Yah mini cycles right. We take 200 and that’s a cycle.
I wonder how long you chose a dose and stuck with it and what suggestion you never really took from guys like @dbossa
dbossa AND YETI himself told me to run 30mg/daily. I ran it 2 months. It sucked.
So tell me: should I just have upped the dose until “symptoms resolved”?? Because upping the dose, which I did, from 16mg daily to the suggested 30mg daily, made things worse.
2 Likes
@roscoe88 if it just a matter of upping the dose and that’s it we wouldn’t need doctors. If you call 200mg a mini cycle… all I can say is wow. I needed 250mg a week to feel fine. Some need less and some need more. Did you ever stop to consider that testosterone MIGHT not be the problem? Is it at all possible that the method of administration you are using isn’t working for you? Could it be possible there is something else you’re taking that you’re not bringing up? Medication? Supplements? Drugs or alcohol? Do you exercise? What’s your diet like? What are your stress levels like? Are you going through any rough situations lately?
If you think you just take 30mg a day and be done with it, boy oh boy do I have news for you. That is one piece of the puzzle. What were your labs on 30mg daily? What was your free T? What about other blood markers?
Any idea how many times me and @enackers get messages by guys saying “It doesn’t work… you’re wrong”. Guys with the horse blinders on who can’t open their minds and see the bigger picture.
1 Like
Use some common sense . If trt isn’t working for you there are other issues.
Obviously someone needs to know their free t level . I hope you realize that 200 is high for one man and low for another. You keep making comments in absolutes yet you critique others.
I eat very healthy. I’ve been bodybuilding since 14. I’m 41 now. I rarely drink. I’m a lawyer, so yes a little stress.
You’d think I’d feel SOMETHING on trt, even at 210mg a week, right? Maybe I go up to 250mg a week?
I don’t know anymore.
There’s my current pic. And believe me, I looked like that prior to TRT. After 27+ years of dedication and lifting, things pay off. And never a steroid cycle. However, did take some over the counter prohormones years back.
What were your free T levels prior to TRT? What were your levels at 30mg daily?
Have you had thyroid verified? @enackers was doing all the trt in the world and didn’t feel much until he optimized thyroid and then everything changed.
By the way, in my case, and there are many like me, 30mg a day helped but not all that much. My best dose is somewhere between 250-300mg a week. That’s where I feel my best. Anything higher and I don’t feel as good.
FT prior to TRT wasn’t even in range. Just below the range.
I never tested my levels at 30mg/day. Reason being I was afraid that my dr would have discovered my increased dose. He allows me 150mg per week. If he saw increases in numbers, which was likely, he’d lower my script. And here, in NY, you can’t get bloods without scripts for some reason.
However, on 16mg/day, I was 766 TT, 135 FT (35-155), and E2 was low, at 20 sensitive.
30mg EOD: 741 TT, 194 FT, E2 49.
50mg E3D: 860 TT, 180 FT, E2 27.
I think my best choice is going back to E3D, albeit at a higher dose. Like 60mg E3D. My numbers on that (E3D) protocol weren’t bad. Maybe just needed a bump in FT.
Thyroid has been addressed and I’m taking armour… and slowly increasing.
Your libido isn’t working Right? What else exactly isn’t working that you expect trt to do besides libido.
Don’t make any changes. Let thyroid do it’s job. I’d thyroid is an issue you won’t feel much benefit from trt. Once it works you’ll know it. Too many moving parts my man. Patience. Hang in there and stay positive stop critiquing everything just because something didn’t work for you right away.
@roscoe88 I know plenty of guys who are symptomatic at those free T levels. Using your units of measurement, when mine were at 280 I was 90% there… then I upped dose yet again (have not done labs) and I feel like I’m at 100% at this point.
When you say you felt “worse” can you elaborate? You were doing 16mg a day, then started doing 30mg a day and what started to occur?
At 16mg daily, I felt very emotionally flat. Best way to describe it. I believe it was due to low E2 of 20. At 30mg daily, even PDE5s didn’t work well. I also was irritable and moody. Argumentative with girlfriend. Also very little energy for the gym nor the motivation.
With other protocols, there are days that I am just itching to lift… and have a TON of energy for it. Those days were on less frequent protocols, like E3D, weekly, and *gasp every other week. I THINK it may be the spike in FT causing it.
I half contemplate trying a real cycle at some point just to see if I can trigger an arousal response. I do have a lot of stock piled test laying around. Something like 400mg/week just to see if testosterone will even trigger it (sex drive/arousal). If not, it’s something else going on.
I’ve had MRIs and such, without anything wrong.
I would be tempted to try a short run of masteron or even proviron in your shoes. Just for “research” purposes. A short blast certainly won’t kill you either. We are all a little weird in different ways, I don’t think every day is the magic key for everyone, but it does seem to be good for many. That’s the trouble with black and white thinking, there’s always a weirdo outlier.
1 Like
That’s me for sure.
I’d love to try proviron, but I don’t know where in the world I’d get it from. Can it be found for “research purposes” online ?
Yes, it is only for “research” right now. I know that there are some guys in Pharma that get it. You’d have to email direct for sources.
1 Like
@hardartery agreed that the DHT boost from proviron could help the libido department. However, it also acts as a mild AI and with his naturally low E2 levels, this might not be the best idea.
@roscoe88 just to confirm, no AI or SERMS… correct?
Might I ask where you are located?
Nope. No serms or ai
Located near buffalo ny.
Ok… Going to throw this out there.
Dr Eric Seranno is a close friend of mine. He is the closest thing I’ve met to a living, breathing Dr House (with the difference that he actually cares about his patients). If anyone can solve an outlier problem, it’s him. He is old school so you have to see him in person. He’s in Pickerington, Ohio… About 340 miles from you… Maybe a 5 hour drive. If I was in your shoes, I’d call his office, setup an appointment, and go see him. Maybe book it on a Friday, spend the weekend visiting the Ohio area… Drive back. My 2 cents.
2 Likes
I wish I could understand him better. That accent is tough sometimes if it’s who I think it is.
He’s a savant… I don’t know anyone smarter… and I know a lot of people. It’s like watching George Carlin… you’re like, “How does he remember all this stuff???”