[quote]DoubleDuce wrote:
Being a man is really about being yourself.
You have to be your own man. It’s something you need to learn for yourself. Relying on people on the interwebz to tell you how to be a man is not being a man.[/quote]
Just saw this after I posted, x2.
This is a very good website to start with, and I’ve personally spoken to the author of the book with the same name.
Buy the book.
Having good character is being a man.
For my serious take on this whole “MAN” thing. Who really gives a fuck. Your trying to put values on something that is subjective and different to different people. Be true to yourself, Be true to your friends and loved ones. Everything else is what makes the world interesting.
I just threw down that post about thinking how the world views you. I wasn’t asking it as if I gave two shits what the world thought of me. I was asking it from the perspective of, Am I projecting the person to the world that I think I am. There are people who I care about and want them to hold me in high regard, all that being said, I’m not going to be somebody other than myself just so I can achieve that goal. I want them to love me, the real me, because i’m selfish and want the real me to be awsome, not just to me, but to everyone else. Who the fuck want’s to be someone else (ok besides being Heff)
V
If you have to ask such a question you are not ready to be a man.
Real men don’t have to ask because they are men and they know what they are.
There is no way that it is to be described, it is just a feeling and knowing of what you are.
Really dude, do you actually think that a woman would actually post something similar?
Not a chance.
BB
[quote]Big Bencher wrote:
If you have to ask such a question you are not ready to be a man.
Real men don’t have to ask because they are men and they know what they are.
There is no way that it is to be described, it is just a feeling and knowing of what you are.
Really dude, do you actually think that a woman would actually post something similar?
Not a chance.
BB[/quote]
Okay, I guess men have reading comprehensions of 5 year olds, too. The guy clearly indicated he has problems with the “being a man” department. Telling him that it is stupid to ask questions is ridiculous. Who gives a fuck what women do? Really? Are we women now, no we are men.
The people, for YOU COUNT!, that have the best lives find the solution the fastest. Guess what’s a fast way to figure out a solution, asking a fucking question. Get off your dumb horse and grow up. Maybe be a man once and awhile instead of insulting a kid that admits he’s having trouble, actually helping him.
[quote]Big Bencher wrote:
If you have to ask such a question you are not ready to be a man.
Real men don’t have to ask because they are men and they know what they are.
There is no way that it is to be described, it is just a feeling and knowing of what you are.
Really dude, do you actually think that a woman would actually post something similar?
Not a chance.
BB[/quote]
Actually I’ve seen it posted on mostly female forums. It’s not the exact same question since you guys are supposed to figure out to be men at 18 and we are supposed to try and stay girls for as long as possible without looking like a clown but it is something that women/girls wonder about.
But no doubt it isn’t something women worry about nearly as much as men do other than dealing with the conflict of wanting to remain a girl for purposes of attractiveness and societal acceptance but needing to have maturity for succeeding in life.
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.[/quote]
Whats the DB stand for, It’s been nagging me. DumBell Cooper? Dick Bat Cooper? Double Barell Cooper? Double Bareback Cooper? Dynamic Bullshit Cooper?
V
[quote]Vegita wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.[/quote]
Whats the DB stand for, It’s been nagging me. DumBell Cooper? Dick Bat Cooper? Double Barell Cooper? Double Bareback Cooper? Dynamic Bullshit Cooper?
V[/quote]
If you were really a man you would have directly addressed, with something intelligent, whatever issue it is that you have with my post. Instead you have resorted to childish banter.
But I like children, so I’ll tell you what DB stands for. It changes all the time, but right now it stands for…Dynamic Balla’
[quote]DickBag wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.[/quote]
Well I think a highly insecure guy who doesnt think hes a man can be a man instantly if he does something that is bad ass.
therefore, insecurity doesnt make you less of a man. its ok to be insecure.
being shy and timid doesnt make you less of a man, actually, nothing makes you less of a man, really, because there is no such thing as absolute man.
So basically everyone should just look at themselves and identify what is good to bring to the table about what is man.
