The World Turns to Bush and America

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
21

[quote]snipeout wrote:
Alot of the world rallies around pointing out the EVIL that is America to deflect the REAL EVIL going on in there countries. [/quote]

I’m glad you pointed that out. Oppressing your own people is no different than oppressing other people. But on the international scene, the US sticks out as the bully because it killed Vietnamians, Cubans and Iraqis.

China oppressing Chinese or Russia oppressing Russians draws little attention because they don’t go around bombing other countries. Tibet is another story…

Here’s a good read about “anti-Americanism” around the world.

http://www.medialens.org/alerts/07/070508_the_shining_city.php

22

[quote]karva wrote:
He has pushed the democratic development in Russia backward, not Russias economy. Russian middle class is now wealthier that it has ever been. You don’t see it there, but here in Finland and also elsewhere in Europe you can see it clearly. Russians like to travel and they have money to spend.[/quote]

I don’t think you meant middle class there. Anyway, the gap between the rich and the poor is SCARY in Russia.

I’m divided between blaming Putin or capitalism. I think I’ll go with Putin though.

23

[quote]karva wrote:
Ren wrote:
Putin is a plague on this world, he has pushed Russia back at least a decade.

I think we are all aware that China is the biggest human rights’ abuser in the world.

He has pushed the democratic development in Russia backward, not Russias economy. Russian middle class is now wealthier that it has ever been. You don’t see it there, but here in Finland and also elsewhere in Europe you can see it clearly. Russians like to travel and they have money to spend.[/quote]

That’s not middle class. Middle class in a country like Russia would be people owning their own house and car. They wouldn’t travel abroad and spend their money there.
The people you’re talking about is upper class and organised crime flashing their drug money.

24

[quote]snipeout wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
snipeout wrote:
…

Yeah and with Russias’ great track record for human rights and free society they should be comparing us to Nazi Germany… How long has it been since they gassed a theater full of their own people to conquer a few Chechen rebels? Funny an ex-KGB agent comparing the US to Nazis.

Putin is an evil man.

I agree, but that’s not the point. The point was that Putin doesn’t support Bush. He’s a leader in a long line of leaders that doesn’t support Bush. That’s what this thread is about.

I know my pinion doesn’t count for much , but if Putin doesn’t support Bush it doesn’t really matter to me. Thats like saying Kim whatever his name is in North Korea doesn’t support us or that bumbling retard from Iran, Syria or for that matter China.

Alot of the world rallies around pointing out the EVIL that is America to deflect the REAL EVIL going on in there countries. Do the numerous human rights and weapon treaty violations of these countries have to rehashed?

Do I think the U.S. is perfect? Nope. Do I think we are leaps and bounds above most everyone else? Damn straight! [/quote]

I agree with you on some points, but that’s not relevant. This threads title is “The World Turns to Bush and America.”

So when we point out important leaders that are not only not supporting the US or Bush, but are clearly hostile, you can’t simply shrug them off with: “well, we don’t care about him that much.”

But perhaps HH can provide us with a list of Bush supporters?

25

[quote]lixy wrote:
snipeout wrote:
Alot of the world rallies around pointing out the EVIL that is America to deflect the REAL EVIL going on in there countries.

I’m glad you pointed that out. Oppressing your own people is no different than oppressing other people. But on the international scene, the US sticks out as the bully because it killed Vietnamians, Cubans and Iraqis.

China oppressing Chinese or Russia oppressing Russians draws little attention because they don’t go around bombing other countries. Tibet is another story…

Here’s a good read about “anti-Americanism” around the world.

http://www.medialens.org/alerts/07/070508_the_shining_city.php[/quote]

What your saying is then that it is o.k. to kill MILLIONS of people as long as they are your own? What Cubans have we physically killed?

26

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
snipeout wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
snipeout wrote:
…

Yeah and with Russias’ great track record for human rights and free society they should be comparing us to Nazi Germany… How long has it been since they gassed a theater full of their own people to conquer a few Chechen rebels? Funny an ex-KGB agent comparing the US to Nazis.

Putin is an evil man.

I agree, but that’s not the point. The point was that Putin doesn’t support Bush. He’s a leader in a long line of leaders that doesn’t support Bush. That’s what this thread is about.

I know my pinion doesn’t count for much , but if Putin doesn’t support Bush it doesn’t really matter to me. Thats like saying Kim whatever his name is in North Korea doesn’t support us or that bumbling retard from Iran, Syria or for that matter China.

