[quote]Juan Blanco wrote:
pookie wrote:
There is a lot of weird reasoning from the anti-choice side.
Is there a Trader Joe’s in Quebec?
Oops! I forgot that you’re a LIAR. It’s no surprise that as a liar, you have no problems with the slaughter of children.
http://www.pregnantpause.org/racism/buchpers.htm
[/quote]
What exactly am I lying about?
[quote]pat36 wrote:
Hey, very well reasoned even for a french Canuck fucker…Yes, where to draw that line is the whole issue.
I error on the side of caution and draw it at conception, until it can be proven conclusivly that it occurs at some other point between conception and birth.[/quote]
At lot of people put the line there, and it’s ok. Like I said, it’s an arbitrary line, so we’re unlikely to reach a consensus that would please all parties.
I do wonder what, if anything, you propose we should do with those 1.3 million unwanted children that would be born each year if there were no abortion. Many from single parent families; from drug or alcohol abusing mothers, etc. Even those born to young healthy girls who are simply to immature to be good mothers… what do we do with the kids once they’re there? Giving them a chance at life is very honorable, but I’m not sure if the life of an unwanted child is something you’d like to have experienced personally.
Who knows? I don’t make the rules, that’s simply how nature works. Even if you lost an embryo, it wasn’t a person. It didn’t feel, didn’t think. There’s no reason to feel bad for it.
I’m pretty sure I got the first embryo both times, since my wife went off the pill and got pregnant the very next month. Both times.
[quote]derek wrote:
Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother’s health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby’s health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn’t want a child!
Now THAT’S fucking senseless and disgusting.
[/quote]
83,9234% of all internet statistics are made up on the spot.
[quote]orion wrote:
derek wrote:
Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother’s health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby’s health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn’t want a child!
Now THAT’S fucking senseless and disgusting.
83,9234% of all internet statistics are made up on the spot.[/quote]
+/- ,00023%
[quote]orion wrote:
derek wrote:
Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother’s health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby’s health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn’t want a child!
Now THAT’S fucking senseless and disgusting.
83,9234% of all internet statistics are made up on the spot.[/quote]
Are you saying over 89 thousand percent, 89 million percent or did you fuck up your joke by using a comma?
[quote]pookie wrote:
What exactly am I lying about?
[/quote]
Don’t worry about him. He’s just our newest psycho troll.
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Having sex does not mean consenting to getting, being, or remaining pregnant any more than driving a car means consenting to a car accident or eating food means consenting to choking.
[/quote]
What a terrible analogy.
Having sex exists solely to cause pregnancy, to reproduce. (we just happen to like it a lot)
Driving was not invented to cause crashing just as eating is not meant to cause choking.
Very poor analogy.
[quote]orion wrote:
derek wrote:
Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother’s health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby’s health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn’t want a child!
Now THAT’S fucking senseless and disgusting.
83,9234% of all internet statistics are made up on the spot.[/quote]
Really?
Why Do Women Have Abortions?
According to a 1988 article published in a journal by advocates of abortion, 93% of abortions are obtained for social reasons. Authors Aida Torres and Jacqueline Sarroch Forrest conducted a survey of 1900 women with 1,773 responding. They then compiled a table taken from the responses of the women surveyed, of the most important reason each woman had obtained an abortion. When the percentages are added together, 93% of abortions were obtained for social reasons which do NOT include abortions for hard-case pregnancies. Their own analysis showed that so-called hard cases were, at most, 7%. These include abortions for:
Rape or incest (1%)
Pregnancies which jeopardized health (3%)
Pregnancies in which the child had a potential disability (3%)
Reference: Torres, Aida and Jacqueline Sarroch Forrest, Family Planning Perspectives, Volume 20, Number 4, July/August 1988, p. 170.
Please note that the data comes from a publication of the Alan Guttmacher Institute, the research arm of Planned Parenthood, an abortion advocate group. Data presented in this and other tables may be biased in favor of abortion.
Made up? Sure, if that helps make your arguement.
[quote]brucevangeorge wrote:
pookie wrote:
What exactly am I lying about?
