Why Did God Create......

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

Brother Chris wrote:<<< You mean irony in that you are claiming that Jesus lied to his Church, that he wouldn’t stay with her forever? >>>[/quote]No, I mean irony that the visible church He would use to canonize the scriptures would in time be proven utterly apostate by the very scriptures she was used to canonize.

So, Jesus lied? The Church really isn’t the Pillar and Bulwark of the Truth? He really didn’t mean it when he said he’d be with her forever?

If the papacy had had it’s way us peons would never see a bible in our lives. Much easier to tell people what to believe when they have literally only your word to bank on and no way to confirm.

What are you talking about? When did the Pope keep the Bible away from laity?

[quote]Once again Chris. For the 25th time. READ the passage prayerfully for yourself sans the necrotic spiritual vise grip of your leadership.

HE IS NOT TALKING ABOUT INTERPRETING SCRIPTURE. HE IS TALKING ABOUT PRODUCING SCRIPTURE. [/quote]

The truth will set you free, the Church is the pillar and bulwark of the truth, and the visible head of that pillar and Bulwark says that no prophecy of Scripture is a matter of one’s own interpretation. He did not say revelation; so, he is not talking about producing, but he did say interpretation, so he was talking about interpretation.

His point is that the source of scripture is not man, but God.

Yes and only the author, the Holy Ghost, can interpret it. Does a reader tell the author what his books say? No, the reader listens to the author to understand the meaning.

He is saying nothing about interpretation, in the sense of extracting the intended meaning, at all. His declaration is “make no mistake. scripture did not come to be because some guys came up with some good stuff”. Yes that is what he’s saying and if you’d get your face outta the pope’s rump for a couple minutes you’d see that. He goes on to clarify that very thing.

Ah, yes Ad hominem attack, me being in the Pope’s ass has nothing to do with the validity of my premises and nothing to do with the soundness of my argument, the logic and truthfulness of my premises and argument dictate if my argument is valid and sound.

[quote]Actually the NIV, which I am not a huge fan of, gets it right on here. 2nd Peter 1:20-21 NIV. [quote]<<< 20-Above all, you must understand that no prophecy of Scripture came about by the prophet�?�¢??s own interpretation. 21-For prophecy never had its origin in the will of man, but men spoke from God as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit. >>>[/quote] AMEN! THAT is exactly a superb rendering of those verses.
[/quote]

Amen! Amen! Amen, I believe what the Bible says! As a Catholic, I believe everything the Bible says! However, I don’t agree with your personal interpretation of that passage.

I am, Nation,
Your obedient Servant,

Chris IV

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Why did God create Satan?[/quote]

lol. I felt this one.

[pittbulll]

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Why did God create Satan?[/quote]

Good question , who say’s God Created Satan ,I am not talking Ezekiel, that is not convincing enough, We need how he created the Angels using Angel Dust:)

[forlife]

To be fair, I don’t believe Tiribulus has ever categorically condemned every Catholic soul to hell. To the contrary, he’s said specifically that some Catholics will in fact be saved, although he believes it is in spite of the church rather than because of it.

Now the church itself…yes he has repeatedly and unashamedly condemned the church as a tool of Satan rather than of god. But that is different from saying every Catholic will be damned.

[pat]

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:<<< I understand tirib because he hates Catholics and has destined them to hell, <<<>>> I know tirib believes we’ve been predestined to go hell, in the face of tons of scripture to the contrary. >>>[/quote]You’re a liar Pat. A vitriolic, irrational, blind liar. I defy you right now to quote me even once saying anything even vaguely approaching what you’ve here put in my mouth. I dare ya. You are a liar like your father who is the father of lies. Bring it or shut your filthy lying mouth once and for all. I will quote myself for pages saying exactly the opposite TO YOU PERSONALLY and expose your dead lying heart for exactly what it is in the broad daylight in front of all these people. You have been doing this to me for months and I have beaten myself silly trying to believe you just weren’t reading me right, but this is enough. You first. Where? Where have I said these things? QUOTES OR SHUT UP. Open your big fat lying mouth and substantiate your accusations and when you can’t I will show you for the idolatrous pagan deceiver you are. Is this post Christian? You better believe it is.
[/quote]

Are you denying you said that “If there will be any Catholics in heaven it will only be by the very extreme mercy of God?”

Are you calling God a liar? Weird, cause he’s my Father in heaven.

Don’t get your panties in a wad, you know damn well you have said many many times that you hate the RCC, further you know the RCC is the people of the RCC for we are the chruch, as we have explain many times. To hate it is to hate us. You cannot have it both ways, it’s not like bi-sexuality.

Do you deny you hate the church? Then you cannot deny you hate it’s people too, it’s impossible.
Calling me names doesn’t change the facts.

Calm down sister, that hate in your heart makes you very jumpy.

It’s not my fault you believe the lies of a murder and a heretic.

