Alcoholics?

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[quote]ruglayer09052000 wrote:
CU AeroStallion wrote:

I have had a few friends who have realized they are in the same boat as you, and am sure I will have more as the journey of my life goes on. From what I’ve seen though, AA has NOT helped a single person I know.

I find that amazing because AA has help alot of people I know remain sober for alot of years. My sponser has 16 years, his sponser has 21 years, and I have 5 1/2 years. But the 12 steps don’t work for them, so they don’t work for anyone, eh?

[/quote]

I know 3 people who had to go to AA from DUI/DWAI tickets. AA didn’t help them, they still drink, but they were never alcoholics to begin with. I know another person who IS an alcoholic (he says so) who went for almost a year and a half. During his year and a half, he’d still get drunk once or twice… or 4 times a week or so, but he at least wasn’t drinking 20 hours a day every day, then again, he never did.

Some people say he’s still an alcoholic… I on the other hand think he was just in love with being drunk. Finally, a year after he quit going he is able to have a beer or two and be done… he’s what I would consider “IN CONTROL”

He’s still not “sober” but he’s in CONTROL (that’s what’s important right?)

but after him going to AA and it not doing a thing for him, I am fully able to say that everyone I know who’s done the AA thing hasn’t been “helped” by it. Maybe affected by it, but not “helped” directly, as he basically just sort’ve woke up one day and changed…

I know, it might seem crazy, but I tell it how I know it to be. You don’t have to get all “in my face”

As for your progress, congratulations, true control is a good thing to have.

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[quote]CU AeroStallion wrote:
ruglayer09052000 wrote:
CU AeroStallion wrote:

I have had a few friends who have realized they are in the same boat as you, and am sure I will have more as the journey of my life goes on. From what I’ve seen though, AA has NOT helped a single person I know.

I find that amazing because AA has help alot of people I know remain sober for alot of years. My sponser has 16 years, his sponser has 21 years, and I have 5 1/2 years. But the 12 steps don’t work for them, so they don’t work for anyone, eh?

I know 3 people who had to go to AA from DUI/DWAI tickets. AA didn’t help them, they still drink, but they were never alcoholics to begin with. I know another person who IS an alcoholic (he says so) who went for almost a year and a half. During his year and a half, he’d still get drunk once or twice… or 4 times a week or so, but he at least wasn’t drinking 20 hours a day every day, then again, he never did.

Some people say he’s still an alcoholic… I on the other hand think he was just in love with being drunk. Finally, a year after he quit going he is able to have a beer or two and be done… he’s what I would consider “IN CONTROL”

He’s still not “sober” but he’s in CONTROL (that’s what’s important right?)

but after him going to AA and it not doing a thing for him, I am fully able to say that everyone I know who’s done the AA thing hasn’t been “helped” by it. Maybe affected by it, but not “helped” directly, as he basically just sort’ve woke up one day and changed…

I know, it might seem crazy, but I tell it how I know it to be. You don’t have to get all “in my face”

As for your progress, congratulations, true control is a good thing to have.[/quote]

CU, this is the massage you will get from many alcoholics. My brother-in-law has a lot of very good reasons why a certain method would not help him. Now, he’s been treated badly by life with massive health issues throughout. In a macabre mood, I tell him that he has been giving his body to science bit-by-bit since he was 18 years old and, realistically, it is a surprise that he has made it to 50.

The point is that he is an alcoholic and an addict of mood-altering medications. Throughout, he has been full of very well-reasoned arguments why method A does not apply to him or why person B is really responsible and should fix it. What you are describing is a typical symptom and not really a very good argument against AA. As a parenthesis, AA did only help him cut down, not quit, but I would ascribe that to a refusal to face the facts, not blaming the organisation. To JP, I would say, ask for help from those you love and those around you. But remember that they are there to help YOU do what YOU have to do. Good luck and I am thinking of you.

TQB

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I just wanted to thank everyone again for your messages. Every perspective and every story is helpful to me. You guys are awesome.

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I am an alcoholic and I realized this just about 9 years ago-I was in jail for 5 days for a second DUI right before Christmas 1996. I lost my liscense for a year and had to take a 90 minute bus ride each way to do my student teaching.

I didn’t “quit” drinking officially but I didn’t have a drink my first year of teaching. I took anabuse for a year-court ordered, and it probably helped to ease the anxiety because I knew I wouldn’t drink on anabuse. Anyway, I wasn’t out of control at all until I had my first drink, and I never had any kind of physical withdrawal when I stopped.

I had always been a binge drinker anyway-although as my tolerance went up the binges got farther apart because I was getting alcohol poisoning every time I drank.

Anyway, after the anabuse, I went back to occasional (and bad) binge drinking but again I had no problem avoiding alcohol for weeks on end after a getting sick. At this point I drank maybe 2-3 times a year but ended up in trouble each time-beat up by a gang in an inner city park, got my car stolen by joyriders with me in the back seat, yet I had “no problem” avoiding alcohol all together between start of school and christmas, christmas and spring break, spring break and summer.

