[quote]ZEB wrote:
Comparing US military spending to China’s? Do you understand the difference between China and the US?
[/quote]
China buys up half of Africa, has practically a monopoly on rare earths that they have stamped out of the ground and invest heavily into infrastructure, building a mid sized US city every month or so whereas the US, um, break things and make lots of enemies?
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
And why is not pointing out that the USA’s vast defense spending outstrips your nearest rival by nearly six times not a valid argument when we are talking about overspending?[/quote]
Because the USA keeps the bad guys at bay. Got it kid? What does China do with their military? [/quote]
Dunno, trying to defend their country instead of meddling into other peoples affairs?
And lo and behold, noone travels to China just to blow things up.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Sadly, it will take tax hikes to help clean up this mess.[/quote]
Tell me one time in the past 40 years where raising taxes cleaned up a mess? When they take your money they find new places to spend it. There is enough cuts to make in our incredibly bloated government where we don’t need new taxes. [/quote]
You’ll never see significant cuts without tax hikes. The GoP should absolutely give up on taxes in return for fundamental reform of entitlements. Reform that will them make them sound into the distant future. When we’re in a good place again, review tax rates. In the meantime, the reform for unsustainable entitlements will be on the books. For now, the GoP needs to mount an “everyone needs to sacrifice” campaign. You’re not going to convince the public that the deficit is so serious, that a chainsaw should be taken to their programs (well, except the military)…but oh, tax hikes are off the table.
What you envision would take a one party government and a docile public. Not happening. No one is going to buy that we’re in dire straits, yet the military is untouchable and tax raises aren’t required. The GoP will have to convince enough of the public that this is serious. That everyone will have to sacrifice if that’s what it takes to get this done and over with. Tax the rich AND the middle-class (since, realistically, taxing the rich alone doesn’t cut it). Tax them and watch support for entitlement reform grow.
well the problem is mainly the entitlement spending…that represents a little over 2 trillion of our 4 trillion expenditure this year…
I assume the UK has a similar problem with the skewed age demographics…
the majority of births in the US occured after world war 2…twice as many children were born relative to the size of their parent’s generation…these people in the US are reffered to as baby boomers…
Once waves of the baby boomer generation start hitting the entitlement age limit, they will create twice as many obligations as their parents…the majority of these people are very close to hitting that limit…
we are already close to taking in less social security tax revenue then we are paying out…the system was supposed to be a pay as you go system where the younger generation fully funded the older generation, but it has become unsustainable in the long term…
in the past, surplus funds were invested in a trust fund in case this situation occured…the trust fund currently has 2 trillion of svaings in it…However, those savings are not cash - but rather Treasury obligations…those treasury obligations are absolutely illusionary…the treasuery will have to issue public debt to cover those obligations…so, we don’t really have a trust fund to liquidate…
As stated in another thread, the misallocation of capital into these entitlement programs, worthless government projects, and the banking system(effectively funding massive bonuses to create bad loans and what not)…has caused the current economic crisis…
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
Comparing US military spending to China’s? Do you understand the difference between China and the US?
[/quote]
China buys up half of Africa, has practically a monopoly on rare earths that they have stamped out of the ground and invest heavily into infrastructure, building a mid sized US city every month or so whereas the US, um, break things and make lots of enemies?
[/quote]
Orion, this warmongering neocon just doesn’t get it. He still naively believes in the hilarious delusion that “they hate us for our freedoms” and that somehow the US military is acting in “defense” when of course it is actually imperialist. He’s just VERY slow to grasp reality on this.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
And why is not pointing out that the USA’s vast defense spending outstrips your nearest rival by nearly six times not a valid argument when we are talking about overspending?[/quote]
Because the USA keeps the bad guys at bay. Got it kid? What does China do with their military? Stop asking questions that you should have learned two years ago when you were in High School.[/quote]
Grade AAA Bullshit
The US acts in its own interests alone. It is, as I have said, the opposite of altruistic. It creates as many bad guys as it destroys. It has been more than happy to prop its share of bad guys and often has turned a blind eye to their habits, only turning against them when all other avenues have been lost, and sometimes not even then. I have no illusions about China’s military but at least they don’t pull this Team America schtick out.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Sadly, it will take tax hikes to help clean up this mess.[/quote]
Tell me one time in the past 40 years where raising taxes cleaned up a mess? When they take your money they find new places to spend it. There is enough cuts to make in our incredibly bloated government where we don’t need new taxes. [/quote]
You’ll never see significant cuts without tax hikes. The GoP should absolutely give up on taxes in return for fundamental reform of entitlements. Reform that will them make them sound into the distant future. When we’re in a good place again, review tax rates. In the meantime, the reform for unsustainable entitlements will be on the books. For now, the GoP needs to mount an “everyone needs to sacrifice” campaign. You’re not going to convince the public that the deficit is so serious, that a chainsaw should be taken to their programs (well, except the military)…but oh, tax hikes are off the table.
