Adult ADHD

Off Topic
62

Whether someone chooses to call it an illness, disease, or whatever, it matters little to those with aggressive symptoms, such as myself.

I haven’t posted on here in over 5 years, but I wanted to record what’s worked for me for those on here who can benefit.

There are three ways I attack my situation.

One…Hippocrates diagnosed the symptoms long ago. His advice was regular strenuous exercise, eliminating wheat, and extra fish in the diet. I work out hard, stay away from wheat, take fish oil(in the morning only). It works.

WARNING: Don’t take fish oil unless you exercise hard. Otherwise you might go for a roller coaster ride.

Second, developing mindfulness ala meditation and yoga is the be all end all for me. I’m not going to get into the science all I can say is it works beyond anything you could imagine. I do ashtanga yoga which is the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my life. Actually analyzing it while I’m writing this it just struck me that it requires from a person what ADHD people find hardest to accomplish. Concentration, stillness, regimen, discipline…the beginning is rough. The mind is undisciplined and rebellious. But day by day things get better until you hit a moment when you realize how far you’ve come.

Third is medication. I don’t take medication anymore. I’ll be honest. I don’t think taking these pharmaceuticals is healthy long term, especially when you have to increase dosages to maintain effectiveness. However, they are a powerful weapon for building momentum. I took adderall for a few months. Definitely works. How I used it was to start making incremental improvements in my daily habits. Eating better, exercising, etc. After about 6 weeks of ironing out a regimen including what I mentioned above, I gradually went off and I’ve been good ever since.

63

[quote]tom63 wrote:
wirewound wrote:
Meds are the most effective treatment.

Diet and mental hygiene help.

Not for everyone. I was a zombie on the lowest dosage of strattera. I lost my sexual drive and sucked at it when I tried.

I stopped and manage it on my own. I stay away from alcohol and caffeine. I exercise and eat clean. I can slip up a little, but very often I let it go to far.

You can’t take a sample size of you and make a blanket statement. I manage better without it. Some can’t.

[/quote]

Did you try stims? Strattera certainly doesn’t work for everyone.

Strattera revs up my sex drive, but yeah - my cock is useless for about 4 hours after I take it (if I have ANY caffeine, that is). I’ve just learned to live with it because I like my job. Also, staying away from caffeine and things like Maca and Alpha Male really counteract the sexual side-effects.

64

[quote]tom63 wrote:

You sound as bad as the no med people. BTW, it took me a full year to normalize after 3 months of strattera. If it works for you great, but it’s not candy and it’s not for everyone.

[/quote]
I never said meds were for everyone - but just because you’re an exception, that doesn’t mean that they are generally the most effective.

I get it - strattera was bad for you. What about Concerta/Ritalin/Adderall? Did you try the stims or did you just try one atypical ADHD med and decide that meds weren’t for you?

65

[quote]wirewound wrote:
tom63 wrote:

You sound as bad as the no med people. BTW, it took me a full year to normalize after 3 months of strattera. If it works for you great, but it’s not candy and it’s not for everyone.

I never said meds were for everyone - but just because you’re an exception, that doesn’t mean that they are generally the most effective.

I get it - strattera was bad for you. What about Concerta/Ritalin/Adderall? Did you try the stims or did you just try one atypical ADHD med and decide that meds weren’t for you?

[/quote]

Stimulants do not agree with me, I limit my caffeine consumption to zero when at all possible. I also can control this better on my own by taking control and following the healthy lifestyle suggestions.

I was diagnosed in my early 40s. I have had experience with how I react to various things. And if I can feel better with a health diet, exercise, no alcohol and caffeine, why would I chose a prescription stimulant?

66

[quote]DouglasQuaid wrote:
Whether someone chooses to call it an illness, disease, or whatever, it matters little to those with aggressive symptoms, such as myself.

I haven’t posted on here in over 5 years, but I wanted to record what’s worked for me for those on here who can benefit.

There are three ways I attack my situation.

One…Hippocrates diagnosed the symptoms long ago. His advice was regular strenuous exercise, eliminating wheat, and extra fish in the diet. I work out hard, stay away from wheat, take fish oil(in the morning only). It works.

WARNING: Don’t take fish oil unless you exercise hard. Otherwise you might go for a roller coaster ride.

