Who's Funding the Mosque?

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]weby wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:
Islamic people are not supposed to try and convert you.[/quote]

Perfectly written. They are not supposed to try and convert you. They are to convert you or kill you.[/quote]

Not if you are Jewish or Christian they are not.[/quote]

That’s not correct. They attempt coversion, by force if need be.

What they will do is permit “people of the book” to live as dhmini (under the “dominion”). That is, you are allowed to live, but are not a full citizen, your testimony doesn’t matter in court, have limited civil rights, and have to pay a jizya — or a special, additional, tax penalty for being Christian or Jewish.

Eventually they make dhminni status so unbearable and the jizya tax so high, you either flee or convert.

It’s all about subjugation.[/quote]

Ever religion has some sort of superiority issues
for example the HOLIEST books of the religion of JUDAISM and the books that are the foundation of the entire secular culture of the JEWS religious or non-religious are known as the TALMUD, a racist, bigoted series of books full of VILE HATRED toward JESUS,CHRISTIANITY,CHRISTIANS, and every other non-Jew, as well. The TALMUD calls for the eventual slaughter of ALL GENTILES!

And to be honest with you i like my balls

[/quote]

Proof or gtfo

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

I think the issue is that the Muslims did not attack us any more than the Christians attacked us at Oklahoma city. We were attacked by terrorists [/quote]

I wasn’t aware that Timothy McVeigh thought he was doing “God’s work”, that he did what he did in the name of Christianity, or that many Christians supported his actions.

Did I miss something, or is your comparison fatally flawed?[/quote]

The story I heard was McVey attacked the Murrah Building in Oklahoma , because the federal government attacked a Christian compound in Wako Texas. You will have to excuse me if I got it wrong
[/quote]

They story went on to say the David Koresh, the leader of the Branch Davidians, beleived he was Jesus Christ. Does this make them a Christian organization? I think not.[/quote]

So it is some spin off of Christianity . Some people think the whole God is is spoof [/quote]

Both you and CB know good an well the Branch Davidians, and Timothy McVehy were not Christians. You might as well try another argument. Saudi Arabia, Iran, Afghanistan, and others monetarily supported the terrorists of 9/11. 30% of Muslims identify and back what the terrorists did on 9/11. The Christian Church did not in any way give money to Timothy McVehy to destroy a Federal Building. Less than .00000000001 of all Christians back up what those two did. If you guys really believe this then you will eat up about everything.

Hey Pitt I have a nice warm Cow Patty over here would you like a taste. It is the best tasting Cow Patty ever.[/quote]

He was a Christian, Koresh was a Christian. Now they might not hold the same views as the majority of Christians but that doesn’t stop them being Christians. You (collective) play that game over and over, you claim Christianity is perfect then anyone who is less than perfect you disavow but when a group of Muslims do the same you say they are being disingenuous.

Personally I feel the world would be better off if everyone woke up and stopped believing in any of these fairy tales but that doesn’t give me the right to try to stop you worshiping who you want where you want.

You are the Christian so why am I the one that can forgive and tolerate?[/quote]

You maybe able to forgiven and tolerate, but you still can’t correctly identify a Christian.

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

I think the issue is that the Muslims did not attack us any more than the Christians attacked us at Oklahoma city. We were attacked by terrorists [/quote]

I wasn’t aware that Timothy McVeigh thought he was doing “God’s work”, that he did what he did in the name of Christianity, or that many Christians supported his actions.

Did I miss something, or is your comparison fatally flawed?[/quote]

The story I heard was McVey attacked the Murrah Building in Oklahoma , because the federal government attacked a Christian compound in Wako Texas. You will have to excuse me if I got it wrong
[/quote]

They story went on to say the David Koresh, the leader of the Branch Davidians, beleived he was Jesus Christ. Does this make them a Christian organization? I think not.[/quote]

So it is some spin off of Christianity . Some people think the whole God is is spoof [/quote]

Both you and CB know good an well the Branch Davidians, and Timothy McVehy were not Christians. You might as well try another argument. Saudi Arabia, Iran, Afghanistan, and others monetarily supported the terrorists of 9/11. 30% of Muslims identify and back what the terrorists did on 9/11. The Christian Church did not in any way give money to Timothy McVehy to destroy a Federal Building. Less than .00000000001 of all Christians back up what those two did. If you guys really believe this then you will eat up about everything.

