Whats the participation rate for seamen training ? Do they all do something or do you have the gym to yourself ?
2 Likes
Iāll take this one LOL.
The Navy requires you to pass a semi-annual physical assessment. Wt/Ht must be within some ratio, and if not, you may still be OK but there are some additional measurements to ensure the extra weight is muscle not fat.*
You must be able to do some minimum number of pushups and of situps in two-minute periods. If you do better than the minimum you accrue bonus points that can help with promotions.
You must be able to run 1.5mi in a certain time limit, bonus points there too.
Alternatively to the run, especially when at sea, there are bike and elliptical options.
50% of sailors (my guess) never train. They run the PRT every 6 months and pass, and thatās it.
Of the balance, half are chronically overweight and out of shape and yo-yo around the calendar trying to pass that assessment, and half are like Atlas here who train and lift seriously.
Thatās what it was for me (10 years ago +) but I doubt much has changed.
*That point above is actually a deeply flawed process, itās been in the news, square-peg-round-hole type of problem. Iāve known muscular, fit people who āfailā this assessment due to ratio of neck to waist measurementsā¦ itās voodoo.
4 Likes
Is this similar with other areas of defense , army , airforce ? I assume all have some sort of basic training at the start and then a standard that must be maintained. Are the standards the same or is one considered better than the other ?
Tagging @TrainForPain and @flappinit to get a broader view ?
2 Likes
Iām old, man; itās all changed since I was in.
Back when I did it (Army), it was 2 minutes of pushups, 2 minutes of situps, and a 2-mile run. To go to Ranger school we had to add pullups and a 5 mile run. Then there were other standards that werenāt really āthe pt testā (like ruck marches and boot runs and whatever). That wasnāt part of the base test, though.
The Marine test had a 5k and pullups; those dudes tended to be the leanest.
If you were alive, and only borderline obese, you could pass the test.
The Army has since improved their test so that itās not just the lightest guy wins - thereās now a trap bar deadlift and a shuttle run and other things. I like the direction, but itās now really equipment-intensive. Thereās not a perfect answer.
3 Likes
Is it an annual test ? Is it different for active vs someone in a desk job ?
1 Like
@kleinhound whats the Aussie police standard for this, do they also have annual fitness tests
1 Like
Work for today: base building week 7 day 2
HIIC: 3 mile run, 25:29 (PR by about a minute)
Run felt good, still had more in me, did the first two miles at an 8:40 pace, then let loose on the last mile.
@jdm135 @simo74 @TrainForPain letās be perfectly clear, the Navy has no real fitness standard. We may have some stuff written down on a piece of paper, but Iāve never had a chief who wasnāt at least 50lbs overweight and a chain smoker. If you can breathe, you can pass the bike. Hardly anyone actually runs it, I doubt half my sailors could run a mile period. The only real fitness test āfailuresā you see arenāt do the the actual fitness portion, itās all being too fat. And I still easily passed at 5ā10 280, so keep that in mind.
Iād say when I was in charge of Gunners Mates, everyone worked out, and most guys were at a pretty decent level of fitness. Now, being in charge of nukes, Iād say about 50% exercise at all. Of the 50%, thereās only a few that take it seriously, and pretty much all of them just lifting to be pretty, no real focus on strength or athletics outside of bench press for the ego. On the officer side of the house, Iād say 90% of us workout, with a decent amount taking it seriously.
This topic very much gets under my skin, and Iāve been reprimanded before for trying to implement unit PTā¦. Despite it being part of navy instruction.
13 Likes
Youāre probably right that half of your sailors couldnāt run a mile or pass a traditional PRT. The bike and elliptical options were new for me back then, but by now itās probably ingrained into the culture - why try. LOL. And to their credit, life is hard enough without adding physical training (our hobby isnāt for everyone).
I always trained - and on deployment it was frequently a tradeoff between eating, sleeping, showering, or training. The demands on our time were severe. No shame in not training under those conditions!
But also: Nukes generally arenāt the type who join the military to be in the military like, say, your SWCC type of guys - the ones who trained in high school to prep for BUDS. Those gunnerās mates have a culture of fitness, which one would expect the entire military has, butā¦ Nukes are, as in every other category, an exception.
And boot camp only teaches you burpees, pushups, situps, and jumping jacks. Not exactly a recipe for a successful and fun athletic life if you didnāt have one before.
Interesting that 90% of the wardroom work out.
Do you think itās a habit that starts in college? If youāre on ROTC or at the academy, physical training has to be part of the culture, right?
Outside of the military-specific piece: I do feel like thereās a āclassā element to fitness culture. Of people who train, I feel like theyāre usually either quite young, or in the top 50% income bracket. (thatās a low, low bar LOL). In other words, people who are barely scraping by arenāt likely to hit the gym before or after work!
Oh totally forgot to address the attempt to implement unit PT!
Eh. no time. Whatever.
1 Like
1 Like
Theyāre trying to bring one in but thereās a lot of push back from the unfit masses.
Itās not even hard, just an obstacle course in operational equipment or a substitute time trial row.
To get in thereās a 2.4km run, beep test and an obs course but no upkeep beyond that unless youāre talking specialist areas
1 Like
Crazy really, you think some sort of physical standard would be beneficial to most.
