Why Do We Even Work?

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
81

[quote]zecarlo wrote:
Right now a big issue is jobs. Some, maybe a lot, look to the govt, to Obama, to create these jobs. How does the govt create jobs and just as importantly what kind of jobs does the govt create? It’s almost like none of that matters as long as there is something that someone can get a paycheck for. The govt, or people, don’t ask, “what do we need to make life better?” [/quote]
Big business asks that all the time, and when they think theyve found an answer they hire out the cogs in the wheels to do the legwork in implementing it

Of course replace “need” with needs/wants/desires

But children are taught to be the cogs in the wheels rather than being big thinkers. We need more big thinkers, rather than cogs in wheels - and we probably could produce many more than we do if we really tried. I think that might be what the quote is saying - and its not exactly anti free market in my opinion (then again I haven’t read him and am only guessing)

82

[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
Native American tribes before Europeans came and corrupted them.
[/quote]

You need to be a lot more specific than “Native American tribes”

Otherwise I call bullshit.

83

[quote]squating_bear wrote:
But children are taught to be the cogs in the wheels rather than being big thinkers. We need more big thinkers, rather than cogs in wheels - and we probably could produce many more than we do if we really tried. I think that might be what the quote is saying - and its not exactly anti free market in my opinion (then again I haven’t read him and am only guessing)[/quote]

What if the reality is that the vast majority of the human population are not capable of coming up with things that can actually “benefit” society, and as such the efforts spent to educate them in such a manner are wasted?

84

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]zecarlo wrote:

[quote]SkyzykS wrote:

[quote]Severiano wrote:

On the other hand, when things work well in the Military it’s because it acts as a cooperative. When I think back, the capitalistic aspects were the things that bugged me most about the military, the collectivism rocked, and worked. [/quote]

Ok, collectivism rocks in the military.

Now lets say you have all of this experience and through diligence, knowledge, and a love of aircraft maintenance you start a company. It becomes successful due to your managerial prowess and distinct perspective and you have contracts with every major air carrier in the US.

You deserve to be compensated for that, right?

How about No. Every dime you make goes into a collective made of every dime everybody else makes, then gets distributed among the entire population. Your model gets copied and distributed regionally to anybody else who wants to use it and you have no ability to franchise because there are no intellectual property rights. It is a collective.

Sound Utopian?

[/quote]
That conclusion has nothing to do with the quote however. What does have to with the quote is the idea that someone would start a company rather than simply settle for “earning a living.” [/quote]

According to your interpretation of it. I understand the element of inspired free thinking, but how do you rectify that with the proposition that 1 persons work product of thought should somehow support 9,999 other people?

What is in it for the thinker?
[/quote]

If we eliminate rent seeking then we can simply allow the free market to reduce the cost of goods to the point that a man hardly even needs to work.

Around 30% of my after tax income goes towards necessary expenses. 80% of that goes towards housing! Excluding housing my expenses are roughly 6% of my income and have been steadily dropping over the decades. If house/land prices were reasonable my expenses would be roughly 10% of my income. So with 1 years income I could survive for 10 years.

85

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]squating_bear wrote:
But children are taught to be the cogs in the wheels rather than being big thinkers. We need more big thinkers, rather than cogs in wheels - and we probably could produce many more than we do if we really tried. I think that might be what the quote is saying - and its not exactly anti free market in my opinion (then again I haven’t read him and am only guessing)[/quote]

What if the reality is that the vast majority of the human population are not capable of coming up with things that can actually “benefit” society, and as such the efforts spent to educate them in such a manner are wasted?[/quote]
Then that effort would be “wasted”

The quote in question estimated 1/10,000 - but sounds like he just made it up

I’m not so sure it would require anything major in terms of extra money or classes to help this

How many times are kids told after getting bad grades something about working at Mcdonalds vs being a better cog in another wheel? Just simply visualizing bigger would result it, perhaps. Anyways - that’s what I think the quote is really saying

86

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
Native American tribes before Europeans came and corrupted them.
[/quote]

You need to be a lot more specific than “Native American tribes”

Otherwise I call bullshit.[/quote]

Or maybe you should do some research yourself. Sure, I can sit here and list out every Native American tribe if you want. I’ll start with the Sioux, of which my girlfriend is a card carrying member of the Oglala tribe. Look up Great Sioux Nation.

How about the Chippewas? My alma mater sits on their land and we interacted a lot with them throughout my tenure there. (Central Michigan University Chippewas)

There’s a start where you could spend years studying and understanding.

87

[quote]ZJStrope wrote:

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
Native American tribes before Europeans came and corrupted them.
[/quote]

You need to be a lot more specific than “Native American tribes”

Otherwise I call bullshit.[/quote]

Or maybe you should do some research yourself. Sure, I can sit here and list out every Native American tribe if you want. I’ll start with the Sioux, of which my girlfriend is a card carrying member of the Oglala tribe. Look up Great Sioux Nation.

How about the Chippewas? My alma mater sits on their land and we interacted a lot with them throughout my tenure there. (Central Michigan University Chippewas)

There’s a start where you could spend years studying and understanding.
[/quote]

Or, since you made an incredibly general claim that encompasses every Native American tribe, you can either defend it by showing how it applies to every Native American tribe, or specify better.

88

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]ZJStrope wrote:

[quote]magick wrote:

[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
Native American tribes before Europeans came and corrupted them.
[/quote]

You need to be a lot more specific than “Native American tribes”

Otherwise I call bullshit.[/quote]

Or maybe you should do some research yourself. Sure, I can sit here and list out every Native American tribe if you want. I’ll start with the Sioux, of which my girlfriend is a card carrying member of the Oglala tribe. Look up Great Sioux Nation.

How about the Chippewas? My alma mater sits on their land and we interacted a lot with them throughout my tenure there. (Central Michigan University Chippewas)

There’s a start where you could spend years studying and understanding.
[/quote]

Or, since you made an incredibly general claim that encompasses every Native American tribe, you can either defend it by showing how it applies to every Native American tribe, or specify better.[/quote]

It’s just common sense if you’ve ever studied Native American culture. In the Sioux tribes, no one owned anything. If there was bad hunting that year, everyone suffered. Everyone did their job based on what the tribe needed and/or what individuals were good at.

The women who were good at raising kids raised ALL the kids. The women who were good at farming or cooking, did the farming or cooking for the ENTIRE tribe.

Men who were good hunters did ALL the hunting.

We often hear about how the Europeans “Bought land” from Native Americans, hence the running joke about distracting NA’s with shiny things. The thing often overlooked is, they did not understand the concept of ownership over land. In their eyes, Europeans were just giving them stuff.