What you envision would take a one party government and a docile public. Not happening. No one is going to buy that we’re in dire straits, yet the military is untouchable and tax raises aren’t required. The GoP will have to convince enough of the public that this is serious. That everyone will have to sacrifice if that’s what it takes to get this done and over with. Tax the rich AND the middle-class (since, realistically, taxing the rich alone doesn’t cut it). Tax them and watch support for entitlement reform grow.[/quote]
That all seems rather sensible. It’ll never happen.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Sadly, it will take tax hikes to help clean up this mess.[/quote]
Tell me one time in the past 40 years where raising taxes cleaned up a mess? When they take your money they find new places to spend it. There is enough cuts to make in our incredibly bloated government where we don’t need new taxes. [/quote]
You’ll never see significant cuts without tax hikes. The GoP should absolutely give up on taxes in return for fundamental reform of entitlements. Reform that will them make them sound into the distant future. When we’re in a good place again, review tax rates. In the meantime, the reform for unsustainable entitlements will be on the books. For now, the GoP needs to mount an “everyone needs to sacrifice” campaign. You’re not going to convince the public that the deficit is so serious, that a chainsaw should be taken to their programs (well, except the military)…but oh, tax hikes are off the table.
What you envision would take a one party government and a docile public. Not happening. No one is going to buy that we’re in dire straits, yet the military is untouchable and tax raises aren’t required. The GoP will have to convince enough of the public that this is serious. That everyone will have to sacrifice if that’s what it takes to get this done and over with. Tax the rich AND the middle-class (since, realistically, taxing the rich alone doesn’t cut it). Tax them and watch support for entitlement reform grow.[/quote]
If taxes are raised at this point in time we will fall into another deep recession. If you take money out of the hands of those who move the economy, and you also tax the middle class (Which as you said must be done as there are not enough rich people) we will be in very dire shape.
Also, regarding slashing programs, most people think that it’s a fine idea, until it is their program that gets the axe and then whomever was responsible is a bad guy. I don’t see the GOP winning with that strategy. As you know, in the end people are quite fickle.
[quote]Bambi wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
And why is not pointing out that the USA’s vast defense spending outstrips your nearest rival by nearly six times not a valid argument when we are talking about overspending?[/quote]
Because the USA keeps the bad guys at bay. Got it kid? What does China do with their military? Stop asking questions that you should have learned two years ago when you were in High School.[/quote]
Grade AAA Bullshit
The US acts in its own interests alone. It is, as I have said, the opposite of altruistic. It creates as many bad guys as it destroys. It has been more than happy to prop its share of bad guys and often has turned a blind eye to their habits, only turning against them when all other avenues have been lost, and sometimes not even then. I have no illusions about China’s military but at least they don’t pull this Team America schtick out. [/quote]
Yes, I know, given your age and the fact that you are not an American you say crap like this. I’ll just remind you of who saved the world …HOW MANY TIMES?
[quote]cloakmanor wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
Comparing US military spending to China’s? Do you understand the difference between China and the US?
[/quote]
China buys up half of Africa, has practically a monopoly on rare earths that they have stamped out of the ground and invest heavily into infrastructure, building a mid sized US city every month or so whereas the US, um, break things and make lots of enemies?