[/quote]
Of course it’s ok to be insecure. But I think if you are insecure about whether or not people perceive you as “manly” then you are probably not one. Insecurity about character defects is fine. But when the insecurity springs forth from a desire to improve one’s perception of you, rather than from a desire to remove the flaw in order to be of better service to others, this is an “unmanly” insecurity. Essentially it is the desire to be “manly” as a way to further feed one’s ego, rather than to be “manly” in an attempt to be a better man for the sake of others. Selfishness, self-will run riot and ego to the point of self-consumption are not the traits of a man, only the traits of someone who WANTS to be a man and will never be one.
It’s also ok to be egotistical to a certain extent. But it is important to understand the ways in which this can be a bad thing and to take certain steps to alleviate and/or reduce the negative impact this can have on one’s life. When someone is ego-driven, their actions are primarily based on serving themselves first, and anyone else second. This is not the sign of a man. It takes a man to really look at himself and understand what it is about him that he can work to improve so that he can be a better person to those around him. This requires rigid, harsh introspection and a willingness to ask whatever higher power it is that you believe in to remove these flaws, and it also requires a willingness to take the steps yourself to remove them.
Our personal flaws are part of what makes us who we are. But someone who is not a man simply accepts these flaws and expects others to deal with them because that’s “who he is.” Whereas a man accepts these flaws but also understands that these flaws can be minimized thru sincere attempts at self-improvement. They will never be entirely removed, but they can become dormant to the point where we rarely see these flaws as the source of pain that we cause others because we A) rarely intentionally cause pain to others in the first place and B) we understand the nature of our defects.
Men face the fear that they have about themselves, namely the fear of acknowledging that we are not perfect, we are not all-powerful, we are not capable of doing everything ourselves and that sometimes we need to seek help from others. This attitude and willingness to face these sorts of fears can manifest itself in many positive ways in our relationships with those whom we love. And when this happens, you will be much more “manly” and people will notice. But you will not require that they TELL you that they notice.
Am I making any sense here or is this just sounding like a bunch of babble?
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]Vegita wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.[/quote]
Whats the DB stand for, It’s been nagging me. DumBell Cooper? Dick Bat Cooper? Double Barell Cooper? Double Bareback Cooper? Dynamic Bullshit Cooper?
V[/quote]
If you were really a man you would have directly addressed, with something intelligent, whatever issue it is that you have with my post. Instead you have resorted to childish banter.
But I like children, so I’ll tell you what DB stands for. It changes all the time, but right now it stands for…Dynamic Balla’[/quote]
Oooohhhhhh Sounds really cool. Oh and BTW, I don’t have any issues with your post, I was actually just curious what the DB stood for, but yes on the other hand I’m almost completely childish. The way I look at it is when I was 3-5, the world was fucking awsome, so all I have to do to re-capture some of that is act like a 3-5 year old and shazzam! awesome world.
V
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]DickBag wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.[/quote]
Well I think a highly insecure guy who doesnt think hes a man can be a man instantly if he does something that is bad ass.
therefore, insecurity doesnt make you less of a man. its ok to be insecure.
being shy and timid doesnt make you less of a man, actually, nothing makes you less of a man, really, because there is no such thing as absolute man.
So basically everyone should just look at themselves and identify what is good to bring to the table about what is man.
[/quote]
Of course it’s ok to be insecure. But I think if you are insecure about whether or not people perceive you as “manly” then you are probably not one. Insecurity about character defects is fine. But when the insecurity springs forth from a desire to improve one’s perception of you, rather than from a desire to remove the flaw in order to be of better service to others, this is an “unmanly” insecurity. Essentially it is the desire to be “manly” as a way to further feed one’s ego, rather than to be “manly” in an attempt to be a better man for the sake of others. Selfishness, self-will run riot and ego to the point of self-consumption are not the traits of a man, only the traits of someone who WANTS to be a man and will never be one.
It’s also ok to be egotistical to a certain extent. But it is important to understand the ways in which this can be a bad thing and to take certain steps to alleviate and/or reduce the negative impact this can have on one’s life. When someone is ego-driven, their actions are primarily based on serving themselves first, and anyone else second. This is not the sign of a man. It takes a man to really look at himself and understand what it is about him that he can work to improve so that he can be a better person to those around him. This requires rigid, harsh introspection and a willingness to ask whatever higher power it is that you believe in to remove these flaws, and it also requires a willingness to take the steps yourself to remove them.