2 Likes
I wonder if this is cause or effect (probably different in each individual case) - if you havenāt got the drive or discipline to take care of yourself, even if itās hard even if you donāt really want to then youāre less likely to be a driven individual seeking to better their personal circumstances, work hard and get promoted, work multiple jobs etc.
And regards the younger demographic itās easier when youāre young with no responsibilities, stress and plenty of free time and some disposable income!
@simo74 in the fire service in the UK itās annual beep test 20m level 8.8, not the hardest thing in the world but needs at least some base level of fitness (they do have a more job specific fitness test which you can do if you fail the beep, which is reportedly easier, but generally only taken by the older or less fit contingent, Iāve never taken so no idea).
5 Likes
So what I have learnt is that fireman are the fittest and sailors are the least fit. Oh and marines are skinny. Nice
3 Likes
It was semi-annual when I was in.
No, not for the basic PT test. There were different expectations/ tests for the more physical jobs (like the ruck marches), but just one basic PT test.
3 Likes
Just as Iāve always suspected!
4 Likes
Work for today; base building week 7 day 3
Superset;
Pull-ups; 5, +12.5x5, +12.5x5, +22.5x5, +12.5x4, 5, 5
Press: 95x5, 120x5, 135x5, 150x5, 120x8, 120x8, 120x8
Barbell row: 120x10, 165x8, 165x8, 185x6, 185x6
Superset:
rope pushdown: 35x15, 35x15, 35x15+dropset
Cable crunch: 35x15, 50x15, 50x15
Lat raise: 15x20, 15x20, 15x20
Lying neck raise: 25x15, 25x15, 25x15
Notes:
- swapping RDL for barbell row. RDL just destroyed my hamstrings for too long, messes with my running. Iām getting plenty of hamstring work with my low bar squats and regular deads, not a weak area for me. Doing barbell rows as more of a deadlift builder than a back builder
- pull-ups and press felt fine.
- another ship workout, hopefully will get to go home in a few days, but making do pretty well sit the equipment here
I owe a bunch of replies, will respond when able
15 Likes
Alrighty, overdue replies
@jdm135 i definitely agree with the time deadlines, I think my sleep very much reflects that. Itās near impossible to lead a healthy life with this job, so I donāt necessarily expect anyone to ātrainā, but I will say that I think the community has allowed it to go to far. Look, ya donāt need to pull 405 for 10 to do this job, but doing 30 minutes of bodyweight or jogging 2-3x a week would do MIRACLES for some of my sailors. If nothing else, I feel like being in good shape allows me to handle the hours better than some of my sailors who tend to tire out faster.
I 100% agree that nukes arenāt the type who join to ābe in the military.ā I hate that fact, largely because I absolutely was that type lol. But again, it chose me, I didnāt choose it.
Oh man, the wardroom one is a loaded question. Iād say itās partially because so many nukes are Academy grads, which has an absolutely pervasive culture of fitness. We were all jocks in high school and many of us in college, so fitness is partially a habit at that point. Iād say there is a maturity argument I. There as well, as I know many of us turn to fitness as a means of mental health self care rather than booze or some of the other more destructive habits common amongst junior sailors. Thereās a certain aspect of wanting to ālook the partā in front of your sailors, no one wants to be known as the fat officer lol, and itās surprising the amount of respect that broad shoulders will garner with the sailors. Then finally, Iād say there is definitely a class aspect to it. In a world where obesity is the norm, and the idea of selfless service is becoming a forgotten concept, I think thereās a very real sense of pride in being hold outs for a different view of the world. Sounds weird, but Iād say the a ātraditionalā lifestyle is almost āpopularā with younger officers. Rugged individualism, outdoors activities, having a family, a booming interest in Christianity. I think that physical fitness has tied itself in with that view of what many think is a better way of life than what lots of modern society tries to tell sell us. The class aspect is interesting to me, as is the generational aspect of military service. More than ever, someone In the military is the relative of someone else in the military, and itās especially common in the officer ranks to be the child of an officer. (Myself included)
Oh! And the unit PT. I had the audacity to propose we do it in place of morning cleaning stations twice a week. We know where priorities lie lol.
@kleinhound for whatever reason, I imagined the Aussie police PT test to involve boxing kangaroos or wrestling crocodiles 
@simo74 it almost certainly would be. The issue as I see it is, the job is already incredibly demanding, and attrition is very high. We canāt get people to stay in the job, issue military side, but even more so the job @jdm135 and I do, since they dump years of time and money training is just for us to have some of the lowest retention in the DOD. So, the military as a collective has a hard time enforcing standards that donāt directly affect the job. Would the military like everyone to take fitness seriously? Absolutely. But at the end of the day, we need bodies to do the job, and canāt necessarily afford the hit to manning that would accompany actually holding fitness standards.
@TrainForPain the new army PT test seems legit, but letās not pretend the Navy is the only fat branch! Combat units tend to be fit, but support troops nationwide have spent more time fighting the lid off of Dunkinā Donuts boxes than they have fighting their ever growing waistline
4 Likes
This is interesting to see you mention this from the Navy side. I have a cousin whoās an Army chaplain, family man, heavy Calvinist in his own views, and a lifter, and trains a few people. It seemed a somewhat strange combination to me, and itās interesting to see itās not just him.
2 Likes
Lol thats wild!!!
Enjoy a little repreive!
1 Like
This made my day. Gold!
2 Likes