Wanted to add another symptom I’ve been noticing since starting NDT. Lately I’ve been having tons of dreams in my sleep. I don’t know if this is a good or a bad thing, but I remember when I used to cycle that I would have many more dreams.
There are more T3 receptors in the brain than anywhere else in the body, it seems your T3 receptors are getting lit up on NDT.
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Did Proviron and iodine provide the best libido and ED improvements to date? I am considering going on NDT myself, though my labs look similar to yours now (on treatment).
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I should point out that I am starting Proviron myself soon, though I still “feel” my issue is thyroid related, like you.
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Quick question for you! What gave you the best benefits - thyroid or Proviron and Iodine? I’m looking for libido/erection improvements mainly.
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Sorry for late reply. Correct, upon starting Proviron and Iodine I had the best libido thus far. Erections were the best I’d ever gotten. You should know, however, I was mega-dosing Tyrosine and experimenting with lots of other supplements also. Proviron and Iodine really helped, but taking a big dose of tyrosine (like 10-15 grams) provided the most acute libido help so far. Tyrosine’s effects diminished after a while of use. If you scroll to around February/March of this year of my log, you can see where I talked about it.
I’ve found with Iodine, the effects diminish after a while. I don’t think it is a lasting solution.
Libido wise, NDT is helping. I would say the concoction of shit I was taking back in Februaryish was still the best I’ve ever felt, but NDT brings my energy very close to that. Libido has not improved drastically, but I think it will come with time.
I’m beginning to think that the “SARMs” I was sold was actually T3 somewhere along the line, and I made myself hypothyroid after long use. Either that, or the huge calorie intake I maintained while on MK-677 fried my metabolism. Or could be another issue.
Definetely try to work out your thyroid though. I feel very healthy after I take my NDT. I’d forgotten what not having brain fog felt like.
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Also, consider research chemical website cialis. Can’t list source here but it, if anything, offers a little placebo effect for you to relax during sex and not worry too much about losing erection.
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Thanks for your in-depth log mate, it’s really helping motivate me into looking into thyroid a lot further. Our situations are pretty much close to identical, so this thread has been somewhat of a god-send for navigating these issues.
I believe my issues are stemming from low total/free T4, though my T3 (and free) levels are okay. My rt3 was elevated though. You were probably similar before starting meds.
I’ve put off starting thyroid meds because I didn’t want to mess around with that stuff too much, my energy (and brain function), memory, concentration, etc have always been pretty good, but like you - my libido and erections have suffered badly. I am also extremely cold intolerant. My thyroid issues feel very “acute” (borderline), but enough to cause issues with libido and difficulty loosing mid-section weight. Another guy (actually a knowledgeable endo) mentioned that T4 dosage of 175-200mcg would more than likely cure my issues and he was in great shape on the same dosage. My paranoia was raising rT3 further.
Are you doing Armour or some other brand btw and how many grains are you at? Has everything else remained the same for you in terms of cognitive function and the like?
Would you say the Proviron is worthwhile trying in my situation? My doctor wants me on 25 per day to start with. It’s actually on it’s way to me now, so I am keen to start it when it arrives.
Also don’t quote me on this, but I firmly believe your issue is varicocele like me that messes up your metabolism (and HPTA axis). I made a separate thread about this:
This might be of some interest to you!
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@anon8512651 have you trireme cytomel for thyroid ???
I’d be concerned about RT3 w T4 meds as well. I haven’t noticed any huge libido change since starting NDT, but it is gradually improving, I think. I take NatureThroid which I think is the standard like 9mcg T3 and 63mcg T4 (whatever the usual NDT dosage is) and am currently on 1.5 grains per day, awaiting to raise my dose after I talk to my doctor. I have DEFINETELY noticed improved cognitive function and energy. Nothing too notable in the libido/erection department, but I imagine that will come with time and higher dose.
When I first started NDT, I felt amazing. After some time, I believe my own thyroid hormones have been suppressed leaving me feeling pretty much how I felt before I started, but I’m confident that after I raise my dose til I find a good, long-term dose, I’ll be good in that department.
I think proviron is worth a try. If ur in the states, make sure ur source is solid. I bought a good 400$ worth of sugar tablets once trying to get my hands on proviron and since then I haven’t gone back on it. Hoping a new source will be able to get it to me. Can’t say I really remember all the details of when I started proviron, but I recall +morning wood +stronger erections +mood +vascularity in gym +strength gains. These effects continued after I stopped Tyrosine. The tyrosine was the biggest libido/desire effects.