Our personal flaws are part of what makes us who we are. But someone who is not a man simply accepts these flaws and expects others to deal with them because that’s “who he is.” Whereas a man accepts these flaws but also understands that these flaws can be minimized thru sincere attempts at self-improvement. They will never be entirely removed, but they can become dormant to the point where we rarely see these flaws as the source of pain that we cause others because we A) rarely intentionally cause pain to others in the first place and B) we understand the nature of our defects.
Men face the fear that they have about themselves, namely the fear of acknowledging that we are not perfect, we are not all-powerful, we are not capable of doing everything ourselves and that sometimes we need to seek help from others. This attitude and willingness to face these sorts of fears can manifest itself in many positive ways in our relationships with those whom we love. And when this happens, you will be much more “manly” and people will notice. But you will not require that they TELL you that they notice.
Am I making any sense here or is this just sounding like a bunch of babble?[/quote]
No it makes very good sense… Dick Balls Cooper.
V
Youre not a man until you fuck a woman to death. You become a god if you a2m her upon death.
IMMORTAL
SQUATS AND MILK!
[quote]DickBag wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]DickBag wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.[/quote]
Well I think a highly insecure guy who doesnt think hes a man can be a man instantly if he does something that is bad ass.
therefore, insecurity doesnt make you less of a man. its ok to be insecure.
being shy and timid doesnt make you less of a man, actually, nothing makes you less of a man, really, because there is no such thing as absolute man.
So basically everyone should just look at themselves and identify what is good to bring to the table about what is man.
[/quote]
Of course it’s ok to be insecure. But I think if you are insecure about whether or not people perceive you as “manly” then you are probably not one. Insecurity about character defects is fine. But when the insecurity springs forth from a desire to improve one’s perception of you, rather than from a desire to remove the flaw in order to be of better service to others, this is an “unmanly” insecurity. Essentially it is the desire to be “manly” as a way to further feed one’s ego, rather than to be “manly” in an attempt to be a better man for the sake of others. Selfishness, self-will run riot and ego to the point of self-consumption are not the traits of a man, only the traits of someone who WANTS to be a man and will never be one.
It’s also ok to be egotistical to a certain extent. But it is important to understand the ways in which this can be a bad thing and to take certain steps to alleviate and/or reduce the negative impact this can have on one’s life. When someone is ego-driven, their actions are primarily based on serving themselves first, and anyone else second. This is not the sign of a man. It takes a man to really look at himself and understand what it is about him that he can work to improve so that he can be a better person to those around him. This requires rigid, harsh introspection and a willingness to ask whatever higher power it is that you believe in to remove these flaws, and it also requires a willingness to take the steps yourself to remove them.
Our personal flaws are part of what makes us who we are. But someone who is not a man simply accepts these flaws and expects others to deal with them because that’s “who he is.” Whereas a man accepts these flaws but also understands that these flaws can be minimized thru sincere attempts at self-improvement. They will never be entirely removed, but they can become dormant to the point where we rarely see these flaws as the source of pain that we cause others because we A) rarely intentionally cause pain to others in the first place and B) we understand the nature of our defects.
Men face the fear that they have about themselves, namely the fear of acknowledging that we are not perfect, we are not all-powerful, we are not capable of doing everything ourselves and that sometimes we need to seek help from others. This attitude and willingness to face these sorts of fears can manifest itself in many positive ways in our relationships with those whom we love. And when this happens, you will be much more “manly” and people will notice. But you will not require that they TELL you that they notice.
Am I making any sense here or is this just sounding like a bunch of babble?[/quote]
I agree with you. but what happens when some selfish ego driven maniac comes across as manly?
sometimes its percieved as manly and funny to be selfish and a piece of shit. maybe its a modern cultural thing, i don’t know but basically what i’m getting at, is while i like your definition of a man, and i agree with it, i still can’t help admiring and respecting the occasional nut job asshole who couldnt give two shits about respect and being of service to others, like tony montana from scar face.
See what im getting at? Basically, i like to not define these things because we will always miss something in the definition.
