Thoughts on Probiotics?

Nutrition
21

[quote]PB Andy wrote:

[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:
Probiotics rock. Right now I’m taking New Chapter All-Flora. The first day I took it I noticed the cleanest shits ever, which is like, the best thing in the world. I believe it is best to take probiotics on an empty stomach.[/quote]

This is the exact product I was looking at. I take a couple other products from New Chapter and really respect the quality that they put into all of them.

Sounds like you would strongly recommended All-Flora? Any other tips than on an empty stomach?[/quote]
Yes, the probiotics I have used is All-Flora, and the Metagenics one that morepain posted about. Both are good. There’s also Jarro-Dophilus which I haven’t tried yet. Other than taking it on an empty stomach first thing in the morning, no other tips needed.[/quote]

I usually eat within 15 minutes of waking up. Do you think it would be best to take them before bed? or is it fine if I take them first thing when I wake up, and then eat 10 minutes after that?

22

[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:

[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:
Probiotics rock. Right now I’m taking New Chapter All-Flora. The first day I took it I noticed the cleanest shits ever, which is like, the best thing in the world. I believe it is best to take probiotics on an empty stomach.[/quote]

This is the exact product I was looking at. I take a couple other products from New Chapter and really respect the quality that they put into all of them.

Sounds like you would strongly recommended All-Flora? Any other tips than on an empty stomach?[/quote]
Yes, the probiotics I have used is All-Flora, and the Metagenics one that morepain posted about. Both are good. There’s also Jarro-Dophilus which I haven’t tried yet. Other than taking it on an empty stomach first thing in the morning, no other tips needed.[/quote]

I usually eat within 15 minutes of waking up. Do you think it would be best to take them before bed? or is it fine if I take them first thing when I wake up, and then eat 10 minutes after that?
[/quote]
Morning would still be best I think. You can really eat 15 mins after you wake-up? Damn. Sometimes I need a good 1-2 hours before I’m actually hungry.

23

[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:
Do you think it would be best to take them before bed? or is it fine if I take them first thing when I wake up, and then eat 10 minutes after that?[/quote] Most gastro-enterologists I spoke to advised me to take probiotics with dinner, preferably towards the end of the meal, or immediately after the meal.

They also suggested that i took my zinc supp with that meal (dinner), or find a probiotic formula that contains zinc (…don’t know why they suggested that).

Most probiotic formulas I’ve tried with an empty stomach gave me diarrhea.

24

[quote]tolismann wrote:

[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:
Do you think it would be best to take them before bed? or is it fine if I take them first thing when I wake up, and then eat 10 minutes after that?[/quote] Most gastro-enterologists I spoke to advised me to take probiotics with dinner, preferably towards the end of the meal, or immediately after the meal.

They also suggested that i took my zinc supp with that meal (dinner), or find a probiotic formula that contains zinc (…don’t know why they suggested that).

Most probiotic formulas I’ve tried with an empty stomach gave me diarrhea.
[/quote]

I usually finish dinner around 7, so I could just take them at 9.

It’s either 9PM after eating dinner at 7PM

or

5AM, and then eating breakfast at 5:15AM…

25

Just found this:

"Francine Mondou, a microbiologist who specializes in manufacturing probiotics, suggests that it is optimal to take probiotics on a full stomach.

Her reasoning is based on the fact that an empty stomach has a very acidic environment - a pH of about 1.5 to 2.5. Right after a meal, the environment in the stomach becomes less acidic, rising to a pH of about 4.0 to 6.0.

In general, probiotic strains are able to survive for at least two hours in a gastric environment with a pH of 4.0. Ergo, taking probiotics on a full stomach increases the likelihood of the friendly bacterial strains surviving through the acidic environment of your stomach and reaching your intestines, where they can provide several health promoting effects."

Thoughts? The New Chapter website, however, recommends taking them on an empty stomach, so I might just go with that since that will be the product I’m utilizing.

26

I know i have not provided the evidence BUT i see a doctor who is a compounding pharmacist he works with a lot of big names and professional athletes. He also reports to supplement companies with the latest on the highest quality products, its basically his job to know what makes a product superior and he is also extremely well versed in the sciences of the body.

He told me the best available is Xymogen Probiomax, its atleast 100 billion flora and the strains used have shown to be the most effective, it is not effected by stomach acid and is actually a good idea to take with food or fiber to give the bacteria something to feed on.

You can take a look into the strains if your that interested, i have not had the time but he’s an honest man and not trying to sell me anything.