Alot of the world rallies around pointing out the EVIL that is America to deflect the REAL EVIL going on in there countries. Do the numerous human rights and weapon treaty violations of these countries have to rehashed?

Do I think the U.S. is perfect? Nope. Do I think we are leaps and bounds above most everyone else? Damn straight!

I agree with you on some points, but that’s not relevant. This threads title is “The World Turns to Bush and America.”

So when we point out important leaders that are not only not supporting the US or Bush, but are clearly hostile, you can’t simply shrug them off with: “well, we don’t care about him that much.”

But perhaps HH can provide us with a list of Bush supporters?[/quote]

I was trying to counter by saying who really cares what a bunch of murderous immoral excuses for human beings support or don’t support. If you wanted to argue humane rational governments that is fine.

27

[quote]Ren wrote:
karva wrote:
Ren wrote:
Putin is a plague on this world, he has pushed Russia back at least a decade.

I think we are all aware that China is the biggest human rights’ abuser in the world.

He has pushed the democratic development in Russia backward, not Russias economy. Russian middle class is now wealthier that it has ever been. You don’t see it there, but here in Finland and also elsewhere in Europe you can see it clearly. Russians like to travel and they have money to spend.

Yeah, I was talking about democracy and people’s rights. As well as research institutions and the press. Their economy is doing great though. How are the women in Finland btw? My friends and I are contemplating a scandinavian trip in the future…[/quote]

Well, I have heard many compliments about finnish and swedish girls, I like them. Ask lixy what he thinks.

28

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
karva wrote:
Ren wrote:
Putin is a plague on this world, he has pushed Russia back at least a decade.

I think we are all aware that China is the biggest human rights’ abuser in the world.

He has pushed the democratic development in Russia backward, not Russias economy. Russian middle class is now wealthier that it has ever been. You don’t see it there, but here in Finland and also elsewhere in Europe you can see it clearly. Russians like to travel and they have money to spend.

That’s not middle class. Middle class in a country like Russia would be people owning their own house and car. They wouldn’t travel abroad and spend their money there.
The people you’re talking about is upper class and organised crime flashing their drug money.
[/quote]

No, I mean middle class, middle middle to upper middle. There is much more going on in Russia than drugdealing. And yes, there are a lot of poor people, but Russian middle class is traveling more than ever before.

29

When I see France of all places elect a pro-American, it makes sense to think of a slight change in the air. The civilised countries are awakening to the plans for global domination by Islam, which America became aware of first.

Guess some of these other countries around the world are full of slow learners.

BTW Wreckless, if Belgium elects a pro-American leader, will you move out of the country?

30

[quote]snipeout wrote:
What your saying is then that it is o.k. to kill MILLIONS of people as long as they are your own? [/quote]

I never said that. Read more carefully. Here’s what I wrote:

“Oppressing your own people is no different than oppressing other people.”

There is no difference morally or from a humanitarian point of view. But let’s face it, if your own house is a mess people won’t mind so much. If, on the other hand, you go around trashing other people’s houses, chances are that you will be instantly labelled as a bully or some other derogatory term.

Depends how far back you wanna go? If we stick to post WWII, you killed 5000 Cubans in '61 during the ill-fated bay of pigs according to Grayston Lynch. You also had terrorists on the CIA pay-roll, one of which blew up a Cuban commercial airplane in '76 killing all passengers. Aboard the plane was the Cuban Olypimc fencing team who was on their way home with gold medals. The US is harbouring said terrorist and is, in violation of international law, refusing to extradite or prosecute him.

31

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
When I see France of all places elect a pro-American, it makes sense to think of a slight change in the air. The civilised countries are awakening to the plans for global domination by Islam, which America became aware of first.

Guess some of these other countries around the world are full of slow learners.

BTW Wreckless, if Belgium elects a pro-American leader, will you move out of the country?[/quote]

So your going to completely ignore the page of evidence stating he didn’t get elected because he was pro-American? That he played down his pro-American side big time as the election approached?

You know Royal was harsher on Islam than their newest President right? You know that just because Lixy says something, doesn’t make it wrong, especially if it’s not opinion, but fact?

32

[quote]Beowolf wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
When I see France of all places elect a pro-American, it makes sense to think of a slight change in the air. The civilised countries are awakening to the plans for global domination by Islam, which America became aware of first.

Guess some of these other countries around the world are full of slow learners.

BTW Wreckless, if Belgium elects a pro-American leader, will you move out of the country?

So your going to completely ignore the page of evidence stating he didn’t get elected because he was pro-American? That he played down his pro-American side big time as the election approached?