[/quote]
Someone like Tony Montana, while he certainly was quite a character and appeals to me on a very visceral level, was not really a “man” in the sense that I think the OP is looking to define. When we see someone like him and his image or the way we perceive him appeals to us, it doesn’t appeal to our sense of man, it appeals to us on a very egotistical level.
In a way, he is what we wish we could be, minus the consequences. But I don’t think any true “man” would strive to be like him given that someone like him is undoubtedly going to die violently, alone. Look at him: as “manly” as his behavior seemed, the bottom line is that when all was said and done his family hated him, his wife hated him, he literally had no friends whatsoever and his employer was out to get him. As evidenced by his quickly-spiraling drug abuse when the shit started to hit the fan with him, these downturns in his personal relations clearly didn’t sit well with him. So I would have to surmise that he really did give a fuck.
Society may present some version of this type of guy as the ideal “man’s man” or whatever, but this isn’t accurate. When you say society, you really just mean the media, and for me anyways, I’ll never let the media determine for me what my responsibilities as a man should be and what my motivations should be.
I think there are times in men’s lives (in everbody’s lives really, but men seem to have more inherent responsibility, especially men with children, laid at their feet) where we come to a fork in the road. One path is to take the action which may not satisfy us on a primal level right then and there but is still the right path to take because it leads us down a path that enables us to good for those we love. The other is a much simpler path that gives us what we want right now. Someone like Tony Montana constantly took this path and in many ways the media tries to convince us of the “manliness” of this path. Things like: drink this beer to be a man, drive this car, act this way, men don’t care, blah, blah, blah.
These are the hard decisions in life that we must make on a daily basis as men. They do not necessarily bring us personal satisfaction right away, but continue to take this harder path and the reward will be multifold later on down the road. People will begin to see a difference in you, they will look up to you for all the right reasons, you will become a person that others can depend on to do the right thing, they’ll want to be like you. And you won’t be worried about how you are perceived because you know that perception is just another word for ego. You will have real integrity and the way people view you won’t be in terms of what you have; it will be in terms of what you do.
Men take action, and men take action that is not designed to satisfy ourselves and our egos but rather to help others. I’m not saying that every single thing a “man” does is designed to help others, but when a man comes to that fork in the road, he takes the one that helps others and resists the urge to take the one that brings him personal satisfaction at the expense of others and himself. Genuine altruism may never exist, especially in people who believe in the concept of Heaven and Hell, but this may get you pretty close.
And by the way: what’s with everyone’s fascination with Tony Montana? He was a piece of shit criminal who got rich off of ruining the lives of others, he killed his best friend in a fit of (incestuous?) rage, and had zero redeeming qualities as a man. He may have come from nothing, but when all was said and done, he ended up with nothing of value aside from a boatload of cash, no meaningful relationships and then he was killed. His mother had to bury him and her daughter due to his selfishness. Is this “manly” behavior?
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]DickBag wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
[quote]DickBag wrote:
[quote]DBCooper wrote:
You know what makes a man? The one quality that is all-encompassing? Not worrying about what a makes a man is what makes you a man. You either are or you aren’t. You can try to be a better man for the benefit of your wife/GF/children/family/friends, but if you have to think about whether you are “man enough”, then you are only concerned with others’ image of yourself. It’s one thing to wonder “what can make me a better man?” but it’s entirely different to wonder what makes a man in the first place.[/quote]
Well I think a highly insecure guy who doesnt think hes a man can be a man instantly if he does something that is bad ass.
therefore, insecurity doesnt make you less of a man. its ok to be insecure.
being shy and timid doesnt make you less of a man, actually, nothing makes you less of a man, really, because there is no such thing as absolute man.
So basically everyone should just look at themselves and identify what is good to bring to the table about what is man.
[/quote]
Of course it’s ok to be insecure. But I think if you are insecure about whether or not people perceive you as “manly” then you are probably not one. Insecurity about character defects is fine. But when the insecurity springs forth from a desire to improve one’s perception of you, rather than from a desire to remove the flaw in order to be of better service to others, this is an “unmanly” insecurity.