Hey Pitt I have a nice warm Cow Patty over here would you like a taste. It is the best tasting Cow Patty ever.[/quote]

He was a Christian, Koresh was a Christian. Now they might not hold the same views as the majority of Christians but that doesn’t stop them being Christians. You (collective) play that game over and over, you claim Christianity is perfect then anyone who is less than perfect you disavow but when a group of Muslims do the same you say they are being disingenuous.

Personally I feel the world would be better off if everyone woke up and stopped believing in any of these fairy tales but that doesn’t give me the right to try to stop you worshiping who you want where you want.

You are the Christian so why am I the one that can forgive and tolerate?[/quote]

I may not like the Muslims building a Mosque near Ground Zero, but by our constitution they have every right to. That does not mean they will not have people out front protesting, but they have every right to.

You comparing a lunitic, David Koresh and Timothy McVehy, to being Christian because of what? They are White, and talk about Jesus? You have no clue what being a Christian is about. So now you are turning from being Agnostic to being Atheist. You really need to pick which side you are on. Jumping back and forth shows you really have no idea what you are talking about.

Now has any of the Muslim world actually disavowed the what the 9/11 bombers did? Have all the Muslim nations come out and said come here we have your guys here they are? Have the Muslim nations allowed Christians to build churches in there countries? You are not comparing Apples to Apples.

If you truely believe that David Koresh is a Christian then you have no clue what Christianity is about. Christians have disavowedt he teaching of David Koresh. The Muslim world bows down to Osama Bin Laden. The Muslim world condones the mistreatment of their women, and all non-beleivers. Read the Koran. It is filled with hate, and murder. The Koran was written by one man. The Bible was written by many people over many generations. Two different books that have nothing in common.

We are warning people of what the truth behind Islam is about. If you want to put your head in the ground and not listen then you go right on ahead that is your right.

[/quote]

I have pretty clearly stated on numerous threads that I am atheist.

Feel free to go on playing your game of who the craziest crazy person is. The whole point is not whether the Saudi’s would support you building a church right next to Mecca (the Vatican is in talks about building a Church in Saudi though interestingly enough.) The point is that in the US, due to the freedoms that you are so proud, people have the right to worship who they want, how they want, where they want. This should make you happy.[/quote]

I am not an atheist , just because you do not like his brand of Christianity does not mean that he was not a Christian. Did you ever think the Majority of Muslims do not like the brand of Muslim that the Radicals practice[/quote]

Well I have a certain view of Christianity, and it is not because someone “do not like his brand of Christianity” that he’s not a Christian, it is because he’s not.

[pittbulll]

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

I think the issue is that the Muslims did not attack us any more than the Christians attacked us at Oklahoma city. We were attacked by terrorists [/quote]

I wasn’t aware that Timothy McVeigh thought he was doing “God’s work”, that he did what he did in the name of Christianity, or that many Christians supported his actions.

Did I miss something, or is your comparison fatally flawed?[/quote]

The story I heard was McVey attacked the Murrah Building in Oklahoma , because the federal government attacked a Christian compound in Wako Texas. You will have to excuse me if I got it wrong
[/quote]

They story went on to say the David Koresh, the leader of the Branch Davidians, beleived he was Jesus Christ. Does this make them a Christian organization? I think not.[/quote]

So it is some spin off of Christianity . Some people think the whole God is is spoof [/quote]

Both you and CB know good an well the Branch Davidians, and Timothy McVehy were not Christians. You might as well try another argument. Saudi Arabia, Iran, Afghanistan, and others monetarily supported the terrorists of 9/11. 30% of Muslims identify and back what the terrorists did on 9/11. The Christian Church did not in any way give money to Timothy McVehy to destroy a Federal Building. Less than .00000000001 of all Christians back up what those two did. If you guys really believe this then you will eat up about everything.