27

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
If you would like to save money – as the above product is NOT cheap – I’d suggest using it as a seed culture for ultrapasteurized milk. In other words, use one capsule (it wouldn’t even take that much: a half capsule would be enough) to inoculate an amount of milk that you’d find suitable for a week’s worth of dosing. Simply open the ultrapasteurized milk container, add the content of the capsule, reclose the container, leave out for 12-24 hours, and refrigerate.

I mean, this product costs $5 a capsule. For bacteria that cost them essentially nothing. (There is expense in the refrigeration, to be sure, but… )

I am glad that it works well for you, but would like to see you able to do it a lower cost.

As to whether ongoing use is needed, it would depend on whether these strains in your individual GI tract outcompete other bacteria. Probably not I think, and so ongoing reinforcement would be needed for continued effect. The reason I think probably not is that if they did outcompete other bacteria, then a single at-all-recent exposure to these bacteria would have sufficed.[/quote]

I’m sorry Bill, could you clarify? ‘ultrapasteurized’- does that mean pasteurised/ UHT (Ultra Heat Treated) or is it something else? My milk jargon is pretty poor :slight_smile:

And are you saying that if you took one probiotic capsule, and emptied the contents into 1 litre of that milk, and then drank this throughout the week, the culture would grow in the milk to the extent that each 1/7 milk would rival or exceed the amount of bacteria you would have got from that one capsule?
Thanks

28

[quote]dannyrat wrote:
I’m sorry Bill, could you clarify? ‘ultrapasteurized’- does that mean pasteurised/ UHT (Ultra Heat Treated) or is it something else? My milk jargon is pretty poor :slight_smile:

And are you saying that if you took one probiotic capsule, and emptied the contents into 1 litre of that milk, and then drank this throughout the week, the culture would grow in the milk to the extent that each 1/7 milk would rival or exceed the amount of bacteria you would have got from that one capsule?
Thanks[/quote]

It’s pretty much how kefir is made.

I’m actually torn between trying Bill’s idea and just making some kefir. For some mysterious reason I couldn’t find kefir in a normal supermarket, just in a health food shop, and it was ridiculously expensive. In Poland you can get it everywhere and it’s dirt cheap…

29

[quote]dannyrat wrote:
I’m sorry Bill, could you clarify? ‘ultrapasteurized’- does that mean pasteurised/ UHT (Ultra Heat Treated) or is it something else? My milk jargon is pretty poor :slight_smile:

And are you saying that if you took one probiotic capsule, and emptied the contents into 1 litre of that milk, and then drank this throughout the week, the culture would grow in the milk to the extent that each 1/7 milk would rival or exceed the amount of bacteria you would have got from that one capsule?
Thanks[/quote]

It’s pretty much how kefir is made.

I’m actually torn between trying Bill’s idea and just making some kefir. For some mysterious reason I couldn’t find kefir in a normal supermarket, just in a health food shop, and it was ridiculously expensive. In Poland you can get it everywhere and it’s dirt cheap…

30

[quote]PB Andy wrote:

[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:

[quote]WestCoast7 wrote:

[quote]PB Andy wrote:
Probiotics rock. Right now I’m taking New Chapter All-Flora. The first day I took it I noticed the cleanest shits ever, which is like, the best thing in the world. I believe it is best to take probiotics on an empty stomach.[/quote]

This is the exact product I was looking at. I take a couple other products from New Chapter and really respect the quality that they put into all of them.

Sounds like you would strongly recommended All-Flora? Any other tips than on an empty stomach?[/quote]
Yes, the probiotics I have used is All-Flora, and the Metagenics one that morepain posted about. Both are good. There’s also Jarro-Dophilus which I haven’t tried yet. Other than taking it on an empty stomach first thing in the morning, no other tips needed.[/quote]

I usually eat within 15 minutes of waking up. Do you think it would be best to take them before bed? or is it fine if I take them first thing when I wake up, and then eat 10 minutes after that?
[/quote]
Morning would still be best I think. You can really eat 15 mins after you wake-up? Damn. Sometimes I need a good 1-2 hours before I’m actually hungry.[/quote]

Yea. I wake up at 5AM and am usually eating by 5:10-5:15 (cook my breakfast the night before).

If I don’t eat within 30 minutes, I go into full T-Rex mode.

31

[quote]dannyrat wrote:

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
If you would like to save money – as the above product is NOT cheap – I’d suggest using it as a seed culture for ultrapasteurized milk. In other words, use one capsule (it wouldn’t even take that much: a half capsule would be enough) to inoculate an amount of milk that you’d find suitable for a week’s worth of dosing. Simply open the ultrapasteurized milk container, add the content of the capsule, reclose the container, leave out for 12-24 hours, and refrigerate.

