forget the autoloader. Seriously. Forget it. No Glocks or XDs or Sigs or Colt automatics for you for a while.

Buy yourself a Smith & Wesson Model 25 in .45 ACP, if you can afford it, or a Charter Arms Bulldog in .44 Special if you can’t.

A double action revolver in at least 40 caliber is what you want.

Why? Because in the middle of the night, half-asleep, you don’t want to worry about whether a round is in the chamber, whether the safety is on, whether the magazine is seated, whether the hammer is cocked, any of that shit.

You point, and squeeze the trigger. That’s it.

Why .44 special and .45 ACP?

Because they fire big, slow bullets that will knock an intruder on his ass, without punching right through him and through the wall behind him like a high-velocity .357 magnum will. Also, a .357 magnum snubnosed revolver like you will have on your bedside will blind you with an eight inch belch of flame and deafen you with a thunderclap of a report.

Hornady TAP is the best for low-flash defensive loads. Also you want full-moon clips for the .45.
[/quote]

Varqanir gave the best advice here so far. My opinion has always been:
No autos for beginners
calibre = or > .40
Always loaded unless there are kids around (or your wife gets pissed at you a lot)
A hand gun is something you use to fight your way back to your rifle.
Consider a 12 gauge. (An old detective I once worked with always took a shotgun when he executed warrants. I quote him often: “you can hear a rat piss on cotton when you have a shotgun”)
And for you Mighty Stu, New York has fucked up gun laws. Make damned sure you know what they are before you end up in prison.
Don’t shoot the bastard while he’s opening your window. Let him come inside. (just kidding. sort of…)

29

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.
[/quote]

I keep a clip in mine at night, safety off, empty chamber. It’s easy to chamber a bullet quickly, and you will have to be awake enough to do it, reducing the likelihood of accidentally discharging the weapon while you fumble in the dark.

If you have kids or whomever around, you can remove the clip, place the gun and clip in a locked case or high on a shelf. Kids wouldn’t even have to know about it really.

30

[quote]niksamaras wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.
[/quote]

If I was allowed to have a gun (here in Greece I am not, civilians can’t have guns), it would be loaded and next to me 24/7.[/quote]

Cool. I would have a 1000 round per second phalanx mounted on each corner of my house.

31

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.
[/quote]

So take those other people and train them. Make them aware. Just because you don’t live by the sword doesn’t mean you won’t die by it.

32

[quote]Varqanir wrote:
Did you say you’re a beginner?

Then forget the autoloader. Seriously. Forget it. No Glocks or XDs or Sigs or Colt automatics for you for a while.

Buy yourself a Smith & Wesson Model 25 in .45 ACP, if you can afford it, or a Charter Arms Bulldog in .44 Special if you can’t.

A double action revolver in at least 40 caliber is what you want.

Why? Because in the middle of the night, half-asleep, you don’t want to worry about whether a round is in the chamber, whether the safety is on, whether the magazine is seated, whether the hammer is cocked, any of that shit.

You point, and squeeze the trigger. That’s it.

Why .44 special and .45 ACP?

Because they fire big, slow bullets that will knock an intruder on his ass, without punching right through him and through the wall behind him like a high-velocity .357 magnum will. Also, a .357 magnum snubnosed revolver like you will have on your bedside will blind you with an eight inch belch of flame and deafen you with a thunderclap of a report.

Hornady TAP is the best for low-flash defensive loads. Also you want full-moon clips for the .45.
[/quote]

I was going to suggest a Glock but I wasn’t thinking about the points being made above. So, I’ll endorse the Smith & Wesson Model 25 as well.

33

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]niksamaras wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.
[/quote]

If I was allowed to have a gun (here in Greece I am not, civilians can’t have guns), it would be loaded and next to me 24/7.[/quote]

Cool. I would have a 1000 round per second phalanx mounted on each corner of my house.
[/quote]

That’s awesome.

34

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]niksamaras wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.
[/quote]

If I was allowed to have a gun (here in Greece I am not, civilians can’t have guns), it would be loaded and next to me 24/7.[/quote]

Cool. I would have a 1000 round per second phalanx mounted on each corner of my house.
[/quote]
And nuclear bombs in the bathroom.