Don’t worry about him. He’s just our newest psycho troll.[/quote]
Yeah, just noticed his other threads.
[quote]derek wrote:
CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Having sex does not mean consenting to getting, being, or remaining pregnant any more than driving a car means consenting to a car accident or eating food means consenting to choking.
What a terrible analogy.
Having sex exists solely to cause pregnancy, to reproduce. (we just happen to like it a lot)
Driving was not invented to cause crashing just as eating is not meant to cause choking.
Very poor analogy.
[/quote]
I doubt you can hold this postion while admiting that you, yourself, have had sex for other reasons than to get a woman pregnant.
Sex can be fun. Sex can be an intimate expression of love between two people.
Yes, biologically speaking, the purpose of sex is to propagate the species. Yet there are other reasons people have sex, usually not to make babies.
The same way the purpose of eating is to keep us alive, yet people still eat because they like the taste of a certain food (having nothing to do with nourishment), or because they are bored, or to cope with stress, or a variety of other reasons.
Therefore, I disagree with your statement that sex exists “solely” for procreation.
[quote]pookie wrote:
…does anyone think we will ever get a Trader Joe’s or a Whole Foods in Columbia?
What exactly am I lying about?
[/quote]
How’s the weather up there in Canada?
[quote]John S. wrote:
So what your saying is the mothers right to chose is worth more then a baby’s life? What kind of monster are you. If your going to have sex you better be ready for the chance that a kid will be made. If a woman is raped, its sad it happened but if she doesn’t want the kid there’s adoption.[/quote]
Where are all the adoptive families for those kids?
According to this site: http://photolisting.adoption.com/ there are 100,000 children currently awaiting adoption in the US. You propose to add 1.3 million each year? I’d like to believe that your idea was a solution, but the demand for adoption is simply not there.
What do you do with all those children? Do you legislate forced adoption? Or do you accept to pay more taxes so that these children can have an acceptable level of comfort?
Does your concern for those kids end as soon as they pop out of the womb? Is the point simply to make sure they get a chance at life, no matter how miserable, sad and painful that life is?
As for “If your going to have sex you better be ready for the chance that a kid will be made,” the solution is easy and available. It’s called birth control.
[quote]derek wrote:
orion wrote:
derek wrote:
Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother’s health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby’s health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn’t want a child!
Now THAT’S fucking senseless and disgusting.
83,9234% of all internet statistics are made up on the spot.
Really?
Why Do Women Have Abortions?
According to a 1988 article published in a journal by advocates of abortion, 93% of abortions are obtained for social reasons. Authors Aida Torres and Jacqueline Sarroch Forrest conducted a survey of 1900 women with 1,773 responding. They then compiled a table taken from the responses of the women surveyed, of the most important reason each woman had obtained an abortion. When the percentages are added together, 93% of abortions were obtained for social reasons which do NOT include abortions for hard-case pregnancies. Their own analysis showed that so-called hard cases were, at most, 7%. These include abortions for:
Rape or incest (1%)
Pregnancies which jeopardized health (3%)
Pregnancies in which the child had a potential disability (3%)
Reference: Torres, Aida and Jacqueline Sarroch Forrest, Family Planning Perspectives, Volume 20, Number 4, July/August 1988, p. 170.
Please note that the data comes from a publication of the Alan Guttmacher Institute, the research arm of Planned Parenthood, an abortion advocate group. Data presented in this and other tables may be biased in favor of abortion.
Made up? Sure, if that helps make your arguement.
[/quote]
So, after taking a deep look into the souls of that women they decided that most of these women aborted for “social reasons”.
That sounds like “social smoking” or “social drinking”. Kind of casual.
Those women could also have said some BS to get those bitches of their ass after a rather traumatic experience.
People lie in statistics you know?
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Having sex exists solely to cause pregnancy, to reproduce. (we just happen to like it a lot)
I doubt you can hold this postion while admiting that you, yourself, have had sex for other reasons than to get a woman pregnant.
Sex can be fun. Sex can be an intimate expression of love between two people.
Yes, biologically speaking, the purpose of sex is to propagate the species. Yet there are other reasons people have sex, usually not to make babies.