[pat]

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]Cortes wrote:
Come on now Tirib and push. There is some serious misinterpretation of Chris’ meaning going on here.
[/quote]

…serious? This isn’t misinterpretation of what I meant, this is straw man. I never said we took their theology and made it ours, I said we took their pagan ways and made it Christian.

Does anyone here use a Christmas tree, how about a Christmas wreath? Both pagan origins. Do you use the word Thursday, that is definitely pagan? How about Monday? How about an empty crucifix? Do Protestants still burn yule logs? How about the Lutherans, Methodists, Episcopalians, and Anglicans does your clergy still wear vestments? Greek and Roman pagan clothing, formerly known as a toga.

Do you still call the planets Venus, Mercury, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn? Pagan names of pagan gods. How about August you still use the word August? Pagan Ruler. How about July, another pagan ruler. How about January? Pagan god. March? Pagan god of Mars.

Holy moly, guess we’re all a bunch of gospel-less heathens just compromising with the pagans.

No, they didn’t misunderstand me. They saw a chance to attack the Church, and they did but the failed to even address my argument. Straw man, is all I got for them.[/quote]

This ^ is in fact the straw man (geez I get tired of that stupid term along with “ad hominem”, both are overused online).

It’s not what I was talking about but you did nicely twist things around. Good job.[/quote]

I understand tirib because he hates Catholics and has destined them to hell, but why is push hating on Catholics? I know tirib believes we’ve been predestined to go hell, in the face of tons of scripture to the contrary. Why is push hating Catholics?

Push are you calvinist or arminianist? Are you in the ranks of the Calvinist who claims that God created most men to condemn them to hell because God has predestined this?

Well, at least tell me what’s going on…It’s apparently to spread out to detect it’s origin.
[/quote]

Please quote me where I said or implied that I hated Catholics.[/quote]

‘hating’ as in the verb, the slag you know like ‘hatin’ like, the act of beating up on of criticizing. Not ‘I hate Catholics’, Like, “Yo holmes why is yo hatin’ on my sister”…

[pat]

[quote]forlife wrote:
To be fair, I don’t believe Tiribulus has ever categorically condemned every Catholic soul to hell. To the contrary, he’s said specifically that some Catholics will in fact be saved, although he believes it is in spite of the church rather than because of it.

Now the church itself…yes he has repeatedly and unashamedly condemned the church as a tool of Satan rather than of god. But that is different from saying every Catholic will be damned.[/quote]

No, no in fairy land, you can simutaneously condemn people to hell love them at the same time. You know how he proclaimed his undying love for Morman’s, too damn bad God destined them all to go the the 7th level of hell.
Like how much he loves JW’s but God is shoving them in the the pit of Gehenna…

It’s the weird dichotomy you must have when you believe the words of self serving, power hungry pig of a man in John Calvin…I prefer God’s word unmolested myself.

[pat]

[quote]Sloth wrote:
Hey what color bandanas are we supposed to be wearing. I’m afraid I’m late, and must’ve missed the gang color designations. I’d prefer if the Catholics could get blue. Oh, and have we come up with gang signs yet?

Seriously though, maybe put each other on ignore for awhile and take a break? Doesn’t seem like continued interaction is helping…

[/quote]

I am gettin’ the rainbow!

[pat]

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Why did God create Satan?[/quote]

Somebody earlier had the brilliant answer I like best, to keep assholes out of heaven…

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Why did God create Satan?[/quote]

Good question , who say’s God Created Satan ,I am not talking Ezekiel, that is not convincing enough, We need how he created the Angels using Angel Dust:)
[/quote]

He created them out of nothing, that is the definition of create.

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]forlife wrote:
Now the church itself…yes he has repeatedly and unashamedly condemned the church as a tool of Satan rather than of god. But that is different from saying every Catholic will be damned.[/quote]

This part right here, you wrote and I assume you see it.

Paul tells us that we “are” the body of Christ, the Church. Catholics believe this, he didn’t say we go to the Church, he didn’t say we walk into the Church, St. Paul says we ARE the Church (though we only make up the tarnish-able material side, not the incorruptible spiritual side, which is Jesus himself).

Let’s give Tirib the benefit of the doubt. He knows the scriptures, well at least thoroughly knows the small part of the Bible that is the New Testament. Tirib knows the above mentioned verses. So, when he condemns the “Church,” he knows that any Catholic that has ever heard the scriptures (which Catholics hear more scripture than Protestants do) will know that Tirib is condemning them directly. If he doesn’t realise this, then doesn’t he remember that what happens to one happens to all?

[Cortes]

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
Hey what color bandanas are we supposed to be wearing. I’m afraid I’m late, and must’ve missed the gang color designations. I’d prefer if the Catholics could get blue. Oh, and have we come up with gang signs yet?

Seriously though, maybe put each other on ignore for awhile and take a break? Doesn’t seem like continued interaction is helping…

[/quote]

I am gettin’ the rainbow![/quote]

First the Calvinists, and now forlife. Man Pat, you really are heartless.