Essentially it is the desire to be “manly” as a way to further feed one’s ego, rather than to be “manly” in an attempt to be a better man for the sake of others. Selfishness, self-will run riot and ego to the point of self-consumption are not the traits of a man, only the traits of someone who WANTS to be a man and will never be one.
It’s also ok to be egotistical to a certain extent. But it is important to understand the ways in which this can be a bad thing and to take certain steps to alleviate and/or reduce the negative impact this can have on one’s life. When someone is ego-driven, their actions are primarily based on serving themselves first, and anyone else second.
This is not the sign of a man. It takes a man to really look at himself and understand what it is about him that he can work to improve so that he can be a better person to those around him. This requires rigid, harsh introspection and a willingness to ask whatever higher power it is that you believe in to remove these flaws, and it also requires a willingness to take the steps yourself to remove them.
Our personal flaws are part of what makes us who we are. But someone who is not a man simply accepts these flaws and expects others to deal with them because that’s “who he is.” Whereas a man accepts these flaws but also understands that these flaws can be minimized thru sincere attempts at self-improvement.
They will never be entirely removed, but they can become dormant to the point where we rarely see these flaws as the source of pain that we cause others because we A) rarely intentionally cause pain to others in the first place and B) we understand the nature of our defects.
Men face the fear that they have about themselves, namely the fear of acknowledging that we are not perfect, we are not all-powerful, we are not capable of doing everything ourselves and that sometimes we need to seek help from others.
This attitude and willingness to face these sorts of fears can manifest itself in many positive ways in our relationships with those whom we love. And when this happens, you will be much more “manly” and people will notice. But you will not require that they TELL you that they notice.
Am I making any sense here or is this just sounding like a bunch of babble?[/quote]
I agree with you. but what happens when some selfish ego driven maniac comes across as manly?
sometimes its percieved as manly and funny to be selfish and a piece of shit. maybe its a modern cultural thing, i don’t know but basically what i’m getting at, is while i like your definition of a man, and i agree with it, i still can’t help admiring and respecting the occasional nut job asshole who couldnt give two shits about respect and being of service to others, like tony montana from scar face.
See what im getting at? Basically, i like to not define these things because we will always miss something in the definition.
[/quote]
Someone like Tony Montana, while he certainly was quite a character and appeals to me on a very visceral level, was not really a “man” in the sense that I think the OP is looking to define. When we see someone like him and his image or the way we perceive him appeals to us, it doesn’t appeal to our sense of man, it appeals to us on a very egotistical level.
In a way, he is what we wish we could be, minus the consequences. But I don’t think any true “man” would strive to be like him given that someone like him is undoubtedly going to die violently, alone. Look at him: as “manly” as his behavior seemed, the bottom line is that when all was said and done his family hated him, his wife hated him, he literally had no friends whatsoever and his employer was out to get him.
As evidenced by his quickly-spiraling drug abuse when the shit started to hit the fan with him, these downturns in his personal relations clearly didn’t sit well with him. So I would have to surmise that he really did give a fuck.
Society may present some version of this type of guy as the ideal “man’s man” or whatever, but this isn’t accurate. When you say society, you really just mean the media, and for me anyways, I’ll never let the media determine for me what my responsibilities as a man should be and what my motivations should be.
I think there are times in men’s lives (in everbody’s lives really, but men seem to have more inherent responsibility, especially men with children, laid at their feet) where we come to a fork in the road. One path is to take the action which may not satisfy us on a primal level right then and there but is still the right path to take because it leads us down a path that enables us to good for those we love.
The other is a much simpler path that gives us what we want right now. Someone like Tony Montana constantly took this path and in many ways the media tries to convince us of the “manliness” of this path. Things like: drink this beer to be a man, drive this car, act this way, men don’t care, blah, blah, blah.
These are the hard decisions in life that we must make on a daily basis as men. They do not necessarily bring us personal satisfaction right away, but continue to take this harder path and the reward will be multifold later on down the road.
People will begin to see a difference in you, they will look up to you for all the right reasons, you will become a person that others can depend on to do the right thing, they’ll want to be like you. And you won’t be worried about how you are perceived because you know that perception is just another word for ego. You will have real integrity and the way people view you won’t be in terms of what you have; it will be in terms of what you do.