Second, developing mindfulness ala meditation and yoga is the be all end all for me. I’m not going to get into the science all I can say is it works beyond anything you could imagine. I do ashtanga yoga which is the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my life. Actually analyzing it while I’m writing this it just struck me that it requires from a person what ADHD people find hardest to accomplish. Concentration, stillness, regimen, discipline…the beginning is rough. The mind is undisciplined and rebellious. But day by day things get better until you hit a moment when you realize how far you’ve come.

Third is medication. I don’t take medication anymore. I’ll be honest. I don’t think taking these pharmaceuticals is healthy long term, especially when you have to increase dosages to maintain effectiveness. However, they are a powerful weapon for building momentum. I took adderall for a few months. Definitely works. How I used it was to start making incremental improvements in my daily habits. Eating better, exercising, etc. After about 6 weeks of ironing out a regimen including what I mentioned above, I gradually went off and I’ve been good ever since.

[/quote]

I’d agree with you. Some might not manage without meds, but the more effort you put into trying, the more likelihood you’ll succeed without them.

67

[quote]tom63 wrote:
DouglasQuaid wrote:
Whether someone chooses to call it an illness, disease, or whatever, it matters little to those with aggressive symptoms, such as myself.

I haven’t posted on here in over 5 years, but I wanted to record what’s worked for me for those on here who can benefit.

There are three ways I attack my situation.

One…Hippocrates diagnosed the symptoms long ago. His advice was regular strenuous exercise, eliminating wheat, and extra fish in the diet. I work out hard, stay away from wheat, take fish oil(in the morning only). It works.

WARNING: Don’t take fish oil unless you exercise hard. Otherwise you might go for a roller coaster ride.

Second, developing mindfulness ala meditation and yoga is the be all end all for me. I’m not going to get into the science all I can say is it works beyond anything you could imagine. I do ashtanga yoga which is the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my life. Actually analyzing it while I’m writing this it just struck me that it requires from a person what ADHD people find hardest to accomplish. Concentration, stillness, regimen, discipline…the beginning is rough. The mind is undisciplined and rebellious. But day by day things get better until you hit a moment when you realize how far you’ve come.

Third is medication. I don’t take medication anymore. I’ll be honest. I don’t think taking these pharmaceuticals is healthy long term, especially when you have to increase dosages to maintain effectiveness. However, they are a powerful weapon for building momentum. I took adderall for a few months. Definitely works. How I used it was to start making incremental improvements in my daily habits. Eating better, exercising, etc. After about 6 weeks of ironing out a regimen including what I mentioned above, I gradually went off and I’ve been good ever since.

I’d agree with you. Some might not manage without meds, but the more effort you put into trying, the more likelihood you’ll succeed without them.

[/quote]

I think it’s important to acknowledge though, that people really shouldn’t be pressured to think that they SHOULD necessarily try to be med-free in their struggles with ADHD. This illness can be a real motherfucker - and for those of us who were diagnosed late in life, there’s a whole lifetime of frustrating and inexplicable failure that has left its toll on the psyche.

68

[quote]wirewound wrote:

I think it’s important to acknowledge though, that people really shouldn’t be pressured to think that they SHOULD necessarily try to be med-free in their struggles with ADHD. This illness can be a real motherfucker - and for those of us who were diagnosed late in life, there’s a whole lifetime of frustrating and inexplicable failure that has left its toll on the psyche.

[/quote]

Absolutely. Everyone needs to find what works best for them. It’s a personal choice.

69

[quote]tom63 wrote:
Beast27195 wrote:
I’m sort of enjoying this lil thread. Shows how some people will jump to all kinds of extremes and such. Talk of Big Pharma, and over-medicating and so on…just leaves me grinning a bit. As long as there is anything out there backed by some type of authority, there will always be naysayers and such. Yes, the psych field is based on both fact and theory, however, it all comes down to a simple thing: choice.

You can choose to take or have your children take meds, or you can choose not to. While various factors will oftentimes make this choice easier or much harder, it’s a choice to be made nonetheless. Scientologists and naysayers and preach and scream all they want, but the bottom line is, it’s up to the individual. I have been on meds for depression and such off and on for a hot minute.

