Baby Time - Stop Or Continue TRT w/ HCG?

Pharma / TRT Testosterone Replacement
1

Hello All -

Been reading through lots and lots of forums over the last few years but thought I’d finally take the plunge of joining one and posting something up.

A little about me…, 32 years old and have been on “TRT” for the past 18 months. I had done quite a few AAS cycles prior and eventually just stopped PCTing. The “TRT” regimen is self prescribed and consists of weekly T @ 125mg. I also take .5mg arimidex every 7-10 days. I get blood tests every 3-6 months and everything is within range with the exception of Cholesterol, LH & FSH (TT = 1100 | E2 = 16)

And now the reason for the post - 37 Yr Old Wife wants to get pregnant, I’m on board as well!

I would never have jumped on a “TRT” regimen if I thought that we would be interested in children as she already had one from a previous marriage and we had made the decision that we weren’t going to conceive.

I jumped on HCG @ 250iu 2 X weekly and recently upped it to 500iu 3 x weekly. Been on the HCG for about 1.5 months now. I’ve noticed some increase in testicle size (they had gotten quite small).

My last injection was exactly 7 days ago. I am waiting on the results of a semen analysis but I’m forecasting some bad news as the last 4 months of trying to conceive have not resulted in conception.

Here’s my plan of attack to ensure I get enough swimmers to do the job…

  • Continue HCG administration through next week
  • Discontinue Testosterone injections
  • Start 25mg ED Clomid once I’ve gone 14-20 days without testosterone

Hope and pray that we get a bun in the oven in short order. I have a very high pressure career and represent the majority of the income for our family so I can’t afford to have fluctuating hormones for months/years…

Anyway - Just wanted to get my story out there so that others in the same situation can do what I did and spend countless hours reading about other people’s situations trying to find one that best aligned with their own.

Will update when I get the semen analysis back.

2

Stay on TRT:
Inject T twice a week
0.5mg Arimidex at time of injections
250iu hCG SC EOD - see hCG–>SERM swap below.

High dose hCG is a bad idea.

E2 management was silly, do as above and test E2 in 3-4 weeks.

TRT=LH/FSH–>zero, do not test!

T+SERM:
You can do as above, but switch from hCG to 10mg Nolvadex ED. After a week, test LH/FSH to see what is happening. This is the path to fertility. But many have made babies with T+hCG. Some guys feel terrible with clomid, if you have used OK before, that is an option for you instead of Nolvadex.

Pregnancy: Women need more iodine than men and should be iodine sufficient well before conception. If using pink salt, sea salt etc, you have a problem. Affects miscarriage rates, brain development etc.

Please read the stickies found here: About the T Replacement Category - #2 by KSman

  • advice for new guys - need more info about you
  • things that damage your hormones
  • protocol for injections
  • finding a TRT doc

Evaluate your overall thyroid function by checking oral body temperatures as per the thyroid basics sticky. Thyroid hormone fT3 is what gets the job done and it regulates mitochondrial activity, the source of ATP which is the universal currency of cellular energy. This is part of the body’s temperature control loop. This can get messed up if you are iodine deficient. In many countries, you need to be using iodized salt. Other countries add iodine to dairy or bread.

KSman is simply a regular member on this site. Nothing more other than highly active.

I can be a bit abrupt in my replies and recommendations. I have a lot of ground to cover as this forum has become much more active in the last two years. I can’t follow threads that go deep over time. You need to respond to all of my points and requests as soon as possible before you fall off of my radar. The worse problems are guys who ignore issues re thyroid, body temperatures, history of iodized salt. Please do not piss people off saying that lab results are normal, we need lab number and ranges.

The value that you get out of this process and forum depends on your effort and performance. The bulk of your learning is reading/studying the suggested stickies.

3

Can I run the SERM (Clomid or Nolva) concurrently with the TRT?

Lots of conflicting advice about SERM having no effects when exogenous testosterone is being administered.

4

Been almost two weeks since last T injection.

HCG has been used @ 500iu EOD.

Going go discontinue HCG and begin clomid @ 25mg ED.