I mean, this product costs $5 a capsule. For bacteria that cost them essentially nothing. (There is expense in the refrigeration, to be sure, but… )

I am glad that it works well for you, but would like to see you able to do it a lower cost.

As to whether ongoing use is needed, it would depend on whether these strains in your individual GI tract outcompete other bacteria. Probably not I think, and so ongoing reinforcement would be needed for continued effect. The reason I think probably not is that if they did outcompete other bacteria, then a single at-all-recent exposure to these bacteria would have sufficed.[/quote]

I’m sorry Bill, could you clarify? ‘ultrapasteurized’- does that mean pasteurised/ UHT (Ultra Heat Treated) or is it something else? My milk jargon is pretty poor :slight_smile:

And are you saying that if you took one probiotic capsule, and emptied the contents into 1 litre of that milk, and then drank this throughout the week, the culture would grow in the milk to the extent that each 1/7 milk would rival or exceed the amount of bacteria you would have got from that one capsule?
Thanks[/quote]

Ultrapasteurization is a process where the milk is actually sterilized, as opposed to having the bacterial count very greatly reduced. It’s sold on the supermarket shelf rather than in the dairy cooler.

I suppose one could use pasteurized milk as well, but I’d have a little more concern about leaving it at room temperature for 24 hours. If having to use pasteurized milk, I’d limit the time at room temperature to say 8 hours. This would still allow the bacteria from the probiotic to multiply through a number of generations.

32

[quote]BiP wrote:

[quote]dannyrat wrote:
I’m sorry Bill, could you clarify? ‘ultrapasteurized’- does that mean pasteurised/ UHT (Ultra Heat Treated) or is it something else? My milk jargon is pretty poor :slight_smile:

And are you saying that if you took one probiotic capsule, and emptied the contents into 1 litre of that milk, and then drank this throughout the week, the culture would grow in the milk to the extent that each 1/7 milk would rival or exceed the amount of bacteria you would have got from that one capsule?
Thanks[/quote]

It’s pretty much how kefir is made.

I’m actually torn between trying Bill’s idea and just making some kefir. For some mysterious reason I couldn’t find kefir in a normal supermarket, just in a health food shop, and it was ridiculously expensive. In Poland you can get it everywhere and it’s dirt cheap…[/quote]

Indeed, the price is high. I’ve thought about making homemade kefir, using the bacteria sold for that purpose. I enjoy it and it would be worth doing. Just haven’t gotten around to it.

I don’t know whether the particular strains in the $150 product are better for the purpose than those typically used in kefir, or not. I wouldn’t have high confidence that they are, but I wouldn’t rule it out either. Using the capsules would guarantee getting the same strains of bacteria.

33

I wont be pulling out any references, but from personal experience, probiotics and digestive enzymes did miracles for me. **Disclaimer for the rest. For about two years I had digestive problems where I couldn’t take a dump for two to three days and they would require a plunger on a regular basis. I incorporated digestive enzymes and probiotics and that cleared up the problem within weeks. I dont even have to take them anymore and I havent had this issue for over two years now. I do eat a lot of yogurt now however.

34

For those who aren’t able to tolerate dairy, kefir water is a great option. You get the granules (different from the granules used with dairy), add water, sugar, flavoring if needed (i use an unsulphered apricot, lemon/lime and ginger) and let it ferment for a couple of days. It’s tasty, cheap and you can reuse the granules indefinitely (to my knowledge).

35

I’d recommend unpasturised sauerkraut. You can buy it or it’s really easy to make. It’s a fantastic pre and probiotic.

I think probiotics are a must, there’s a whole lot of scientific evidence around supporting a strong correlation between good gut health and good body composition

36

Agree with making your own sauerkraut. VERY easy to make. Far more available good bacteria then a supplement and far cheaper and tastier. I always just “feel better” when I up my consumption of kraut - can’t really quantify it.

37

Great bump, I’ve certainly learned a thing or two since my earlier post:

-whole foods sources are best (goes without saying)

-kefir, kimchi, sauerkraut, kombucha etc

-processed yogurt products are no longer on my list of viable sources

-kefir is hands-down best source, in my experience

38

Mind elaborating on why? I love me some Greek yogurt, but is it good from a probiotic stand point?

39

This is a fascinating topic.Specifically the “do-it-yourself” guides.

I’m interested in doing this but can it be done with regular milk from the grocery store?

My only other option is making my own kefir. Anyone done that and how time consuming is it? Is it dangerous? Thanks.

40

@SargeMaximus Making Kefir is simple and can be made with milk from the shops. It’s not dangerous, all you need is some kefir grains, milk and a little time (is not very time consuming at all). There are lots of guides online about how to do it.