I don’t ever take the meds just for the sake of taking them. I take them as a supplement to counseling from the docs and social workers. Yes, they level my mood out and leave me “sedated”, however I do know what I am feeling and thinking when we discuss certain things. The side effects and withdrawals can be a bitch, but they pass. I choose this route because it helps me to continue down the path of forgiveness and personal redemption.

I am physically healthier than most people. I eat pretty clean, although I do cheat. I work out like a madman. I eat fruits and such. I have friends. I have a girlfriend. I still take meds and see a shrink, as I don’t want my personal demons lashing out at those I call friends. Sorry for the rant, but just had to throw my penny’s worth.

You have a good well balanced view. Meds didn’t do it for me, good living did. Some however need the pills. But blaming docs and big business ie, drug companies is stupid. they’re only giving people what they want.

People like to blame big tobacco, but you have to be retarded to ever start smoking. Even 100 years ago. If you can’t tell that this stuff is bad for you, you’re an idiot. Chris Rock said it well, people don’t sell drugs, they offer drugs.

[/quote]

Agreed. You cant cure “stupid” thats for sure:)
At the same time though I do think that the current environment, espeically in which Big Pharma is allowed to “run free” so to speak while at the same time putting severe restrictions on what natural food/health supplement makers can do in regards making claims is ludicrous.

The way I look at it is if you can fund clinical studies to show that your health food/nutrient/supplement can do something, then by all means YOU should have the right to express that fact openly on your product.

70

[quote]tom63 wrote:
BigKDawg wrote:
wirewound wrote:
humble wrote:
wirewound wrote:
Meds are the most effective treatment.

Diet and mental hygiene help.

I’d contest that. Their isn’t any solid proof of this.

What med’s do though is mask the problem whatever it may be.

Their is very little objective science in the whole field of this very infantile subject of psychiatry and psychology which in the words of John Taylor Gatto “have offered -->| |<-- this much to the true understanding of human nature” but instead created a gold mine out of the pseudo science of brain management, supposed diagnoses and treatments.

The masking effect can clearly be seen with the reactions people have when they forget to take their meds or stop taking them for any reason.

Results? 7-13 school yard massacres were because the children were on these dangerous psychotropics, and the other 6 are unknown only because the information wasn’t divulged.

This is not to mention the other domestic cases, and other rampages people go on.

This is because psychotropics don’t treat, per se. Treat has been an abused word. They mask and the problem still exists underneath all that chemical numbing down of the human concious, the soul and well being of a person.

Once those numbing drugs wear off or are forgotten to be taken or one just builds up a resistance to them (oh yeh, there’s always a stronger med) then the beast which has been breeding underneath explodes in the fits of rage we have seen in the past and will continue to see.

The modern psychotropic drug is the exact same thing as the old water dunking methods they swore by in the past, the old electric shock therapy causing convulsions, bone breakages, brain damage and death, the old lobotomys which failed miserably all the time and were just scientists (albeit mad scientists) mental spoof-trial and error experiments which they misled the public into believing is the answer to the mental states that they witnessed in people.

The only thing is, that lobotomy, shock therapy and water dunking (not to mention countless other supposed and wicked treatments) is now conveniently placed in a mind altering and destroying drug!

Remember that psychiatry and psychology are the same pseudo-sciences that at the turn of the century actually had the nerve (read: complete incompetence) to label an African American slave’s tendency to want to run away from his oppressors as “Drapetomania”. Don’t believe me? Look it up and be shocked.

You know what the treatment was for “Drapetomania”? To whip slaves into obedience and rid them of this mental disease.

The day big pharma comes out and admits, it’s taking people for a ride, is the day markets will crash, economies will crumble and govt leaders will be living in slums! Govts can’t have this and it quite suits their agenda to have people believe that they need to be managed and that the best way to manage them is by using their specially created and very well funded psychotropics.

end rant

You’re an idiot. SPECT scans show significant biological differences in the brain activity of ADHD and non-ADHD subjects. It’s not all a conspiracy by ‘big pharm’.

The meds to treat ADHD are stimulants (except Strattera, which is a norepinephine reuptake inhibitor). ADHD meds are among the most effective and least questionable meds for a given mental illness available except perhaps the major tranquilizers. The side effect trade off is relatively small.

