Question for you guys: mentioned above that overtraining is a cause of low T…Spring of 2012 I was on a cutting diet (12wk plan laid out by well know BB’r/trainer), low carb, fasted steady-state cardio in the am, and weight training. midway through, ~wk 6, I got blood work done (side note, at the time of the blood work i was complaining to my trainer of all the symptoms of low T but at the time didn’t know they were symptoms of low T just thought they were due to his diet/training protocol).
Blood work came back with sub 200 T. Went on to Uro who reviewed labs and did his own labs and started me on TRT. Question is, could this have been a misdiagnosis and simply just been from ‘overtraining’ or would the blood work have confirmed hypogonadism even in the presence of said potential ‘overtraining’ condition? Recently had T levels rechecked after ~9 months of biweekly injections of T-enanthelate and it was ~1200+. thoughts?
Perhaps you could have recovered. But in the absence of any data, cannot say more.
See the advice for new guys sticky. If you want to pursue this further, start your own thread and post your labs and details. This is not the place for that.
I don’t know where to ask so I will ask in some places and when I get answered I will delete
I’d like to know if fixing thyroid issues the pituitary will release more hormones like LH, FSH, ACTH. Because I saw many guys saying once they fixed their cortisol deficiency the RT3 decreased, the TSH decreased too (without thyroid meds), LH and FSH increased so their testosterone, E2 and thyroid became better.
So my question is when free t3 really reach the body cells does it increase the pituitary function? Can it increase also the ACTH? Because I want to go to HC treatment due to low cortisol but I don’t want to stay on it for life.
TSH:3.5
T4 1.2 (range 0.8 - 1.7)
T3 3.3 sometimes 3.6 (range 2.4 - 3.7)
Cortisol Am - 95 (range 100 - 640)
ACTH - I have two tests one is 14 and the other 32 (range until 46 pg/mL)
To be clear. I’d like to know if T3 can help the HPTA function better like sending more hormones when necessary etc.
Please leave your above post intact so there is context for this.
I have described some of this recently on someone’s case thread. It will be good to discuss this here.
When thyroid levels are low, all cells are affected and thus the function of tissues and organs will be degraded. At the level of your percieved state of well being and quality of life [QOL], you can feel like crap in many ways. Energy levels go down, initiative goes down, libido sucks, skin, nails and hair my be degraded, body temperatures drop etc. But there are things going on below the level of one’s awareness. If you have hypothyroidism to some degree, one should have an expectation that the other organs that support other hormone systems will suffer as well.
So to answer your question, yes, hypothyroidism will affect your other hormone symptoms. And we know that hypothyroidism can lower thyroid levels as well. You might consider the three major hormone systems, sex hormones and other steroid hormones, adrenal hormones and thyroid hormones as a tripod as an analogy. You need all three to be strong and stable. But consider that a weakness in one hormone system can not only create its own weaknesses, it can weaken the other systems as well.
You can get into a situation where all three are bad, where there can be a tendency such things to create a self perpetuating decline where a bad state makes things progressively worse.
Some situations are messy and complicated by other problems and medications. But take an example of a young man who has a significant thyroid problem and his T levels have declined, adding to his spectrum and depth of symptoms. Behind all of this is a guy who has a young body and hidden vitality. Get this guy on thyroid meds and many symptoms are resolved, and his T levels can rebound to whatever his potential was. Does this happen all of the time? no
In the above post, it was asked if [added] T3 might be helpful:
yes if fT3 is low
yes if rT3 is causing problems, enough is needed to suppress T4 production for a
otherwise there is probably no benefit
Treatment of ‘adrenal fatigue’ is out of scope for this posting. For that, I always direct to reading of Wilson’s book on that.
I think I’m not making myself clear. I’d like to know if fixing RT3 with for example iron, cortisol, b12, and with HC to adrenal fatigue. The body T3 when is high will make some benefit to HPTA. Because I see many doing this and with this things their LH, FSH, Testosterone increased. So I’d like to know when TSH decrease, RT3 is clear, then T3 goes to the cells, this process can make more LH and FSH but I’d like to know if that can make more ACTH too. Because I have adrenal fatigue and sometimes I have low ACTH and sometimes a little bit higher in brazilian units I will also do another cortisol saliva test tomorrow. But I’d like to know how to wean off of HC without returning the symptons.
To resume I’d like to know if ACTH can increase if the person has enough T3 in his system, like it happens with LH and FSH.
Stopping HC suddenly can be dangerous, always taper off so your body has time to try to pick up the load.
As for the other question(s): I think that you are reading too much into this. Make the changes that you want and see how you feel and where the labs go. There is so much individual variation in these things that you can’t get very far with theoretical issues.
Do what you can that might improve your adrenal recovery. Again, all of the major hormone systems affect each other. So you need to do what you can for these systems.
The many so called “Men’s formula” multivitamins that contain Saw Palmetto. There is no evidence that healthy men should take a DHT-inhibiting drug like S.P. daily to be healthy.
Things that damage your hormones, hmmmm i am thinking about junk food or soda? I mean it is bad for us already but is it bad for our hormon…? For example, kids who ate junk food will produce a lot of hormon rather than usual teens right?
Junk food that makes one fat will tend to increase estrogens that then decrease total testosterone and free testosterone. Higher estrogens increase SHBG that then reduces free testosterone fraction of total testosterone. Estrogens also physically interfere with the mechanics of free testosterone docking in androgen receptors. Then there is the cascade of problems stemming from insulin resistance.
Another huge one that nobody has mentioned, and one that has impacted me in a big way throughout life, is INFECTION.
In my case, dental infection(s) - abscesses, but even more than that - failed root canals. As a matter of fact, all endodontically-treated teeth should be considered failures from the start, as infection always remains, though often sub-clinical for many years. Refer to the book, The Root Canal Cover-Up for more on this.
Congenitally-bad teeth, my own negligence, and ‘dental malpractice’ at the level of the American Dental Association… have screwed up my life like nothing else.
With such situations, there is a lot of stress on the adrenals, read up on ‘adrenal fatigue’. Cortisol can be low and rT3 up which blocks fT3 and creates low thyroid function.
In re to narcotics, while methadone does damage to testosterone, it’s more common to be prescribed vicodin, percoset, and related drugs.
Both of these drugs taken long term (whether addicted or not) can do significant damage. I found out the hard due to taking Oxycontin and percoset for a blown shoulder pre and post operation for nearly 3 years. when i tested for Testosterone levels, it was 90.66. I did some research
and found that percs and oxy do the most damage because they’re most commonly prescribed medication.
Where have you found research showing specifically that oxycontin does the most damage to the endocrine system? I would love to be able to read up on that and not that just opiates cause problems. Windowwasher I think the endocrine system being really messed up probably causes a lot of dental problems of which I also have found out the last few years from E2 being high and Vit D deficiantcies etc.
Propecia / Proscar (finasteride) used for male pattern baldness and/or enlarged prostate, may seriously mess up testosterone, DHT, and other hormone levels.
Note: “post finasteride syndrome”
EDIT: my bad, didn’t see “hair loss drugs” already listed in KSman’s OP
Bromines can talk up locations in the body were iodine would normally be present. In the thyroid basics sticky, I discuss how iodine replenishment can displace bromines and may one feel off during that process, which can make one stink. One guy here had that happen.