Men take action, and men take action that is not designed to satisfy ourselves and our egos but rather to help others. I’m not saying that every single thing a “man” does is designed to help others, but when a man comes to that fork in the road, he takes the one that helps others and resists the urge to take the one that brings him personal satisfaction at the expense of others and himself. Genuine altruism may never exist, especially in people who believe in the concept of Heaven and Hell, but this may get you pretty close.
And by the way: what’s with everyone’s fascination with Tony Montana? He was a piece of shit criminal who got rich off of ruining the lives of others, he killed his best friend in a fit of (incestuous?) rage, and had zero redeeming qualities as a man.
He may have come from nothing, but when all was said and done, he ended up with nothing of value aside from a boatload of cash, no meaningful relationships and then he was killed. His mother had to bury him and her daughter due to his selfishness. Is this “manly” behavior?[/quote]
I wasn’t sure, but I’m beginning to think that post you made in SAMA about feigning respect and fucking seventeen-year olds was tongue-in-cheek.
I like that.
A little bit of both. The feigning respect thing was, but the rest was serious. Either way you look at it, that kid’s behavior would have been childlike to a certain extent. Rejecting a chick for ego’s sake pretty much is, and so is trying to bang everything that moves simply for the sake of banging everything that moves. But when you’re seventeen, you can’t be expected to “act like/be a man” so which route should he have taken? The one that gets his dick wet, obviously.
DickBag: Like I said, genuine altruism may never exist in anyone, so of course there is a bit of selfishness involved with trying to be moral and upstanding. But trying to be this way for the benefit of others is much more altruistic than any behavior of Tony Montana’s. There’s a major difference between self-improvement for the sake of being of benefit to others and for the sake of rectifying with yourself the way others perceive you.
And I would argue vociferously that Tony did indeed want people to like him, that he really did care about what others thought of him. He projected an image to those around him that said otherwise, but he basically was only projecting an image. It’s kind of like when people tell me, without provocation, that they don’t care what others think of them. When they tell me this, I know the opposite is much more true.
Remember the scene in the restaurant where his wife essentially makes a fool of him and he flips out? This scene is a clear betrayal of his feelings and his desire to be accepted by those people. He flips out in another attempt at bravado and disinterest in their view of him, but he clearly cares about how they see him. Everything he does is essentially an attempt to change people’s perception of him. He is so twisted and out of touch that he thinks his behavior is the way to gain this attention. The lavish spending and all that is hardly the sign of a man with a strong mind who does not require applause from others. If anything, he required the applause more than most and thought that this was the way to achieve that.
I understand that you think Tony Montana was a “masculine man”, but what defines masculinity in a man? Is it fearlessness? Success? Emotional strength? I would argue that all of these are prerequisites. But to me, the hardest part of being a man, the biggest fear to face (given what society accepts/expects of men) is to reject the notion that someone like Tony Montana is a “man” and to do some serious introspection and make legitimate attempts to improve one’s self, and to do so for unselfish reasons.
Try it. Write down every way in which you have hurt someone recently, write down why you did so and what part of you it affects. You’ll end up with a long list of your character defects coming out in many different ways. Make sincere apologies to these people and be completely honest with yourself throughout the process. Try to work on these character defects on a daily basis. If you believe in God or something like that, ask him to help you remove these flaws.
THIS is some scary shit, much scarier and harder to do than anything Tony Montana ever dealt with. I would argue that a noble man IS a masculine man because in many, many different societal situations, the noble road is not the popular road. Men make the right decision when faced with these choices.
Also, the fact that you refer to a fictional character is somewhat disturbing as well. I don’t look up to characters as an ideal way to live or as some sort of example of what a man is. That person doesn’t exist. If I had to choose a character who displays the real characteristics of a man, I’d be much more inclined to think of someone like Laurence Fishburne’s character in Boyz N the Hood. But people who want to look to a man for inspiration and so on should do so in reality.
[quote]Goodfellow wrote:
To the OP’s question:
Be yourself, stand up for those you love and what you believe in. Be polite, sensible and some determination and goal setting will go a long way as well.
You know, the stuff your dad taught you.[/quote]
Thanks, but I made this thread because my dad didn’t teach me shit… except how to end up in jail.