Wait…

35

I’ll say though guys (and thanks so much for everyone voicing their opinions, I’ve really never had to consider this before), I’m not the fondest when it comes to the idea of having a loaded weapon at the ready in the place where I’m hoping to raise kids. Yes, I know that may sound naïve of me, or whatever, but I’m obviously the product of my upbringing, which never really involved fire arms in any type of scenario or situation. If you had a gripe, you’d settle it mano a mano, and live to see another day (geez, I sound like the father in ‘Friday’). Even the few buddies I have that do hunt all the time, the whole sport of it still seems a little odd to me, despite the lovely gifts of venison I receive each year -lol. I don’t mean to say this in any disparaging way of course.

I was joking last night that I’ll probably go with a ‘girlie’ gun due to the smaller nature I would imagine, but reading more, it sounds like the heavier models seem to prevent a lot of the kick you might experience when shooting. The idea of a laser site, aside from just making me think all bad-ass terminator like, makes sense in the fact that I’m probably not going to be spending a lot of time at the range. In fact, while I will most certainly put in my time with an instructor at the onset, I’m really hoping that afterward, after purchase, license, etc, that I’ll never have to see, think about, or use in my lifetime.

Hoping I’m not offending anyone here, that’s never my intention. I’m actually glad that I’m able to throw a question like this on here, knowing that there are plenty of better informed and experienced T-folks who’d be willing to advise. I’m just typically a very calm and peaceful guy, it’s just that seeing the gun issues we’ve got in NYC, combined with the feeling I had the other morning when half awake I raced to my bedroom window screaming for my wife to call the cops, doesn’t really thrill me.

S

36

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
In fact, while I will most certainly put in my time with an instructor at the onset, I’m really hoping that afterward, after purchase, license, etc, that I’ll never have to see, think about, or use in my lifetime.
[/quote]

Mmm… I’d have to really recommend against this. Like all skills, firearm skills deterioriate over time, and while a laser sight will help you point the gun at the target it won’t help you when it comes to controlling recoil. There’s also the issues of safety that I firmly believe should be ingrained into you as second nature, which can only happen by practice.

Put it this way, if I wanted to hire you for contest prep, but only for three days, you’d think I was severely missing the point of having a coach. A bit of time with an instructor at the beginning then doing nothing else is no different.

I understand that you’re a busy guy, but just as you dedicate time and effort into other areas of your life I’d at least schedule regular range time, even if it’s only once a month.

37

Couple things…

“bedroom fire escape”

Are you in an apartment or something similar? While stopping power is a good thing, you might limit what you choose based on this as you definitely don’t want rounds going through walls and possibly hitting an neighbor.

Also, with regards to a laser, while I wouldn’t necessarily rely on it 100% as 238 mentions, I would like to think that if someone breaking in saw a laser pointing at them I may not even have to squeeze the trigger (but damned if I’m not ready to do so).

And if you don’t plan on keeping the gun loaded, you might as well not have it (for home protection).

38

[quote]theBeth wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
So, are some of you guys suggesting having a loaded weapon at the ready?

That is not always the greatest idea. There could be other people to think about that don’t understand firearms like an adult with training and experience.
[/quote]

So take those other people and train them. Make them aware. Just because you don’t live by the sword doesn’t mean you won’t die by it. [/quote]

I was thinking more along these lines- http://www.cabelas.com/product/GunVault-Biometric-Safe/734827.uts?WTz_l=YMAL%3BIK-220659

Or that there may be better ones out there.

39

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
I’ll say though guys (and thanks so much for everyone voicing their opinions, I’ve really never had to consider this before), I’m not the fondest when it comes to the idea of having a loaded weapon at the ready in the place where I’m hoping to raise kids. Yes, I know that may sound naïve of me, or whatever, but I’m obviously the product of my upbringing, which never really involved fire arms in any type of scenario or situation. If you had a gripe, you’d settle it mano a mano, and live to see another day (geez, I sound like the father in ‘Friday’). Even the few buddies I have that do hunt all the time, the whole sport of it still seems a little odd to me, despite the lovely gifts of venison I receive each year -lol. I don’t mean to say this in any disparaging way of course.