[/quote]
Orion, this warmongering neocon just doesn’t get it. He still naively believes in the hilarious delusion that “they hate us for our freedoms” and that somehow the US military is acting in “defense” when of course it is actually imperialist. He’s just VERY slow to grasp reality on this.[/quote]
And when it comes to truly understanding foreign affairs and appreciating the history of the USA you are just slow.
Sorry, but if you don’t understand your weakness how can you expect to improve?
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
And why is not pointing out that the USA’s vast defense spending outstrips your nearest rival by nearly six times not a valid argument when we are talking about overspending?[/quote]
Because the USA keeps the bad guys at bay. Got it kid? What does China do with their military? Stop asking questions that you should have learned two years ago when you were in High School.[/quote]
Grade AAA Bullshit
The US acts in its own interests alone. It is, as I have said, the opposite of altruistic. It creates as many bad guys as it destroys. It has been more than happy to prop its share of bad guys and often has turned a blind eye to their habits, only turning against them when all other avenues have been lost, and sometimes not even then. I have no illusions about China’s military but at least they don’t pull this Team America schtick out. [/quote]
Yes, I know, given your age and the fact that you are not an American you say crap like this. I’ll just remind you of who saved the world …HOW MANY TIMES?
[/quote]
Do you see your illogicality? If The USA had ‘saved the world’, as you so put it, wouldn’t I be more inclined to agree with you? If your actions had genuinely brought peace and goodwill to all nations, surely we’d be beating a path to your door to say thanks? If your actions had saved the world then why are they held in contempt (not saying this is my point of view) by many? The USA ‘saved the world’ FOR ITSELF AND ITS OWN INTERESTS. Not for anyone else. Not for the world. For itself. Congratulations. Your unshakeable belief in the powers of US foreign policy has just proven my point
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
And why is not pointing out that the USA’s vast defense spending outstrips your nearest rival by nearly six times not a valid argument when we are talking about overspending?[/quote]
Because the USA keeps the bad guys at bay. Got it kid? What does China do with their military? Stop asking questions that you should have learned two years ago when you were in High School.[/quote]
Grade AAA Bullshit
The US acts in its own interests alone. It is, as I have said, the opposite of altruistic. It creates as many bad guys as it destroys. It has been more than happy to prop its share of bad guys and often has turned a blind eye to their habits, only turning against them when all other avenues have been lost, and sometimes not even then. I have no illusions about China’s military but at least they don’t pull this Team America schtick out. [/quote]
Yes, I know, given your age and the fact that you are not an American you say crap like this. I’ll just remind you of who saved the world …HOW MANY TIMES?
[/quote]
Um, zero times?
But keep the hubris coming, it is certainly entertaining.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
If taxes are raised at this point in time we will fall into another deep recession…[/quote]
Ok, no tax raises.
Ok, no large cuts.
Then you’d support who? He’s not going to raise taxes or slash entitlements? Or, more realistically, both?
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Then you’d support who? He’s not going to raise taxes or slash entitlements? Or, more realistically, both?
[/quote]
There will be plenty of those.
He just has to pick one.
And blame liberals/homosexuals/whatever when the US goes over the brink.
[quote]Bambi wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Sadly, it will take tax hikes to help clean up this mess.[/quote]
Tell me one time in the past 40 years where raising taxes cleaned up a mess? When they take your money they find new places to spend it. There is enough cuts to make in our incredibly bloated government where we don’t need new taxes. [/quote]
You’ll never see significant cuts without tax hikes. The GoP should absolutely give up on taxes in return for fundamental reform of entitlements. Reform that will them make them sound into the distant future. When we’re in a good place again, review tax rates. In the meantime, the reform for unsustainable entitlements will be on the books. For now, the GoP needs to mount an “everyone needs to sacrifice” campaign. You’re not going to convince the public that the deficit is so serious, that a chainsaw should be taken to their programs (well, except the military)…but oh, tax hikes are off the table.