Ritalin, properly prescribed, would be more likely to inhibit violence in children than promote it. Perhaps it’s SSRIs to which you are referring.

Now please get in line behind Tom Cruise for the bus to crazy-town.

And you need to get off your knees and stop s–king Big Pharmas dick. Big Pharma and the “wonders” of junk science has done more to create a climate of learned helplessness towards health in many individuals.

You know like when people say their fat and blame it on genetics because according to research, its not their fault. Or how about the endemic rise of obesity, cancer, heart disease?

Its all genetic, ya know (BULLSHIT AND YOU KNOW IT) People need to wake their asses up and quit being such brain-dead morons to believe the tenets of f–king morons dressed up in white coats acting like their experts just because they have two letters behind their name.

For acute care, modern medicine is priceless. For treating chronic health problems that are largely self-induced, not so much.

There’s nothigngwrong with a little knowledge, you should get some.

[/quote]

Look who’s talking… so when are you stop being Big Pharma’s bitch? Or are you one of those people that believe everything their told and that anything that comes outta that shiny black box is the gospel truth? Go back to taking your meds and F–k OFF

71

[quote]wirewound wrote:
tom63 wrote:
DouglasQuaid wrote:
Whether someone chooses to call it an illness, disease, or whatever, it matters little to those with aggressive symptoms, such as myself.

I haven’t posted on here in over 5 years, but I wanted to record what’s worked for me for those on here who can benefit.

There are three ways I attack my situation.

One…Hippocrates diagnosed the symptoms long ago. His advice was regular strenuous exercise, eliminating wheat, and extra fish in the diet. I work out hard, stay away from wheat, take fish oil(in the morning only). It works.

WARNING: Don’t take fish oil unless you exercise hard. Otherwise you might go for a roller coaster ride.

Second, developing mindfulness ala meditation and yoga is the be all end all for me. I’m not going to get into the science all I can say is it works beyond anything you could imagine. I do ashtanga yoga which is the hardest thing I’ve ever done in my life. Actually analyzing it while I’m writing this it just struck me that it requires from a person what ADHD people find hardest to accomplish. Concentration, stillness, regimen, discipline…the beginning is rough. The mind is undisciplined and rebellious. But day by day things get better until you hit a moment when you realize how far you’ve come.

Third is medication. I don’t take medication anymore. I’ll be honest. I don’t think taking these pharmaceuticals is healthy long term, especially when you have to increase dosages to maintain effectiveness. However, they are a powerful weapon for building momentum. I took adderall for a few months. Definitely works. How I used it was to start making incremental improvements in my daily habits. Eating better, exercising, etc. After about 6 weeks of ironing out a regimen including what I mentioned above, I gradually went off and I’ve been good ever since.

I’d agree with you. Some might not manage without meds, but the more effort you put into trying, the more likelihood you’ll succeed without them.

I think it’s important to acknowledge though, that people really shouldn’t be pressured to think that they SHOULD necessarily try to be med-free in their struggles with ADHD. This illness can be a real motherfucker - and for those of us who were diagnosed late in life, there’s a whole lifetime of frustrating and inexplicable failure that has left its toll on the psyche.

[/quote] The difference is I haven’t failed at much, the way I look at it.

72

[quote]wirewound wrote:
humble wrote:
wirewound wrote:
Meds are the most effective treatment.

Diet and mental hygiene help.

I’d contest that. Their isn’t any solid proof of this.

What med’s do though is mask the problem whatever it may be.

Their is very little objective science in the whole field of this very infantile subject of psychiatry and psychology which in the words of John Taylor Gatto “have offered -->| |<-- this much to the true understanding of human nature” but instead created a gold mine out of the pseudo science of brain management, supposed diagnoses and treatments.

The masking effect can clearly be seen with the reactions people have when they forget to take their meds or stop taking them for any reason.

Results? 7-13 school yard massacres were because the children were on these dangerous psychotropics, and the other 6 are unknown only because the information wasn’t divulged.

This is not to mention the other domestic cases, and other rampages people go on.

This is because psychotropics don’t treat, per se. Treat has been an abused word. They mask and the problem still exists underneath all that chemical numbing down of the human concious, the soul and well being of a person.

