Although I consider myself a bit to the right by contemporary standards, I’m also pretty far left on a lot of social issues. So in relative terms I’m right of many left, but left of many right.
That being said, with news being what it is, I definitely hit the brakes a little when I see these types of things. There is no telling what the truth is anymore, and every single mole hill becomes a hill people are willing to die on.
And I still don’t trust Alabama. They’re just mean dirty fucks.
Assuming you’re responding to me, this is a lot like saying prisoners must be allowed to carry arms because of the Second Amendment.
I have a strong feeling that you know that is a terrible analogy on so many levels…
dna evidence doesn’t necessarily prove you did what you are accused of. It proves who the dna belongs or doesn’t belong to.
It moreso seems to be “the Christian prisoners get ‘guns’ therefore the other religions should as well”
Personally I think it should just be none of them. Someone being given the death penalty losing spiritual guidance at the end should be a bonus, regardless of their religion.
As a self-described conservative, I can only say I WANT to believe the explanation that this was simply procedural (the Ray filing was too late), but who the hell really knows. Like you, I’ve become extremely cynical.
Yeah. What if they did grant the request (to prevent an accusation of discrimination) at a cutoff point where a Christian would’ve been denied? Is there a history of meeting those requests that far gone, or not?
I mean the execution date is a date. If the arrangement hasn’t/can’t be made by the date, is that discrimination or just the way it is?
But, like I said earlier, I think we should just refrain from killing them in the first place.
Otherwise, maybe we should have a chance to be selected for executioner’s duty much like jury duty. Throw the switch, or whatever.
A Christian wouldn’t have had to worry about it. Alabama stations a Christian chaplain in it’s death Chambers by default
If the laws in place specifically allow for only Christian last rites, that seems like textbook discrimination.
In the case of Alabama, thats probably just how it is. It’s not like they go out of their way to disprove the number of southern stereotypes that are lobbed at them
Well, I guess I’m wondering how realistic is it to have Muslim or Buddhist chaplains on standby by default? What is that pool like to even draw from?
On standby? Probably not very likely. Most felons are christian in America.
I’m not sure why you’d need one permanently on standby though. Death sentence proceedings take years and years in nearly all cases.
Don’t know, but their chaplains have to be actual employees too from how I read it.
Yeah this is the legal basis for the religious discrimination. They’re not technically discriminating against religion, they just have staffing issues.
Lol.
To be clear this is about going INTO the chamber (not a prayer in the cell prior) with him, specifically. At which point the rule is that only an employee may enter.
If we’re claiming this was a violation of the First Amendment, then it doesn’t have anything to do with whether some are allowed to and some aren’t. The First and Second Amendments totally prohibit X and Y at some level of government.
That’s also the way I understand it.
I’m not claiming it’s a violation of the 1st Amendment. I think giving prisoners 1% of any religion is already a waste of taxpayer funds and violates separation of church and state.
I’m saying SCOTUS claimed it was a violation of the 1st Amendment.
Unfortunately, it seems they have decided this is one of those pesky things that requires timeliness in order to qualify for said rights. Imagine if other aspects of the justice system worked the same way. Due process? Shit man you lost that garbage. You shoulda asked for your lawyer 4 hours ago.
That’s the problem. The state can allow no spititual advisers or all spiritual advisers, but it can’t say some spiritual advisers and then cherry pick which ones.
By the way guys. Didn’t read the briefs, but isn’t this a 14th amendment (equal protection) issue?
I mean it’s less of a free exercise of religion and more of a state provided service… they have religious handholders on government salary for some people and not others.
I guess you could attack it from the CRA angle as well. If the Alabama prisons get federal funding.
Just thinking out loud.
It’s probably just catchier when BoR amendments are the ones being quoted as ignored.
The workaround would probably be that a prison population with access to Jesus is more docile. I’d bet they have numbers to back that up. For profit prison system wouldn’t give it to them without.
The fascinating thing about arguments brought before the Court (among many); is that cases can be argued before the SCOTUS (and have been) using different Constitution Statues as the basis of the argument.
One of the most famous that is still argued to this day is Roe v. Wade (which actually is a Privacy Decision):
“In its ruling, the court recognized for the first time that the constitutional right to privacy “is broad enough to encompass a woman’s decision whether or not to terminate her pregnancy” (Roe v. Wade, 1973)”.
That would make much more sense to me.