What you envision would take a one party government and a docile public. Not happening. No one is going to buy that we’re in dire straits, yet the military is untouchable and tax raises aren’t required. The GoP will have to convince enough of the public that this is serious. That everyone will have to sacrifice if that’s what it takes to get this done and over with. Tax the rich AND the middle-class (since, realistically, taxing the rich alone doesn’t cut it). Tax them and watch support for entitlement reform grow.[/quote]
That all seems rather sensible. It’ll never happen.[/quote]
yep
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
And why is not pointing out that the USA’s vast defense spending outstrips your nearest rival by nearly six times not a valid argument when we are talking about overspending?[/quote]
Because the USA keeps the bad guys at bay. Got it kid? What does China do with their military? Stop asking questions that you should have learned two years ago when you were in High School.[/quote]
Grade AAA Bullshit
The US acts in its own interests alone. It is, as I have said, the opposite of altruistic. It creates as many bad guys as it destroys. It has been more than happy to prop its share of bad guys and often has turned a blind eye to their habits, only turning against them when all other avenues have been lost, and sometimes not even then. I have no illusions about China’s military but at least they don’t pull this Team America schtick out. [/quote]
Yes, I know, given your age and the fact that you are not an American you say crap like this. I’ll just remind you of who saved the world …HOW MANY TIMES?
[/quote]
Um, zero times?
But keep the hubris coming, it is certainly entertaining.
[/quote]
If it were not for the US Austria would be part of Germany. And you would be kneeling in front of a photo of Adolph Hitler every morning.
Do some reading.
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]Sloth wrote:
Then you’d support who? He’s not going to raise taxes or slash entitlements? Or, more realistically, both?
[/quote]
There will be plenty of those.
He just has to pick one.
And blame liberals/homosexuals/whatever when the US goes over the brink.[/quote]
The finer points of American politics go straight over your little austrian head. So I won’t bother to explain. Just try to keep up by doing more reading than posting.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Jewbacca wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
First of all we are not even in a recession, so depression talk is premature. [/quote]
Offically, sure. But they are re-computing and all the private companies (who are usually more accurate) say we are in a double-dip.[/quote]
As I explained, anyone can say anything but there are ways to measure a recession. And we are most assuredly NOT in one right now. [/quote]
You can tout the official definitions all you want. The outlook is bleak and there has been no real recovery. The only reason the numbers aren’t indicating a recession is because GDP is an inherently flawed statistic. If you look at something like private sector employment(something I am sure we can both agree is very important) it paints quite a different picture than the official GDP numbers.
[quote]Sloth wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
If taxes are raised at this point in time we will fall into another deep recession…[/quote]
Ok, no tax raises.
Ok, no large cuts.
Then you’d support who? He’s not going to raise taxes or slash entitlements? Or, more realistically, both?
[/quote]
No one can “slash” entitlements. Furthemore, no one will want to. What you do with entitlements is use finessse. Cut a tiny bit here and there. Raise the age of retirement. Things like that. People will accept this. Sort of like giving them their medicine with a little sugar. A good politician can do this, obviously it’s not Obama.
And raising taxes is just a flat out dumb idea. It will trash this economy. Instead you grow the tax base by lowering taxes which will create more jobs you know almost 70% of all jobs are created by small business.
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]orion wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
[quote]ZEB wrote:
[quote]Bambi wrote:
And why is not pointing out that the USA’s vast defense spending outstrips your nearest rival by nearly six times not a valid argument when we are talking about overspending?[/quote]
Because the USA keeps the bad guys at bay. Got it kid? What does China do with their military? Stop asking questions that you should have learned two years ago when you were in High School.[/quote]
Grade AAA Bullshit
The US acts in its own interests alone. It is, as I have said, the opposite of altruistic. It creates as many bad guys as it destroys. It has been more than happy to prop its share of bad guys and often has turned a blind eye to their habits, only turning against them when all other avenues have been lost, and sometimes not even then. I have no illusions about China’s military but at least they don’t pull this Team America schtick out. [/quote]
Yes, I know, given your age and the fact that you are not an American you say crap like this. I’ll just remind you of who saved the world …HOW MANY TIMES?
[/quote]
Um, zero times?
But keep the hubris coming, it is certainly entertaining.
[/quote]
If it were not for the US Austria would be part of Germany. And you would be kneeling in front of a photo of Adolph Hitler every morning.
Do some reading.
[/quote]
So?
If it were not for the US there would have been no Hitler.
Also, Austria < THE WORLD !!!11!!!