You know Royal was harsher on Islam than their newest President right? You know that just because Lixy says something, doesn’t make it wrong, especially if it’s not opinion, but fact?
[/quote]

As far as HH is concerned, if he said 1 nice thing ever about GWB he is pro-Bush. You could poll every voter in France and when every one that voted for the new president does not mention his stance on America and Dubya as the reason they voted for him, he will still say the French people want a pro-American leader.

HH, you think the French people have more important national issues to deal with than whether or not their president likes us?

33

[quote]snipeout wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
snipeout wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
Zap Branigan wrote:
snipeout wrote:
…

Yeah and with Russias’ great track record for human rights and free society they should be comparing us to Nazi Germany… How long has it been since they gassed a theater full of their own people to conquer a few Chechen rebels? Funny an ex-KGB agent comparing the US to Nazis.

Putin is an evil man.

I agree, but that’s not the point. The point was that Putin doesn’t support Bush. He’s a leader in a long line of leaders that doesn’t support Bush. That’s what this thread is about.

I know my pinion doesn’t count for much , but if Putin doesn’t support Bush it doesn’t really matter to me. Thats like saying Kim whatever his name is in North Korea doesn’t support us or that bumbling retard from Iran, Syria or for that matter China.

Alot of the world rallies around pointing out the EVIL that is America to deflect the REAL EVIL going on in there countries. Do the numerous human rights and weapon treaty violations of these countries have to rehashed?

Do I think the U.S. is perfect? Nope. Do I think we are leaps and bounds above most everyone else? Damn straight!

I agree with you on some points, but that’s not relevant. This threads title is “The World Turns to Bush and America.”

So when we point out important leaders that are not only not supporting the US or Bush, but are clearly hostile, you can’t simply shrug them off with: “well, we don’t care about him that much.”

But perhaps HH can provide us with a list of Bush supporters?

I was trying to counter by saying who really cares what a bunch of murderous immoral excuses for human beings support or don’t support. If you wanted to argue humane rational governments that is fine. [/quote]

Is that your way of saying that you don’t agree with HH, that there’s no alliance. That there’s not much support for Bush out there.
If that’s what you mean, why not simply say it?

34

[quote]karva wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
karva wrote:
Ren wrote:
Putin is a plague on this world, he has pushed Russia back at least a decade.

I think we are all aware that China is the biggest human rights’ abuser in the world.

He has pushed the democratic development in Russia backward, not Russias economy. Russian middle class is now wealthier that it has ever been. You don’t see it there, but here in Finland and also elsewhere in Europe you can see it clearly. Russians like to travel and they have money to spend.

That’s not middle class. Middle class in a country like Russia would be people owning their own house and car. They wouldn’t travel abroad and spend their money there.
The people you’re talking about is upper class and organised crime flashing their drug money.

No, I mean middle class, middle middle to upper middle. There is much more going on in Russia than drugdealing. And yes, there are a lot of poor people, but Russian middle class is traveling more than ever before.[/quote]

You mean they make the kind of money that would put the in upper middle class in Finland.
Trust me, they’re upper upper class in Russia.
Nouveau riche and organised crime.
There really is no middle class in Russia. There never is in countries like these.

35

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
When I see France of all places elect a pro-American, it makes sense to think of a slight change in the air. The civilised countries are awakening to the plans for global domination by Islam, which America became aware of first.

Guess some of these other countries around the world are full of slow learners.

BTW Wreckless, if Belgium elects a pro-American leader, will you move out of the country?[/quote]

Yeah, I’ll move over to the US, exercise my right to bear arms and buy myself a nice sniper rifle.

Back to the facts HH. Do you really think that France and Germany will ever commit troops to Iraq? I’m just trying to fathom how big a fool you really are here.
So, French and German troops in Iraq any time soon you think?
I know you guys don’t like timeframes, but what, end of the year perhaps?

36

[quote]Ken Kaniff wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
Even though many people rip on GWB (as do I), it appears that they secretly support him!

Youre reading to many Ann Coultergeist “columns”.

How on earth can anyone be so pathetic to buy her bullshit, ill never understand it…[/quote]

Trust me. Its not that hard to understand.

Just think that most average people are sheep and need to be told what to do.

37

[quote]lixy wrote:
…
You also had terrorists on the CIA pay-roll, one of which blew up a Cuban commercial airplane in '76 killing all passengers. Aboard the plane was the Cuban Olypimc fencing team who was on their way home with gold medals. The US is harbouring said terrorist and is, in violation of international law, refusing to extradite or prosecute him.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cubana_Flight_455[/quote]

What are you saying lixy? The US is supporting international terrorism? This can’t be true?
The straight talking cowboy is harboring terrorists? People who kill innocent civilians?