Hey Pitt I have a nice warm Cow Patty over here would you like a taste. It is the best tasting Cow Patty ever.[/quote]

He was a Christian, Koresh was a Christian. Now they might not hold the same views as the majority of Christians but that doesn’t stop them being Christians. You (collective) play that game over and over, you claim Christianity is perfect then anyone who is less than perfect you disavow but when a group of Muslims do the same you say they are being disingenuous.

Personally I feel the world would be better off if everyone woke up and stopped believing in any of these fairy tales but that doesn’t give me the right to try to stop you worshiping who you want where you want.

You are the Christian so why am I the one that can forgive and tolerate?[/quote]

I may not like the Muslims building a Mosque near Ground Zero, but by our constitution they have every right to. That does not mean they will not have people out front protesting, but they have every right to.

You comparing a lunitic, David Koresh and Timothy McVehy, to being Christian because of what? They are White, and talk about Jesus? You have no clue what being a Christian is about. So now you are turning from being Agnostic to being Atheist. You really need to pick which side you are on. Jumping back and forth shows you really have no idea what you are talking about.

Now has any of the Muslim world actually disavowed the what the 9/11 bombers did? Have all the Muslim nations come out and said come here we have your guys here they are? Have the Muslim nations allowed Christians to build churches in there countries? You are not comparing Apples to Apples.

If you truely believe that David Koresh is a Christian then you have no clue what Christianity is about. Christians have disavowedt he teaching of David Koresh. The Muslim world bows down to Osama Bin Laden. The Muslim world condones the mistreatment of their women, and all non-beleivers. Read the Koran. It is filled with hate, and murder. The Koran was written by one man. The Bible was written by many people over many generations. Two different books that have nothing in common.

We are warning people of what the truth behind Islam is about. If you want to put your head in the ground and not listen then you go right on ahead that is your right.

[/quote]

I have pretty clearly stated on numerous threads that I am atheist.

Feel free to go on playing your game of who the craziest crazy person is. The whole point is not whether the Saudi’s would support you building a church right next to Mecca (the Vatican is in talks about building a Church in Saudi though interestingly enough.) The point is that in the US, due to the freedoms that you are so proud, people have the right to worship who they want, how they want, where they want. This should make you happy.[/quote]

I am not an atheist , just because you do not like his brand of Christianity does not mean that he was not a Christian. Did you ever think the Majority of Muslims do not like the brand of Muslim that the Radicals practice[/quote]

Well I have a certain view of Christianity, and it is not because someone “do not like his brand of Christianity” that he’s not a Christian, it is because he’s not.[/quote]

Did he say he is not ?

[pittbulll]

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]FrozenNinja wrote:
Hmm…a Mosque in Ground zero? Have we not learned anything?[/quote]

What were we supposed to learn ? [/quote]

To me, it would be disrespectful to place a Mosque at GROUND ZERO. If you know or love anyone that had anything to do with the twin towers, especially ones that passed its disrespectful. Its disrespectful to glorify ground zero with a Mosque which terorrists associate themselves with. I know most Muslims don’t associate themselves with extremist views, but to me putting a Mosque at ground zero would be like saying " Sorry if we offended you, heres a tribute to your religion!" I have absoulutely no problem with Muslims and their religous choices (the non-extremist ones) you can believe what you want. If you wanna build a mosque in honor of 911…put it somewhere else, not ground zero.