I had tried AA, but it was not the way for me.

I gradually reduced the frequency of binging. I got married and had maybe 2 binges in the first year and never touched alcohol the rest of the time, but I had made it very clear to my wife that I should not ever drink, and she was around during one of the binges and got scared enough by how much I drank that she spotted it the first time I had a single drink on the way home from work.

Anyway, if she had let me get drunk, I wouldn’t have recovered. If I hadn’t filled up my life with other stuff-work, working out, family, I wouldn’t have recovered.

I took one drink about a year after my wife caught me, and I got the most intense feeling of fear I have ever had, and I know that if I took a drink again, I would only feel that unbearable fear.

I haven’t had a drink now in 4 1/2 years. I will mention though that it is still psychological. I go to church and we have a small sip of wine in our sunday service (which can be optional) and I am able to put that into a different category than drinking. I am though, very physically addicted-if I had 2 drinks, I would end up having 20 “drinks” and wouldn’t even remember doing it at this point.

You have to get off of alcohol long enough that it scares you sick if you try it.

Here’s maybe an experiment, I don’t know. Ask yourself, how do you feel if you have a drink, with plenty in reserve, but a committment to have only one drink no matter what. Will you feel GOOD or BAD after that one drink. Will you start to feel anxiety. Will you think about the reserve supply?

My last single drink experience was so uncomfortable that I think I have managed to basically psychologically condition myself to not drink now.

I can not tell someone how to quit, but I can tell you that if you have friends who do not believe you when you say you are an alcoholic, it is probably because they have an alcohol “problem” and don’t want to admit that alcholism is real. That’s OK, but you have to have 2-3 people closest to you who you can make to understand that it is life or death.

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JP,

Congratulations on a job well-done. Every day you don’t touch that drink, you have earned a trophy. And we at T-Nation are the trophy-liking types. So keep racking 'em up.

Another thing - every time you have the urge or are contemplating a drink, log on to this site and post something on this thread. Somebody will be around - and we can help. Let your pals at T-Nation be what replaces your comtemplating taking a drink. I am not suggesting we replace your family and loved ones, but let the rest of us here add to that network of support.

As is, at this site we celebrate strength - of all kinds. When you don’t feel strong, come get a dose. You, your family - the world - deserves the best of you, and that means a clean and sober JP. Keep up the great work. Any way we can help, let us know.

“For the strength of the Pack is the Wolf, and the strength of the Wolf is the Pack.”

-Thunderbolt23

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[quote]mertdawg wrote:

Here’s maybe an experiment, I don’t know. Ask yourself, how do you feel if you have a drink, with plenty in reserve, but a committment to have only one drink no matter what. Will you feel GOOD or BAD after that one drink. Will you start to feel anxiety. Will you think about the reserve supply?

[/quote]

I already know how I feel. Awful. My heart races and I feel panicky. I must have another drink at that point. You are right, that is a good thing to remind myself of next time I am in a social situation and I tell myself one drink won’t hurt.

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[quote]JPBear wrote:
mertdawg wrote:

Here’s maybe an experiment, I don’t know. Ask yourself, how do you feel if you have a drink, with plenty in reserve, but a committment to have only one drink no matter what. Will you feel GOOD or BAD after that one drink. Will you start to feel anxiety. Will you think about the reserve supply?

I already know how I feel. Awful. My heart races and I feel panicky. I must have another drink at that point. You are right, that is a good thing to remind myself of next time I am in a social situation and I tell myself one drink won’t hurt.[/quote]

I wanted to add that something unusual started to happen after about a year after my last drink. Even though I do not dwell on thoughts of drinking-they VERY rarely even flow through my mind now-I will have a dream that I drink alcohol about every 3-4 months. It is not enjoyable. I wake up scared as hell and just feel so overwhelmingly relieved when I realize that I didn’t really have a drink. I take these dreams as being gifts so that the feeling of that last time doesn’t start to dull. For us at least just remember that Alcohol=Pain.

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[quote]JPBear wrote:
mertdawg wrote:

Here’s maybe an experiment, I don’t know. Ask yourself, how do you feel if you have a drink, with plenty in reserve, but a committment to have only one drink no matter what. Will you feel GOOD or BAD after that one drink. Will you start to feel anxiety. Will you think about the reserve supply?

I already know how I feel. Awful. My heart races and I feel panicky. I must have another drink at that point. You are right, that is a good thing to remind myself of next time I am in a social situation and I tell myself one drink won’t hurt.[/quote]

This may sound stupid, but when you get that feeling, drink water, lots and lots of water…at least that’s what I do and it seems to help, but everyone is different!

Anyhow, best of luck to you, I admire your courage!