Me, speaking for myself personally, I’m appalled ! ! !

Ok, I’m appalled by the fact that some people are so very stupid they think they can claim the US never killed Cubans. But I’m appalled none-the-less.

Snipeout, do me a favor will you? Next time when there’s an election, either you don’t vote, or perhaps you should read up on certain things. You’re hurting democracy when you’re a stupid fuck and vote. So you either don’t vote, or you grow a brain. Ok?

38

[quote]Beowolf wrote:
Headhunter wrote:
When I see France of all places elect a pro-American, it makes sense to think of a slight change in the air. The civilised countries are awakening to the plans for global domination by Islam, which America became aware of first.

Guess some of these other countries around the world are full of slow learners.

BTW Wreckless, if Belgium elects a pro-American leader, will you move out of the country?

So your going to completely ignore the page of evidence stating he didn’t get elected because he was pro-American? That he played down his pro-American side big time as the election approached?

You know Royal was harsher on Islam than their newest President right? You know that just because Lixy says something, doesn’t make it wrong, especially if it’s not opinion, but fact?
[/quote]

He has to ignore the evidence. How else can he convince himself that the people he believes in are right?

39

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
lixy wrote:
…
You also had terrorists on the CIA pay-roll, one of which blew up a Cuban commercial airplane in '76 killing all passengers. Aboard the plane was the Cuban Olypimc fencing team who was on their way home with gold medals. The US is harbouring said terrorist and is, in violation of international law, refusing to extradite or prosecute him.

What are you saying lixy? The US is supporting international terrorism? This can’t be true?
The straight talking cowboy is harboring terrorists? People who kill innocent civilians?

Me, speaking for myself personally, I’m appalled ! ! !

Ok, I’m appalled by the fact that some people are so very stupid they think they can claim the US never killed Cubans. But I’m appalled none-the-less.

Snipeout, do me a favor will you? Next time when there’s an election, either you don’t vote, or perhaps you should read up on certain things. Your hurting democracy when you’re a stupid fuck and vote. So you either don’t vote, or you grow a brain. Ok?[/quote]

Here we go with the lib personal attacks… Can’t go to long with out one of those. As for voting in MY country I’m going to vote for this countries best chance for survival. John flip flop, cut the military and homeland security budget Kerry did not offer the best protection for this country. The last time I checked my knowledge on the Bay of Pigs was not required for me to vote. You make no sense wreckeDless. Why don’t you and your “fearless” leaders in Belgium continue to do the ostrich and we’ll continue to prevent major terror attacks.

If you don’t agree with Iraq who really gives a fuck, what is your piece of shit little worthless country gonna do? Not support GWB, oooooh no, not that. My question was who we ever directly killed, not indirectly. Ok? Bay of Pigs was an indirect attack. U.S. forces (i.e. armed services) never attacked.

40

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
karva wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
karva wrote:
Ren wrote:
Putin is a plague on this world, he has pushed Russia back at least a decade.

I think we are all aware that China is the biggest human rights’ abuser in the world.

He has pushed the democratic development in Russia backward, not Russias economy. Russian middle class is now wealthier that it has ever been. You don’t see it there, but here in Finland and also elsewhere in Europe you can see it clearly. Russians like to travel and they have money to spend.

That’s not middle class. Middle class in a country like Russia would be people owning their own house and car. They wouldn’t travel abroad and spend their money there.
The people you’re talking about is upper class and organised crime flashing their drug money.

No, I mean middle class, middle middle to upper middle. There is much more going on in Russia than drugdealing. And yes, there are a lot of poor people, but Russian middle class is traveling more than ever before.

You mean they make the kind of money that would put the in upper middle class in Finland.
Trust me, they’re upper upper class in Russia.
Nouveau riche and organised crime.
There really is no middle class in Russia. There never is in countries like these.[/quote]

No, I don’t have any reasons to trust you in this matter. I’m not talking about percentages of population or income gaps. I’m talking about a group in society, the middle class; a house, a car and two children. Back in the days of communism they favoured the shores of the Black Sea. Today they come west.

From St. Petersburg one can make a weekend trip to Finland by bus or train, and vice versa. Russian customs is notoriously slow, though. A bussload of drugdealers and gangsters with their families, now that’s a sight. I see them so often that I harldy notice them.