Building a mosque in that honor shows America honors many religions and Honors the “good” Isalm practice…but you can find somewhere else to put it. Not somewhere that a tragedy occurred that will remind many people of who and what attacked. [/quote]

I think the issue is that the Muslims did not attack us any more than the Christians attacked us at Oklahoma city. We were attacked by terrorists [/quote]

Oklahoma City? Seriously. You consider those Christians. I think Christians need to actually start handing out pamphlets to let heathens know what Christians are so you know just because someone says they are something, they can still tell if they are just pulling the wool over their eyes. [/quote]

I believe it does not matter what I think, i believe it matters whether McVey and God think he is a Christian

[PonceDeLeon]

[quote]dk44 wrote:

[quote]pat wrote:
There is no win in this situation. I don’t really want the mosque there either, but if I am to support liberty and freedom as I do, I must just deal with it and not like it. Being a true supporter of liberty means you have to put up with shit you don’t like. I don’t like it, but I won’t trump freedom to stop it.

However, if it does become a hub for illegal or terrorist activity of any kind, it should be shut down pronto. [/quote]

Great post, I agree.[/quote]

Very good post. Mods, please lock this thread before it degenerates into a Limbaugh-endorsed, racist circle jerk.

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

I have openly told Muslim friends that I am atheist and don’t believe any of what they believe. Funnily I haven’t had to go any further with them because they just accept it and change the topic. Unlike my Christian friends who typically start calling me crazy for thinking that we decended from Monkeys, telling me how empty my life must be and then telling me they will pray for me.[/quote]

If your friend’s do this and say those things, don’t listen to them. Or, at least do not associate it with me or the Catholic Church.

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:
For all those banging on about the US being a Christian nation and having no space for Islam. Interesting that your founding fathers didn’t share your views.

There are numerous quotes supporting the freedom for Muslims to practice their religion in the US.

Here is a useful link for any of you prepared to pull your head out of your arse long enough

http://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/0205/tolerance.html[/quote]

Do we forget that most of the slave traders on the west coast of Africa were Muslims, I’m sure that would hinder business if we wouldn’t let them come here and live here.

[Brother_Chris]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

I think the issue is that the Muslims did not attack us any more than the Christians attacked us at Oklahoma city. We were attacked by terrorists [/quote]

I wasn’t aware that Timothy McVeigh thought he was doing “God’s work”, that he did what he did in the name of Christianity, or that many Christians supported his actions.

Did I miss something, or is your comparison fatally flawed?[/quote]

The story I heard was McVey attacked the Murrah Building in Oklahoma , because the federal government attacked a Christian compound in Wako Texas. You will have to excuse me if I got it wrong
[/quote]

They story went on to say the David Koresh, the leader of the Branch Davidians, beleived he was Jesus Christ. Does this make them a Christian organization? I think not.[/quote]

So it is some spin off of Christianity . Some people think the whole God is is spoof [/quote]

Both you and CB know good an well the Branch Davidians, and Timothy McVehy were not Christians. You might as well try another argument. Saudi Arabia, Iran, Afghanistan, and others monetarily supported the terrorists of 9/11. 30% of Muslims identify and back what the terrorists did on 9/11. The Christian Church did not in any way give money to Timothy McVehy to destroy a Federal Building. Less than .00000000001 of all Christians back up what those two did. If you guys really believe this then you will eat up about everything.

Hey Pitt I have a nice warm Cow Patty over here would you like a taste. It is the best tasting Cow Patty ever.[/quote]

He was a Christian, Koresh was a Christian. Now they might not hold the same views as the majority of Christians but that doesn’t stop them being Christians. You (collective) play that game over and over, you claim Christianity is perfect then anyone who is less than perfect you disavow but when a group of Muslims do the same you say they are being disingenuous.

Personally I feel the world would be better off if everyone woke up and stopped believing in any of these fairy tales but that doesn’t give me the right to try to stop you worshiping who you want where you want.

You are the Christian so why am I the one that can forgive and tolerate?[/quote]

I may not like the Muslims building a Mosque near Ground Zero, but by our constitution they have every right to. That does not mean they will not have people out front protesting, but they have every right to.

You comparing a lunitic, David Koresh and Timothy McVehy, to being Christian because of what? They are White, and talk about Jesus? You have no clue what being a Christian is about. So now you are turning from being Agnostic to being Atheist. You really need to pick which side you are on. Jumping back and forth shows you really have no idea what you are talking about.