Once those numbing drugs wear off or are forgotten to be taken or one just builds up a resistance to them (oh yeh, there’s always a stronger med) then the beast which has been breeding underneath explodes in the fits of rage we have seen in the past and will continue to see.

The modern psychotropic drug is the exact same thing as the old water dunking methods they swore by in the past, the old electric shock therapy causing convulsions, bone breakages, brain damage and death, the old lobotomys which failed miserably all the time and were just scientists (albeit mad scientists) mental spoof-trial and error experiments which they misled the public into believing is the answer to the mental states that they witnessed in people.

The only thing is, that lobotomy, shock therapy and water dunking (not to mention countless other supposed and wicked treatments) is now conveniently placed in a mind altering and destroying drug!

Remember that psychiatry and psychology are the same pseudo-sciences that at the turn of the century actually had the nerve (read: complete incompetence) to label an African American slave’s tendency to want to run away from his oppressors as “Drapetomania”. Don’t believe me? Look it up and be shocked.

You know what the treatment was for “Drapetomania”? To whip slaves into obedience and rid them of this mental disease.

The day big pharma comes out and admits, it’s taking people for a ride, is the day markets will crash, economies will crumble and govt leaders will be living in slums! Govts can’t have this and it quite suits their agenda to have people believe that they need to be managed and that the best way to manage them is by using their specially created and very well funded psychotropics.

end rant

You’re an idiot. SPECT scans show significant biological differences in the brain activity of ADHD and non-ADHD subjects. It’s not all a conspiracy by ‘big pharm’.

The meds to treat ADHD are stimulants (except Strattera, which is a norepinephine reuptake inhibitor). ADHD meds are among the most effective and least questionable meds for a given mental illness available except perhaps the major tranquilizers. The side effect trade off is relatively small.

Ritalin, properly prescribed, would be more likely to inhibit violence in children than promote it. Perhaps it’s SSRIs to which you are referring.

Now please get in line behind Tom Cruise for the bus to crazy-town.
[/quote]

Those studies where they supposedly found differences in the brains of people with add are flawed because they didn’t have a control group of add sufferers who were not on add medications. There is no way to tell if the differences observed were the cause of add or brain damage caused by the add meds.

There is no objective scientific test that can detect add.

73

[quote]wirewound wrote:
BigKDawg wrote:
wirewound wrote:
Meds are the most effective treatment.

Diet and mental hygiene help.

When you say something like that, you know that pharmacuetical fellatio is in full effect. Drugs NEVER will solve the problem behind peoples health afflictions. It simply alleviates the problem temporarily while continueing to throw the delicate balance of the body out whack. Pharmacueticals are band-aid medicine at best, Russian roulette at worst at least in regards to your health.

Okay Dr. You are a doctor, right?

What’s the non-pharmacological solution to schizophrenia, Spock?

Alright then.
[/quote]

Are you a doctor? If you are what is your field of specialty?

74

[quote]beebuddy wrote:
belligerent wrote:
ADHD = insipid psychobabble

People are way to quick judge psychiatry. Psychiatry is charged with what is arguably THE hardest task we face as a prosperous society. Taking care of the mentally ill is very human and humane.[/quote]

There is nothing humane about the way that add drugs have been forced on people. There is certainly nothing humane about killing a healthy child in order to make money.

75

[quote]wirewound wrote:
belligerent wrote:
Beast27195 wrote:
You can choose to take or have your children take meds, or you can choose not to. While various factors will oftentimes make this choice easier or much harder, it’s a choice to be made nonetheless.

You are inexcusably naive. If a psychiatrist or other mental health professional diagnoses a child with ADHD (or any other psychiatric label) and the parents refuse to comply with treatment recommendations, the mental health professionals can and often do notify the child protective services to have the parents charged with child neglect and the children forcibly removed from their costody.

The psychiatric establishment, in conjunction with big pharma, is currently lobbying aggressively for “universal mental health screening” in schools. This means that government psychiatrists will screen every child in primary school, label as many of them as they can get away with, and force parents to drug their children under the threat of CPS kidnapping.