[pat]

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:<<< Seriously though, maybe put each other on ignore for awhile and take a break? Doesn’t seem like continued interaction is helping…[/quote]I don’t need to put anybody on ignore. I don’t even need an apology. I would just appreciate not being repeatedly and incessantly lied about. I have never EVER said volumes of tripe Pat has attributed to me by name over actually the last year. You’re a decent man Sloth I know you see this. Even Chris sees it though his misplaced loyalty to the “holy see” has him silent despite the fact that I’ve defended him and will do it again. I have also never EVER intentionally misrepresented ANYONE here. Not you, not him, not Chris, not Elder Forlife or Bodyguard or capped or Mike or Ephrem or anybody else no matter who they are or what vituperation they come with.

This man has resisted my calm (usually) sincere efforts at elucidation of my beliefs over and over and over and over again. I have called him friend and expressed a genuine hope that we would some day meet in person. He has and is lying. There is no longer any other possible conclusion except illiteracy and or demonic influence to account for his attributing thought to me the diametric opposite of which is literally 2 INCHES ABOVE HIS ACCUSATIONS ON THE SAME PAGE… ADDRESSED TO HIM. I can demonstrate in totally comprehensive and irrefutable fashion exactly what I’m talkin about. I have had it with being misrepresented and lied about because it distorts and perverts what I believe about the God I know and love.

And ya know what? You’re wrong if you think anger is the primary explanation for my attitude. I am hurt and that because contrary to the stone hearted “tough guys” around here who don’t care what anybody thinks, I do care. I wouldn’t do that to him and you wouldn’t do it to me. We got into it pretty good a while back and not once did either of us lie about the other or call each other names. Pat is a characterless religious heathen who has been on a protracted attack campaign against ME PERSONALLY for a long time. I’m calling him out. Show us or admit you’ve been lying about me because I guarantee you if you don’t I WILL expose your lies.
[/quote]

LOL! you mad…
and your still wrong.

[pat]

[quote]Cortes wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
Hey what color bandanas are we supposed to be wearing. I’m afraid I’m late, and must’ve missed the gang color designations. I’d prefer if the Catholics could get blue. Oh, and have we come up with gang signs yet?

Seriously though, maybe put each other on ignore for awhile and take a break? Doesn’t seem like continued interaction is helping…

[/quote]

I am gettin’ the rainbow![/quote]

First the Calvinists, and now forlife. Man Pat, you really are heartless.

;)[/quote]

I actually don’t have an issue with forlife…He’s never decreed me by the will of God that I am going to hell. That’s usually my button pusher…The rainbow includes all colors, I am a lover, not a hater.

[pat]

Nevermind…

[pat]

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]forlife wrote:
Now the church itself…yes he has repeatedly and unashamedly condemned the church as a tool of Satan rather than of god. But that is different from saying every Catholic will be damned.[/quote]

This part right here, you wrote and I assume you see it.

Paul tells us that we “are” the body of Christ, the Church. Catholics believe this, he didn’t say we go to the Church, he didn’t say we walk into the Church, St. Paul says we ARE the Church (though we only make up the tarnish-able material side, not the incorruptible spiritual side, which is Jesus himself).

Let’s give Tirib the benefit of the doubt. He knows the scriptures, well at least thoroughly knows the small part of the Bible that is the New Testament. Tirib knows the above mentioned verses. So, when he condemns the “Church,” he knows that any Catholic that has ever heard the scriptures (which Catholics hear more scripture than Protestants do) will know that Tirib is condemning them directly. If he doesn’t realise this, then doesn’t he remember that what happens to one happens to all?[/quote]

Knowing and understanding are two different things…Just sayin’

[pittbulll]

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Why did God create Satan?[/quote]

Good question , who say’s God Created Satan ,I am not talking Ezekiel, that is not convincing enough, We need how he created the Angels using Angel Dust:)
[/quote]

He created them out of nothing, that is the definition of create. [/quote]

God created man by the dust of the earth, woman from man’s rib.

[forlife]

[quote]pat wrote:

[quote]Sloth wrote:
Hey what color bandanas are we supposed to be wearing. I’m afraid I’m late, and must’ve missed the gang color designations. I’d prefer if the Catholics could get blue. Oh, and have we come up with gang signs yet?

Seriously though, maybe put each other on ignore for awhile and take a break? Doesn’t seem like continued interaction is helping…

[/quote]

I am gettin’ the rainbow![/quote]

All this talk about fairies and rainbows has me giddy.

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]pushharder wrote:
Why did God create Satan?[/quote]

Good question , who say’s God Created Satan ,I am not talking Ezekiel, that is not convincing enough, We need how he created the Angels using Angel Dust:)
[/quote]

He created them out of nothing, that is the definition of create. [/quote]

God created man by the dust of the earth, woman from man’s rib.
[/quote]

Uh huh.