I was joking last night that I’ll probably go with a ‘girlie’ gun due to the smaller nature I would imagine, but reading more, it sounds like the heavier models seem to prevent a lot of the kick you might experience when shooting. The idea of a laser site, aside from just making me think all bad-ass terminator like, makes sense in the fact that I’m probably not going to be spending a lot of time at the range. In fact, while I will most certainly put in my time with an instructor at the onset, I’m really hoping that afterward, after purchase, license, etc, that I’ll never have to see, think about, or use in my lifetime.

Hoping I’m not offending anyone here, that’s never my intention. I’m actually glad that I’m able to throw a question like this on here, knowing that there are plenty of better informed and experienced T-folks who’d be willing to advise. I’m just typically a very calm and peaceful guy, it’s just that seeing the gun issues we’ve got in NYC, combined with the feeling I had the other morning when half awake I raced to my bedroom window screaming for my wife to call the cops, doesn’t really thrill me.

S[/quote]

You could get a dog that barks when someone is ‘snooping’ around your window. You could get a motion detector light put on the fire escape. You could get a set of those alarms that alert when a window is opened. Noise and light are your best defense against intruders. The paranoids among us are going to claim that that won’t stop a determined intruder. The best way to stop violence is deter it before it happens. Plus if someone wants you dead, you’re dead.

40

[quote]xboxwarrior wrote:

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
I’ll say though guys (and thanks so much for everyone voicing their opinions, I’ve really never had to consider this before), I’m not the fondest when it comes to the idea of having a loaded weapon at the ready in the place where I’m hoping to raise kids. Yes, I know that may sound naÃ?¯ve of me, or whatever, but I’m obviously the product of my upbringing, which never really involved fire arms in any type of scenario or situation. If you had a gripe, you’d settle it mano a mano, and live to see another day (geez, I sound like the father in ‘Friday’). Even the few buddies I have that do hunt all the time, the whole sport of it still seems a little odd to me, despite the lovely gifts of venison I receive each year -lol. I don’t mean to say this in any disparaging way of course.

I was joking last night that I’ll probably go with a ‘girlie’ gun due to the smaller nature I would imagine, but reading more, it sounds like the heavier models seem to prevent a lot of the kick you might experience when shooting. The idea of a laser site, aside from just making me think all bad-ass terminator like, makes sense in the fact that I’m probably not going to be spending a lot of time at the range. In fact, while I will most certainly put in my time with an instructor at the onset, I’m really hoping that afterward, after purchase, license, etc, that I’ll never have to see, think about, or use in my lifetime.

Hoping I’m not offending anyone here, that’s never my intention. I’m actually glad that I’m able to throw a question like this on here, knowing that there are plenty of better informed and experienced T-folks who’d be willing to advise. I’m just typically a very calm and peaceful guy, it’s just that seeing the gun issues we’ve got in NYC, combined with the feeling I had the other morning when half awake I raced to my bedroom window screaming for my wife to call the cops, doesn’t really thrill me.

S[/quote]

You could get a dog that barks when someone is ‘snooping’ around your window. You could get a motion detector light put on the fire escape. You could get a set of those alarms that alert when a window is opened. Noise and light are your best defense against intruders. The paranoids among us are going to claim that that won’t stop a determined intruder. The best way to stop violence is deter it before it happens. Plus if someone wants you dead, you’re dead.[/quote]
With light fixtures as your primary defense, if somebody wants you dead, you’re dead.

With lights as a deterrent, you may deter a TV thief, and possibly never know it, your gun sleeping soundly next to you.

A dog bark may serve as a deterrent, but you’ll be aware and still uneasy. You’ll also start ignoring the bark due to false alarms.

A gun, though, as a last line of defense, means you may not be dead if somebody wants you dead.

And a dog attacking an intruder, buying you time to grab and aim in the light provided by your motion sensor light fixtures is even better.