Now has any of the Muslim world actually disavowed the what the 9/11 bombers did? Have all the Muslim nations come out and said come here we have your guys here they are? Have the Muslim nations allowed Christians to build churches in there countries? You are not comparing Apples to Apples.

If you truely believe that David Koresh is a Christian then you have no clue what Christianity is about. Christians have disavowedt he teaching of David Koresh. The Muslim world bows down to Osama Bin Laden. The Muslim world condones the mistreatment of their women, and all non-beleivers. Read the Koran. It is filled with hate, and murder. The Koran was written by one man. The Bible was written by many people over many generations. Two different books that have nothing in common.

We are warning people of what the truth behind Islam is about. If you want to put your head in the ground and not listen then you go right on ahead that is your right.

[/quote]

I have pretty clearly stated on numerous threads that I am atheist.

Feel free to go on playing your game of who the craziest crazy person is. The whole point is not whether the Saudi’s would support you building a church right next to Mecca (the Vatican is in talks about building a Church in Saudi though interestingly enough.) The point is that in the US, due to the freedoms that you are so proud, people have the right to worship who they want, how they want, where they want. This should make you happy.[/quote]

I am not an atheist , just because you do not like his brand of Christianity does not mean that he was not a Christian. Did you ever think the Majority of Muslims do not like the brand of Muslim that the Radicals practice[/quote]

Well I have a certain view of Christianity, and it is not because someone “do not like his brand of Christianity” that he’s not a Christian, it is because he’s not.[/quote]

Did he say he is not ?[/quote]

He doesn’t have to, there is clear signs if he was a Christian or not…he was not.

[Tiribulus]

On

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:
Did he say he is not ?[/quote]
He doesn’t have to, there is clear signs if he was a Christian or not…he was not.[/quote]Look at that. Chris n I agree on something. I keep trying to tell him this, but it doesn’t do any good. Even by the very broadest and most generous definitions of orthodoxy, definitions agreed on even by you and I who are on opposite ends of the Christian universe, Koresh was closer to being a bean burrito than a Christian.

[Sifu]

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:
For all those banging on about the US being a Christian nation and having no space for Islam. Interesting that your founding fathers didn’t share your views.

There are numerous quotes supporting the freedom for Muslims to practice their religion in the US.

Here is a useful link for any of you prepared to pull your head out of your arse long enough

http://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/0205/tolerance.html[/quote]

Do we forget that most of the slave traders on the west coast of Africa were Muslims, I’m sure that would hinder business if we wouldn’t let them come here and live here.[/quote]

Why do you only mention the west coast slave trade? The west coast slave trade was a minor side show compared to the east coast slave trade. Over a hundred million Africans died in the east coast slave trade. Many of them died from being marched across the Sahara desert without water.

Much like how millions of Hindu slaves died being marched across the Hindu Kush. Kush by the way comes from the Persian word Kushtar which means slaughter so in Persian Hindu Kush means Hindu slaughter.

A major difference between the east and west coast slave trade is that in the Americas the slaves were allowed to have children that is why they have descendants in the Americas. But in the Arabian countries where the east coast slaves were sent to you can’t find their descendants because any children were killed as soon as they were born.

In islam the history of slavery goes all the way back to muhamad. Part of the muslim faith is the belief that muhammad was the perfect man who led the perfect life. That is why I cannot see how islam could ever be rehabilitated into something good.

[Jewbacca]

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]weby wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:
Islamic people are not supposed to try and convert you.[/quote]

Perfectly written. They are not supposed to try and convert you. They are to convert you or kill you.[/quote]

Not if you are Jewish or Christian they are not.[/quote]

That’s not correct. They attempt coversion, by force if need be.

What they will do is permit “people of the book” to live as dhmini (under the “dominion”). That is, you are allowed to live, but are not a full citizen, your testimony doesn’t matter in court, have limited civil rights, and have to pay a jizya — or a special, additional, tax penalty for being Christian or Jewish.