Meanwhile, if you’re an adult under the care of a private psychiatrist and you refuse to comply with treatment recommendations, and the psychiatrist decides that you aren’t mentally fit to make this decision for yourself, he or she can notify the state mental health authorities to have you involuntarily committed to a mental institution for forced psychiatric drugging. This happened to me two years ago and the result was 16 days of sheer terror at the hands of malicious, incompetent mental health professionals. It was literally the biggest fucking shit fest clusterfuck I’ve ever experienced.

Yes, it’s true that psychiatrists are capable of doing at least a snall number of good things for at least a small number people, but that’s hardly redeeming in light of everything else that goes on in this profession. Psychiatry is rotten to the core. What should be a bastion of hope for the severely mentally ill is now an insane profit-driven moster out of control. I strongly recommend that 99% of people should just stay away. Got problems? I got worse ones. But I’m far better off now than I was when I was mixed up with that charlitan called psychiatry.

Oh Noes! The Gov’mint is gunna get us! Where’s my tinfoil hat, dammit?

Seriously, I WISH they were doing mental health screening when I was in school and I wish my parents would have been forced to medicate me - it would have made a huge difference in my quality of life throughout my teens and twenties.

[/quote]

I know people who were forced on ritalin as children and fed into the system. The quality of life they are suffering is fucked. A lot of them echo what belligerent is saying.

76

[quote]belligerent wrote:
Beast27195 wrote:
You can choose to take or have your children take meds, or you can choose not to. While various factors will oftentimes make this choice easier or much harder, it’s a choice to be made nonetheless.

You are inexcusably naive. If a psychiatrist or other mental health professional diagnoses a child with ADHD (or any other psychiatric label) and the parents refuse to comply with treatment recommendations, the mental health professionals can and often do notify the child protective services to have the parents charged with child neglect and the children forcibly removed from their costody.

The psychiatric establishment, in conjunction with big pharma, is currently lobbying aggressively for “universal mental health screening” in schools. This means that government psychiatrists will screen every child in primary school, label as many of them as they can get away with, and force parents to drug their children under the threat of CPS kidnapping.

Meanwhile, if you’re an adult under the care of a private psychiatrist and you refuse to comply with treatment recommendations, and the psychiatrist decides that you aren’t mentally fit to make this decision for yourself, he or she can notify the state mental health authorities to have you involuntarily committed to a mental institution for forced psychiatric drugging. This happened to me two years ago and the result was 16 days of sheer terror at the hands of malicious, incompetent mental health professionals. It was literally the biggest fucking shit fest clusterfuck I’ve ever experienced.

Yes, it’s true that psychiatrists are capable of doing at least a snall number of good things for at least a small number people, but that’s hardly redeeming in light of everything else that goes on in this profession. Psychiatry is rotten to the core. What should be a bastion of hope for the severely mentally ill is now an insane profit-driven moster out of control. I strongly recommend that 99% of people should just stay away. Got problems? I got worse ones. But I’m far better off now than I was when I was mixed up with that charlitan called psychiatry.[/quote]

I’m very sorry to hear this. I have children and to think someone would do that to them eats at my heart.

Had some people try and claim my son was autistic. We refused to believe this and knew they were wrong. We kept at it an in less than a year, everything is normal. Granted, we’re really on top of his diet, socialisation, play, activity and every aspect of his life. We treat him like an adult and educate him no matter what the situation and no matter how hard it may be for us.

He’s now far more intelligent, sensible and “normal” (whatever that means) than kids his age.

The twin psyche industries do have a very(extremely) small number of positive things (such as the area of neuro-psyche) to offer humanity and society, but I believe their origin to be wretched and that element of wretchedness still breeding today.

Once again, I am sorry to hear of your story and pray you are well.

77

[quote]Sifu wrote:
beebuddy wrote:
belligerent wrote:
ADHD = insipid psychobabble

People are way to quick judge psychiatry. Psychiatry is charged with what is arguably THE hardest task we face as a prosperous society. Taking care of the mentally ill is very human and humane.

There is nothing humane about the way that add drugs have been forced on people. There is certainly nothing humane about killing a healthy child in order to make money.[/quote]

What are you talking about?

78

If you’ve got a class full of kids, and all but one of them can sit quietly for an hour, you begin to look at that one kid for an explanation. Once you rule out situational things, and compare what you find with the one kid from another class who can’t sit still, and another class, eventually, you find there is a pattern.

