Be Your Own Doctor and Do It Well or Roll the Dice

[Madagascarspirit]

@unreal24278

But provided you don’t have a significant other who is unaware of your hobby, a family to take care of and/or your kids are adults I don’t have an issue with a mentally competent individual above the age of eighteen here or 21 in America using anabolic steroids in their own time.

Probably agree with most of this. Keeping your steroid use from your partner is kind of necessary in ways due to the stigmas but also a recipe for relationship destroying trust issues down the road….

@unreal24278

So… If you can do that, you can take steroids regardless of whether or not it is a good idea to do so. Nicotine has a tremendously deleterious impact on reward pathways when used at the age of 18…

The issue with steroids is not that they cannot be used relatively safely but it’s the the prior knowledge required to avoid potential harm. Nicotine will make you dependent and smoking might fuck your lungs over time but it won’t grow you tits and make you an emotional mess with short term use.

[unreal24278]

@Madagascarspirit

Keeping your steroid use from your partner is kind of necessary in ways due to the stigmas but also a recipe for relationship destroying trust issues down the road

Then don’t do it and/or find a partner who is comfortable with it. Yes… The stigma is somewhat unwarranted when (in my country) day drinking is normalised.

Remember, I’m young… So I’m just giving you my perspective but

I think lying to your partner is also a recipe for long term implosion. How long can you realistically keep needles, vials, syringes and various side effects hidden from your SO?

@Madagascarspirit

dependent and smoking might fuck your lungs over time but it won’t grow you tits and make you an emotional mess with short term use

Have you ever seen someone trying to quit after they’ve become nicotine dependent. Many become a short fused, emotional mess… Especially when they’ve been using cigarettes as a crutch to deal with stress.

[BrickHead]

@unreal24278

The physique @brickhead had when he competed is probably the most extreme most women will like. Actually… What did women think of it when you were in your bodybuilding stage? You were extremely lean, dipping into “essential bodyfat” reserves. It’s not healthy to be that lean, and while I think it looks sick (slang for awesome), are women generally okay with that? Or do they find it gross?

Actually the women I worked at the job I was at during that prep several times expressed their concerned for my well-being. A female co-worker told that after we had a meeting once and I left the room, the nursing director asked, “Is he OK?” Thats how gaunt I was towards the end. I don’t think women think extreme, contest-ready leanness is attractive, and it’s an unsustainable condition.

Outside of work and family I didn’t and don’t converse much with women. So I don’t know what stranger women in my gym thought.

There are some social media influencers who maintain 8 to 10 percent bodyfat. They live lives of either tons of physical activity, constant nagging hunger, meticulous calorie counting, roid use, or all of those. No thanks!

[unreal24278]

@BrickHead

There are some social media influencers who maintain 8 to 10 percent bodyfat

Tristen Lee is lower than 8% year round. The little dude probably started juicing at around seventeen and has serious potential.

I don’t really follow bodybuilding anymore. I love the sport (though I’ve opted for combat sports + powerlifting style training. I do 5/3/1 BBB) but I don’t like what it has become.

While drug use has been prevalent in bodybuilding since the 40’s, and bodybuilding magazines started talking about the use of testosterone in the 30’s; steroids were never brought to the forefront. Even in the golden age (60’s and 70’s) when steroids were commonplace, legal and fairly widespread the dosages employed were considerably more conservative relative to what we see today and they weren’t prioritised.

Bodybuilders today still work hard, but it has become a sport of “who can tolerate more drugs and keep standing”. Golden age bodybuilders have been dying younger, but we are talking deaths for the most part when the athletes hit their late 60’s to mid 70’s… Now we are looking at competitors dropping in their 20’s and 30’s.

I don’t want to support this. It’s especially sad when they leave behind a wife and kids… But what did the wife expect? That a 5’7 300lb mass monster would somehow live to see his kids graduate?

Steroids equate to additive stress… But how many healthy 5’7, 300lb guys do you know?

[systemlord]

@trtwuzup

I have read many guys end up in a trt run of the mill clinic because a Dr refuses to treat symptoms and require absurdly low t levels to start trt.

And yet as per guidelines doctors are instructed to elevate the Total T into the mid-normal ranges which coincidentally kind of backs up the notion that the cutoff point for low-T is too low on purpose to restrict treatment.

There are even studies showing hypogonadal symptoms below 440 ng/dL and another one showing the same between 300-400.

Dr. Eugene Shippen & Dr. Cam explain it best in a Youtube postcast and anyone new to TRT should watch the video “The Decline In Men’s Testosterone | Maximus Podcast | Dr. Eugene Shippen & Dr. Cam”.

[Madagascarspirit]

Low normal levels like 440ng/dl is actually around the mean in some reference ranges. It’s definitely possible to have low t symptoms but surely care should be taken that the symptoms are not from other sources as IMO at those kind of levels treatment will really have to be on point to be worthwhile for the reasons below.

@Madagascarspirit

Due to the time and financial costs of blood work it is only typically practical to monitor your hormones a few times a year. In between those times your hormone levels are in an unknown state. Your low normal natural state is constantly managed by a complex feedback loop that maintains levels in your body that allow you to function as a man. This all happens in the background. Even the most comprehensive bloodwork and protocol change is incomparable to your bodies ability to simultaneously check and adjust all of your hormones on the fly.

[swoops39]

@unreal24278

I question “why” someone feels the need to become that big

could it just be wanting to exceed at something you’re good at? guys see they can excel at something and go hard at it.

[tareload]

Nice thread @Madagascarspirit; I regret being on leave when you started this thread. Way to go.

[Madagascarspirit]

Welcome back. Some good discussion on this one. Pretty consistent thought provoking contributors on this forum even if opinions often differ!