Eventually they make dhminni status so unbearable and the jizya tax so high, you either flee or convert.

It’s all about subjugation.[/quote]

Ever religion has some sort of superiority issues
for example the HOLIEST books of the religion of JUDAISM and the books that are the foundation of the entire secular culture of the JEWS religious or non-religious are known as the TALMUD, a racist, bigoted series of books full of VILE HATRED toward JESUS,CHRISTIANITY,CHRISTIANS, and every other non-Jew, as well. The TALMUD calls for the eventual slaughter of ALL GENTILES!

And to be honest with you i like my balls

[/quote]

Proof or gtfo[/quote]

It’s an off-repeated lie found on white-supremecist (and anti-Catholic) websites.

Briefly, the context was in the Exodus from Eqypt. Many Eqyptians had taken to the worship of the true G-d, rejecting idolatry and were great friends of the Jewish people.

The Jewish people objected to their punishment by G-d because of the sins of Pharoah.

Eventually, these believing Eqyptians were conscripted into the Eqyptian army as part of the follow-up attacks on the the fleeing Jewish people.

The Jewish people objecting to killing them, as they worshipped G-d and followed Him.

G-d stated that, no, they are in my hands. They are following the orders of the Pharoah, as is their duty as Eqyptians. As a result, they are to be killed, just like the unjust, pagan, Eqyptians, but I (G-d) will give them their reward.

It was a great anguish to the Jewish people, and, to this day, Orthodox Jewish people have a fast (the Fast of the Innocents) the day before Passover to remember the sacrifice of these good, just, Eqyptian people (and, in particular, the innocent first born sons taken in the Last Plague).

Anyways, the white supremecists (and the above poster), take this very sad decision out of context and claim that Jewish people plot to kill all non-Jewish people.

It’s absurd, but then, so is their hatred.

[pittbulll]

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

I think the issue is that the Muslims did not attack us any more than the Christians attacked us at Oklahoma city. We were attacked by terrorists [/quote]

I wasn’t aware that Timothy McVeigh thought he was doing “God’s work”, that he did what he did in the name of Christianity, or that many Christians supported his actions.

Did I miss something, or is your comparison fatally flawed?[/quote]

The story I heard was McVey attacked the Murrah Building in Oklahoma , because the federal government attacked a Christian compound in Wako Texas. You will have to excuse me if I got it wrong
[/quote]

They story went on to say the David Koresh, the leader of the Branch Davidians, beleived he was Jesus Christ. Does this make them a Christian organization? I think not.[/quote]

So it is some spin off of Christianity . Some people think the whole God is is spoof [/quote]

Both you and CB know good an well the Branch Davidians, and Timothy McVehy were not Christians. You might as well try another argument. Saudi Arabia, Iran, Afghanistan, and others monetarily supported the terrorists of 9/11. 30% of Muslims identify and back what the terrorists did on 9/11. The Christian Church did not in any way give money to Timothy McVehy to destroy a Federal Building. Less than .00000000001 of all Christians back up what those two did. If you guys really believe this then you will eat up about everything.

Hey Pitt I have a nice warm Cow Patty over here would you like a taste. It is the best tasting Cow Patty ever.[/quote]

He was a Christian, Koresh was a Christian. Now they might not hold the same views as the majority of Christians but that doesn’t stop them being Christians. You (collective) play that game over and over, you claim Christianity is perfect then anyone who is less than perfect you disavow but when a group of Muslims do the same you say they are being disingenuous.

Personally I feel the world would be better off if everyone woke up and stopped believing in any of these fairy tales but that doesn’t give me the right to try to stop you worshiping who you want where you want.

You are the Christian so why am I the one that can forgive and tolerate?[/quote]

I may not like the Muslims building a Mosque near Ground Zero, but by our constitution they have every right to. That does not mean they will not have people out front protesting, but they have every right to.

You comparing a lunitic, David Koresh and Timothy McVehy, to being Christian because of what? They are White, and talk about Jesus? You have no clue what being a Christian is about. So now you are turning from being Agnostic to being Atheist. You really need to pick which side you are on. Jumping back and forth shows you really have no idea what you are talking about.