Concerned about the upcoming crash…, wish I could stay on and try the TRT/HCG route but just don’t have time on my side in case it didn’t work and I’d have to go this route anyway.

Will post an update once I get new labs done.

5

Labs and semen analysis on Monday…

Crashed hard, feel like shit. No energy for gym, libido in the dumps and becoming very soft overall.

Wishing I would have at least tried the HCG with TRT route prior to going through this misery…

6

Have your wife do a ovulation test also. So you know when to put in extra work.

7

Good luck to you!! I just conceived my third child. I had to come off of TRT each time since my sperm level on try (even with HCG intermittently) was close to zero. Here was my protocol each time: During last two weeks before coming off, 250iu HCG EOD. Starting with my last injection, I’ll do 500iu EOD for 2 weeks (I only did 6.25mg of aromasin once a week during this period). 2 weeks after my last shot: 2 days of 50mg clomid then cruised at 25mg for another three weeks. It never took me more than 6 weeks off to get my wife pregnant. Remember, the female ovulates 14 days before her next cycle (if a regular 28 day cycle this would be day 14, if a 32 day cycle this would be day 18) (cycle begins the day her period begins).

Hope it works and good luck!

8

Thank you so much James for sharing.

Did you jump back on after conception? Did you have to do IUI or did
natural work?

9

No problem. Within 10 minutes of getting a positive pregnancy test each time I shot up an immediate 200mg lol. Every time was natural

10

25mg clomid may be too much if LH/FSH is high leading to high T–>E2 inside the testes where anastrozole and other competitive AI’s are ineffective.

When using a SERM standalone or as part TRT+SERM, one should be testing LH/FSH to see what is going on. Then you are not dealing with fear and doubt.

Do not stack SERMs or SERM+hCG as this can overload the LH receptors leading to high testicular T–>E2.

Logic:

A virile male with good T levels can take a SERM and increase LH/FSH and T levels.

So why would a male on TRT with same T levels find that a SERM would not work?

11

Haha - Awesome, hopefully I’ll be doing the same.

Have a great holiday weekend!!

12

Sperm takes roughly 74-76 days to mature. So doing a semen amalysis after 5 weeks is a waste of time if you were completely shutdown prior to this

13

Great point!
More here: Sperm - Wikipedia

14

Apologies for those following that it took me so long to post the results - These numbers are from 8/28. At that point I had been on clomid for about two weeks and then stopped a week prior to the blood test so my LH/FSH weren’t completely blown out of the water.

Estradiol - 25
FSH - 5.1
LH - 8.0
Free Test - 10
Total Testosterone - 477
Sperm - 2.5 Million

Urologist prescribed 50mg Clomid Daily 3 weeks on, 1 week off. I’ve been on that dose since 9/1. I have follow up bloodwork scheduled for 10/14 which I’ll post up on here.

Feel like shit, no energy, 0 libido, losing muscle, gaining fat, just down overall.

Really, really hoping that she pops a positive test this month.

15

I have read this over and over but disagree. While on TRT i was not fertile at all and had no recognizable sperm count and every time I have come off (twice) within 1 month, my wife is pregnant and I got a semen analysis and had 40 million swimmers.

16

We conceived my son over 3 years ago whilst I was on trt between cycles. I was running HCG at the time.

17

Wife had an appointment today to get herself checked out. Docs are pushing the $30,000 IVF on her due to my low counts, informing her we have less than 5% chance at conception. We haven’t disclosed my history with “trt” so I can’t blame them for shooting in the dark.

I agreed to the IVF if we haven’t got something going by end of December. My mind, body, and wallet are all rooting for this to be wrapped up soon…

18

FWIW we conceived while I was running TRT and hCG.

Also, why not disclose the test use? Seems like a 30k mistake IMO.

Good luck.

19

How long where you on TRT when you conceieved?

Our insurance will cover about 50% of IVF, I’m concerned that if I disclose test use it may impact their coverage?

20

I’d been on for 6 months.

That’s a good point about the insurance coverage. I would assume the docs wouldn’t have a problem with it, and could even help steer you toward a better (and less expensive) option. But the insurance co could be another story.