The same way the purpose of eating is to keep us alive, yet people still eat because they like the taste of a certain food (having nothing to do with nourishment), or because they are bored, or to cope with stress, or a variety of other reasons.
Therefore, I disagree with your statement that sex exists “solely” for procreation.
[/quote]
Dude, do you read my posts before commenting on them?
You “doubt” I can hold this position; even AFTER I said, and I quote, “we just happen to like it a lot”
Of course I’ve had sex because I like it and not to reproduce. That was not the point at all (and I even alluded that it was not).
The point is that the only reason that intercourse exists is to reproduce. The fact that we now do it recreationally changes nothing. That does not change the sole reason for it’s existance.
Yes, eating is done to survive and we all do it recreationally as well. However, clearly the ORIGINAL purpose of eating is NOT choking. But the ORIGINAL reason for intercourse is reproduction, period.
The original purpose for driving is transportation and we also do it recreationally. It’s original purpose was certainly NOT crashing as you would have us believe.
Maybe a little evolutionary science study would help?
Intercourse = baby. Just as nature intended. NOT an accidental result.
Eating = choking. Opposite of what nature intended. A very accidental result.
Driving = crashing. Again, accidental result.
[quote]orion wrote:
derek wrote:
orion wrote:
derek wrote:
Ninety-three percent of the abortions in America are for convenience. The mother’s health is an issue only three percent of the time, and the baby’s health is an issue only three percent of the time. Rape or incest are issues only one percent of the time. Ninety-three percent of all abortions in America are performed just because someone doesn’t want a child!
Now THAT’S fucking senseless and disgusting.
83,9234% of all internet statistics are made up on the spot.
Really?
Why Do Women Have Abortions?
According to a 1988 article published in a journal by advocates of abortion, 93% of abortions are obtained for social reasons. Authors Aida Torres and Jacqueline Sarroch Forrest conducted a survey of 1900 women with 1,773 responding. They then compiled a table taken from the responses of the women surveyed, of the most important reason each woman had obtained an abortion. When the percentages are added together, 93% of abortions were obtained for social reasons which do NOT include abortions for hard-case pregnancies. Their own analysis showed that so-called hard cases were, at most, 7%. These include abortions for:
Rape or incest (1%)
Pregnancies which jeopardized health (3%)
Pregnancies in which the child had a potential disability (3%)
Reference: Torres, Aida and Jacqueline Sarroch Forrest, Family Planning Perspectives, Volume 20, Number 4, July/August 1988, p. 170.
Please note that the data comes from a publication of the Alan Guttmacher Institute, the research arm of Planned Parenthood, an abortion advocate group. Data presented in this and other tables may be biased in favor of abortion.
Made up? Sure, if that helps make your arguement.
So, after taking a deep look into the souls of that women they decided that most of these women aborted for “social reasons”.
That sounds like “social smoking” or “social drinking”. Kind of casual.
Those women could also have said some BS to get those bitches of their ass after a rather traumatic experience.
People lie in statistics you know?[/quote]
Yes, its so sickening that a woman would terminate a pregnance for “social reasons”.
Because “I need to finish school so I can get a decent job and support myself and my family” (social reason) is the same as “I just dont want it”
Or “I’m poor and don’t want to bring a child into a life of poverty” is the same as “I dont want to get fat”
I wonder if anyone is going to admit to playing “word games” by trivializing the reasons women get abortions by labeling them all “social reasons” and making it sound as though the pregnancy was just an inconveinence that would ruin their “social life” with their friends.
[quote]orion wrote:
So, after taking a deep look into the souls of that women they decided that most of these women aborted for “social reasons”.
That sounds like “social smoking” or “social drinking”. Kind of casual.
Those women could also have said some BS to get those bitches of their ass after a rather traumatic experience.
People lie in statistics you know?
[/quote]
Did you see who produced those figures? An agency that practically promotes abortion. They’ve got everything to lose with those stats they printed.
So you either believe they made up the very statistics which put themselves in a bad light or the women lied in order to make themselves look like uncaring baby killers.
Great logic there orion.
Makes sense to me!