Now has any of the Muslim world actually disavowed the what the 9/11 bombers did? Have all the Muslim nations come out and said come here we have your guys here they are? Have the Muslim nations allowed Christians to build churches in there countries? You are not comparing Apples to Apples.

If you truely believe that David Koresh is a Christian then you have no clue what Christianity is about. Christians have disavowedt he teaching of David Koresh. The Muslim world bows down to Osama Bin Laden. The Muslim world condones the mistreatment of their women, and all non-beleivers. Read the Koran. It is filled with hate, and murder. The Koran was written by one man. The Bible was written by many people over many generations. Two different books that have nothing in common.

We are warning people of what the truth behind Islam is about. If you want to put your head in the ground and not listen then you go right on ahead that is your right.

[/quote]

I have pretty clearly stated on numerous threads that I am atheist.

Feel free to go on playing your game of who the craziest crazy person is. The whole point is not whether the Saudi’s would support you building a church right next to Mecca (the Vatican is in talks about building a Church in Saudi though interestingly enough.) The point is that in the US, due to the freedoms that you are so proud, people have the right to worship who they want, how they want, where they want. This should make you happy.[/quote]

I am not an atheist , just because you do not like his brand of Christianity does not mean that he was not a Christian. Did you ever think the Majority of Muslims do not like the brand of Muslim that the Radicals practice[/quote]

Well I have a certain view of Christianity, and it is not because someone “do not like his brand of Christianity” that he’s not a Christian, it is because he’s not.[/quote]

Did he say he is not ?[/quote]

He doesn’t have to, there is clear signs if he was a Christian or not…he was not.[/quote]

I do not know the scripture but as I recall it goes Judge not lest thee be judged . To say McVey is not a Christian is what I believe to be out of your Realm

I also know there is a scripture that says judge a man by his works.

I think Mc Vey might have been a hero if that building were vacant. That was in the Clinton administration and we had just about as many right wing kooks as we have today

[IrishSteel]

^ it is easy to prove that McVeigh’s beliefs did not mirror the traditional interpretation and doctrines of Christianity . . .

[IrishSteel]

Even easier to prove that his religious beliefs played little if any real impact upon his actions and choices . . .

[Neuromancer]

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:

[quote]weby wrote:

[quote]Jewbacca wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:

[quote]dmaddox wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:
Islamic people are not supposed to try and convert you.[/quote]

Perfectly written. They are not supposed to try and convert you. They are to convert you or kill you.[/quote]

Not if you are Jewish or Christian they are not.[/quote]

That’s not correct. They attempt coversion, by force if need be.

What they will do is permit “people of the book” to live as dhmini (under the “dominion”). That is, you are allowed to live, but are not a full citizen, your testimony doesn’t matter in court, have limited civil rights, and have to pay a jizya — or a special, additional, tax penalty for being Christian or Jewish.

Eventually they make dhminni status so unbearable and the jizya tax so high, you either flee or convert.

It’s all about subjugation.[/quote]

Ever religion has some sort of superiority issues
for example the HOLIEST books of the religion of JUDAISM and the books that are the foundation of the entire secular culture of the JEWS religious or non-religious are known as the TALMUD, a racist, bigoted series of books full of VILE HATRED toward JESUS,CHRISTIANITY,CHRISTIANS, and every other non-Jew, as well. The TALMUD calls for the eventual slaughter of ALL GENTILES!

And to be honest with you i like my balls

[/quote]

Proof or gtfo[/quote]

It’s an off-repeated lie found on white-supremecist (and anti-Catholic) websites.

Briefly, the context was in the Exodus from Eqypt. Many Eqyptians had taken to the worship of the true G-d, rejecting idolatry and were great friends of the Jewish people.

The Jewish people objected to their punishment by G-d because of the sins of Pharoah.

Eventually, these believing Eqyptians were conscripted into the Eqyptian army as part of the follow-up attacks on the the fleeing Jewish people.