I’ve tried for so long to find documentation on if proviron works long term, or if your body will output more SHBG after awhile of getting used to the drug. I ran it for 3 months and noticed benefits throughout. Proviron was nice though and if you can get it, I think it’s worth a try. I’m excited to raise my NDT dose, however. I’d argue that the proviron was combatting the symptoms of fatigue/low libido/down mood… NDT (for me) is resolving those symptoms.
If you can figure out how to fix thyroid issues without meds, though, I would try that first. Iodine and other herbs didn’t cut it long term for me. Thyroid meds are my life long solution. I figured I already inject every day. What’s one more pill in the morning?
I’ll read that post about varicocele vein when I have more time, it’s never something I’ve considered looking into.
Keep me posted what you are doing and how it goes!
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Also really glad to hear that my thread has been helpful. I’ve learned more from this forum than anywhere else online about TRT. Sucks that their is kind of a stigma around it. I think I would’ve wound up on TRT, even if I never took steroids, just because after learning so much about it, optimizing ones hormones is the best way to feel great and be healthy.
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Free t3 should sit at top of the range and t4 mid to high. Check out stop the thyroid madness. Lots of great info.
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Because I am based in the UK/EU, Proviron is legal here. My doctor prescribed me it and I took my first tab today, being honest I haven’t felt much, which either tells me my issue is 100% thyroid (which I believe it is) or I took a sugar pill (unlikely since it’s pharmacy prescribed and legit!).
Maybe it takes a few days to build up to be fully effective, will report back soon with my findings!
When I took legit Proviron, it took a few days to notice it really kick in. I’d give it like a week before you would feel it really working.
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Did you notice libido improvements or just ED wise? Been on it a few days now and still waiting to see some improvements…
I did notice libido improvements, but I have to credit it to the high dose tyrosine. Tyrosine is a precursor to dopamine, and dopamine plays a huge factor in libido.
The proviron I believe really helped erection quality. But the first time I dosed ~10g of tyrosine, I felt huge spike in libido about an hour later. I believe this may have been needed since my dopamine receptors were probably desensitized from high doses of caffeine everyday + Frequent alcohol.
I’m learning (from personal experience) how important brain function is in libido, and furthermore how important thyroid hormones are for brain function. Since starting this thyroid medication, I feel much healthier mentally.
As an update on that, I’m up to 2.5 grains a day. Haven’t noticed any big jump in benefits Or any real difference at all since increasing dose, so I’m thinking of backing down to 1.5 grains again (1 AM, 0.5 Afternoon) and adding in T3. I’ve read that the T4:T3 ratio in NDT products recently became higher T4 and less T3, and I think my T4 may be converting to rt3 and is the reason I’m not experiencing benefits from raising dose.
An rt3 lab would be Useful to predict if this would work better for me, but I can order research T3 for cheaper. If anyone has advice on how to approach taking T3, it would be appreciated. I don’t want to end up like that guy in the article someone shared earlier in my thread. My plan would prob just be to start at 5mcg and increase +5mcg every day until I notice a difference. If I find a good dose, I’ll stick with it until the benefits diminish or, if it works long term, I definetely. If this whole plan works, I’ll get an RT3 lab and take it to my doc to see if I can switch to a protocol of NDT+T3only meds to combat rt3 conversion.
Do you take AI? If so, did u adjust your AI dose when starting Proviron? You could be driving E2 too low. That is a big libido killer. If your not getting any random erections and/or your penis is not sensitive at all, you definetely drove E2 too low. ^Those symptoms + blunted emotions + lack of interest in social life + constant exhaustion are all symptoms I experienced when my E2 was low.
Update:
I think the reason I haven’t experienced any improvement yet since raising thyroid dose is my estrogen getting too high. My brain fog is somewhat returned, which led me to believe the thyroid meds weren’t working out… but today, I noticed a few things that are common symptoms of High e that I hadn’t before. My testicles have shrunken slightly, I’m more bloated (face), I’ve noticed weight gain in stomach region despite eating less, my penis is REALLY sensitive (I can reach O in a minute if I wanted), my erections are weaker, and my testicles don’t hang low but r tucked up as if it were cold.
I haven’t taken AI since I stopped, but today I’m going to take .25mg Anastrazole to combat these symptoms in the short run and lower my dose to 196 (-28mgs) weekly to resolve symptoms in the long run.
I actually had low E2 to start with, but after going on TRT (ED injections) It came back up and is sitting at a semi-decent level. I haven’t ever taken any AI’s due to this.
The Proviron has essentially done nothing for me, I feel the exact same as before. I am taking 25mg per day (split) but the only thing I have noticed is better motivation and concentration. Mild ED improvements, but still nothing decent in terms of libido. As you say, it’s probably other factors that contribute more so to libido.
I’ve always been in the mind set that my issues are thyroid, but it’s extremely borderline.
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