[quote]pookie wrote:
Does your concern for those kids end as soon as they pop out of the womb? Is the point simply to make sure they get a chance at life, no matter how miserable, sad and painful that life is?
[/quote]
Who’s deciding that the children will all lead miserable, sad and painful lives if someone had allowed them to live, you?
That’s pretty damn presumtuous of you.
Every girl I know that had an abortion was at the very LEAST middle class with good families. I know that’s not the case with every child but how can anyone predict that a child will lead such a life?
Shall we even get into all the great people that were born into very tough circumstances yet made one heck of a life for themselves?
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Yes, its so sickening that a woman would terminate a pregnance for “social reasons”.
Because “I need to finish school so I can get a decent job and support myself and my family” (social reason) is the same as “I just dont want it”
Or “I’m poor and don’t want to bring a child into a life of poverty” is the same as “I dont want to get fat”
I wonder if anyone is going to admit to playing “word games” by trivializing the reasons women get abortions by labeling them all “social reasons” and making it sound as though the pregnancy was just an inconveinence that would ruin their “social life” with their friends.[/quote]
Finish school? Poverty? Give me a break. You think those are good reasons to kill an unborn baby? Get your head screwed on straight, would ya?
Yeah no one has ever survived THOSE odds huh?
[quote]derek wrote:
CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Having sex exists solely to cause pregnancy, to reproduce. (we just happen to like it a lot)
I doubt you can hold this postion while admiting that you, yourself, have had sex for other reasons than to get a woman pregnant.
Sex can be fun. Sex can be an intimate expression of love between two people.
Yes, biologically speaking, the purpose of sex is to propagate the species. Yet there are other reasons people have sex, usually not to make babies.
The same way the purpose of eating is to keep us alive, yet people still eat because they like the taste of a certain food (having nothing to do with nourishment), or because they are bored, or to cope with stress, or a variety of other reasons.
Therefore, I disagree with your statement that sex exists “solely” for procreation.
Dude, do you read my posts before commenting on them?
You “doubt” I can hold this position; even AFTER I said, and I quote, “we just happen to like it a lot”
Of course I’ve had sex because I like it and not to reproduce. That was not the point at all (and I even alluded that it was not).
The point is that the only reason that intercourse exists is to reproduce. The fact that we now do it recreationally changes nothing. That does not change the sole reason for it’s existance.
Yes, eating is done to survive and we all do it recreationally as well. However, clearly the ORIGINAL purpose of eating is NOT choking. But the ORIGINAL reason for intercourse is reproduction, period.
The original purpose for driving is transportation and we also do it recreationally. It’s original purpose was certainly NOT crashing as you would have us believe.
Maybe a little evolutionary science study would help?
Intercourse = baby. Just as nature intended. NOT an accidental result.
Eating = choking. Opposite of what nature intended. A very accidental result.
Driving = crashing. Again, accidental result.[/quote]
You’re completely ignoring the context of the situation. When people have sex and are hoping for it to NOT result in a pregnancy then the pregnancy becomes an accidental result.
Fucking without trying to make a baby = makes a baby. Accidental result given the context (not just the biological function) of the activity.
To return to the driving analogy, I see a parallel between that and a driver of a demolition car missing another car being an accident.
Whereas normally: driving without intent to hit another car = hitting another car is an accidental result
Within the context of a demolition derby: driving with intent to hit another car = not hitting another car is an accidental result.
[quote]derek wrote:
CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Yes, its so sickening that a woman would terminate a pregnance for “social reasons”.
Because “I need to finish school so I can get a decent job and support myself and my family” (social reason) is the same as “I just dont want it”
Or “I’m poor and don’t want to bring a child into a life of poverty” is the same as “I dont want to get fat”
I wonder if anyone is going to admit to playing “word games” by trivializing the reasons women get abortions by labeling them all “social reasons” and making it sound as though the pregnancy was just an inconveinence that would ruin their “social life” with their friends.
Finish school? Poverty? Give me a break. You think those are good reasons to kill an unborn baby? Get your head screwed on straight, would ya?
Yeah no one has ever survived THOSE odds huh?
[/quote]
Thats a very pretty ivory tower you live in.