The Jewish people objecting to killing them, as they worshipped G-d and followed Him.

G-d stated that, no, they are in my hands. They are following the orders of the Pharoah, as is their duty as Eqyptians. As a result, they are to be killed, just like the unjust, pagan, Eqyptians, but I (G-d) will give them their reward.

It was a great anguish to the Jewish people, and, to this day, Orthodox Jewish people have a fast (the Fast of the Innocents) the day before Passover to remember the sacrifice of these good, just, Eqyptian people (and, in particular, the innocent first born sons taken in the Last Plague).

Anyways, the white supremecists (and the above poster), take this very sad decision out of context and claim that Jewish people plot to kill all non-Jewish people.

It’s absurd, but then, so is their hatred.[/quote]

I can back Jewbacca up on this.I know many devout Orthodox Jews personally and closely ,and if anything,my understanding is the they believe it is much easier for a gentile to get into heaven than it is for a Jew.We (I’m a gentile) have far less onerous demands placed upon us,and only a few rules that have to be observed.I think it’s 13 or something like that,I forget the exact number,vs.the 600+ expected of the chosen people.

In short,all that was written by the poster Jewbacca was refuting is the biggest lot of shit imaginable.

[Jewbacca]

[quote]Neuromancer wrote:
“My understanding is the they believe it is much easier for a gentile to get into heaven than it is for a Jew.We (I’m a gentile) have far less onerous demands placed upon us,and only a few rules that have to be observed.I think it’s 13 or something like that,I forget the exact number,vs.the 600+ expected of the chosen people.”[/quote]

That’s correct, the 7 Laws of Noah, given to all peoples of the Earth:

To HIGHLY paraphrase:

1. Prohibition of Idolatry: You shall not have any idols before God.
2. Prohibition of Murder: You shall not murder.
3. Prohibition of Theft: You shall not steal.
4. Prohibition of Sexual immorality
5. Prohibition of Blasphemy: You shall not blaspheme God’s name.
6. Dietary Law: Do not eat flesh taken from an animal while it is still alive/drink blood. (Also general prohibition against unnecessary cruelty to animals.)
7. Set up a fair system of Governance/Courts.

When you really get down to it, it’s essentially the 10 Commandments, less the Sabbath.

[Tiribulus]

[quote]pittbulll wrote:

[quote]Brother Chris wrote:
<<< He doesn’t have to, there is clear signs if he was a Christian or not…he was not.[/quote]

I do not know the scripture but as I recall it goes Judge not lest thee be judged . To say McVey is not a Christian is what I believe to be out of your Realm

I also know there is a scripture that says judge a man by his works.

I think Mc Vey might have been a hero if that building were vacant. That was in the Clinton administration and we had just about as many right wing kooks as we have today >>>[/quote]Listen friend, I know how much fun it is to ignorantly wrench 6 words out of their context and point your big giggling finger of condemnation at Christians, but you have absolutely no idea what you are talking about. Christians are flat out commanded to judge, using the Word of God, all over the New Testament. That won’t matter to you because it doesn’t help you make your non existent case that any and all persons who allow the name “Jesus” to fall from their lips are Christians on that basis alone, regardless of how blatantly heretical or flagrantly immoral they happen to be. It is still the case nonetheless.

[Cockney_Blue]

[quote]Chushin wrote:

[quote]Cockney Blue wrote:
For all those banging on about the US being a Christian nation and having no space for Islam. Interesting that your founding fathers didn’t share your views.

There are numerous quotes supporting the freedom for Muslims to practice their religion in the US.

Here is a useful link for any of you prepared to pull your head out of your arse long enough

http://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/0205/tolerance.html[/quote]

Huh?

I don’t recall ANYONE saying “there is no space for Islam” in America.

Sorry, but I think it’s you who’s suffering from cephalocaudal inversion.[/quote]

So there is space, but you get to pick it. Maybe they should wear some sort of identifier in public as well a yellow crescent sewn onto their clothes should work…