In some sense, mental illness is really just a characteristic deviation from the norm. Sometimes it’s clear why that is, such as chromosomal abnoormality or brain trauma, but most of the time it’s not so obvious. Though in most cases, the root cause is your DNA - you can’t “Fix” it, but you can accomodate the excesses or deficiencies it creates- whether it be enzymes, hormones, neurotransmitter- with drugs.

I’m not saying a person with a mental illness is “Defective,” but rather has a set of behaviors that prevents them from functioning “Normally,” according to their culture, and personal desire. It is completely relative, and as the restrictions and expectations of normal life change, so too will the apparent occurance of mental illness.

To suggest that it’s not “Real” or that someone with a mental illness just needs to work harder is assuming that everyone is exactly the same. It’s the same ignorance that fuels homophobia, racism, religious wars, etc. With that said, not every characteristic deviation from the norm is a bad thing.

For instance, if you had one black kid in a class full of white kids, and followed the same routine, and eventually gave him some drugs to change his pigment would you be “Curing” him? Obviously not, and from that point of view, giving someone drugs purely to make them normal is clearly not always the right thing to do. The choice is not as obvious when it comes to things like being good at math, however, that doesn’t mean there aren’t some conditions that do totally warrant it.

On another note, I’m not naive to the profit involved in persisting illness, but these conspiracy theories completely ignore the reality of the actual people doing the research, and if you think there’s even a single researcher out there who is even the least bit reluctant to be the one who “Cures cancer” or anything else because it would slow profit to BigPharma, you’re crazy.

79

[quote]Sifu wrote:

Those studies where they supposedly found differences in the brains of people with add are flawed because they didn’t have a control group of add sufferers who were not on add medications. There is no way to tell if the differences observed were the cause of add or brain damage caused by the add meds.

There is no objective scientific test that can detect add.
[/quote]

There are plenty of studies and scans of ADHD sufferers both on and off meds. Dr. Amen, for instance, has done scans of people for years to determine what kinds of differences ADHD folks exhibit. He’s found that under stress, ADHD brains perform differently and in ways paradoxical to the activity of non-ADHD brains.

80

[quote]Sifu wrote:
wirewound wrote:
BigKDawg wrote:
wirewound wrote:
Meds are the most effective treatment.

Diet and mental hygiene help.

When you say something like that, you know that pharmacuetical fellatio is in full effect. Drugs NEVER will solve the problem behind peoples health afflictions. It simply alleviates the problem temporarily while continueing to throw the delicate balance of the body out whack. Pharmacueticals are band-aid medicine at best, Russian roulette at worst at least in regards to your health.

Okay Dr. You are a doctor, right?

What’s the non-pharmacological solution to schizophrenia, Spock?

Alright then.

Are you a doctor? If you are what is your field of specialty?[/quote]

Do I need to be a doctor in order to agree with the prevailing medical opinion? I think that disagreement with the medical community requires more stringent proof. Any idiot can have an opinion.

My opinion is based on personal experience, self-study, and is in agreement with the prevailing science. It could still be wrong, but it’s backed up by legions of very smart, very well-trained people. So much so, that it is the prevailing opinion.

Let’s use evolution as an example. If you want to make an argument against the theory of evolution, more scrutiny is required - as it countervails the clear scientific theories as explicated by the vast majority of scientists. It could still be correct, but it needs to be scrutinized very closely.

The burden of proof is much greater on the proponents of theories that radically contradict the accepted science, IMHO.

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[quote]wirewound wrote:
Sifu wrote:

Those studies where they supposedly found differences in the brains of people with add are flawed because they didn’t have a control group of add sufferers who were not on add medications. There is no way to tell if the differences observed were the cause of add or brain damage caused by the add meds.

There is no objective scientific test that can detect add.

There are plenty of studies and scans of ADHD sufferers both on and off meds. Dr. Amen, for instance, has done scans of people for years to determine what kinds of differences ADHD folks exhibit. He’s found that under stress, ADHD brains perform differently and in ways paradoxical to the activity of non-ADHD brains.

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This may be true, but what people are getting at, is that what you are saying is NOT diagnostic.